StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Or to more precise. if you design something like a ship(both terrestial or spaceship), tank or base and want draw. How do that?

Do you draw the outside first then hope that inside does match?

I tend to first draw a side cut out of the insides with the shape of the final thing drawn into it.

For me:
-First step: think of the function of the whole thing
-Second step: design the interior while remembering the function
-Third step: design the exterior around the interior

Melchior wrote:For me:
-First step: think of the function of the whole thing
-Second step: design the interior while remembering the function
-Third step: design the exterior around the interior

so you draw basically the same way as I do,(though I may rethink the function when I draw the ship.)

I try to keep in mind a logical placement of systems... I tend to install large banks of weapon turrets rather than having them haphazardly spaced out, put any "windows" (living spaces, I guess) well away from other vital ship systems, and overall just try to imagine a nice hefty frame that runs inside the core of the ship, providing skeletal support for the outer "skin".

I also don't do stupid things like placing a heavy turret right on an engine bell, or right next to a primary sensor tower.

Depends. When bored I just make a haphazard sketch and think of the function/weapons as I go.

However, if I get a good spark of imagination, I'll do a detailed sketch with arrows explaining everything, then do a more detailed version without the arrows, then the interior.

I usually come up with the purpose, then design the shape to fit that purpose. The inside is always last because I can make the inside fit the exterior very easily. Watch this: "All that unsightly wasted space is where the ..uh.. FTL engines are. And the waste recycling. And the sexeteria. Ship's all full now."

I tend to start with a general concept of shape and purpose, then throw in the engines (for a starship) and reactor w/ fuel. If there's big guns they go next. On a carrier, all launch and maintance systems go next. On a smaller-capacity ship, docking systems or a small shuttle hanger could wait a bit. Tiny PD turrets and sensors are probably the absolute last.

Hmm...haven't done that in a while.

I start with a general concept: what does this ship do, and how does it do it within the technological limitations of the society that built it? Military ships typically only have one or two primary roles, and the entire ship will be designed around that.

So a battleship, for example, is designed essentially to be a firing platform for heavy artillery, and I'll figure out roughly how that artillery works, what kind of support systems does it need, that kind of thing, and then use that as the base for the design. The one trap I try to avoid is the model ship mentality, where all you need to do, to increase the ship's firepower, is to glue on another turret. Every single exterior feature corresponds to some internal structure, and even on huge ships, you run out of space fast. There's usually enough surface area on my ships to place twice as many gun turrets as I do, but there'd be no room for their internal components.

Once you have that done, then you figure out how to move the damn thing. The engines and their auxillary systems take up huge amounts of space. Again, you don't need to get into the specifics of how they work, but you have to remember they need internal space. By the time I have the engines and weapons in place, most of the ship is designed for me. Everything else gets filled in whatever open space I have left, which isn't very much.

What's REALLY helped me is going on tours of real-life battleships, U.S.S. North Carolina and U.S.S. New Jersey, and actually getting a feel for how real ships are designd. Forget everything Star Wars and Star Trek taught you. Those gigantic ships are cramped even with just tour groups on board, and there's equipment EVERYWHERE. The guts of the ship are sticking out all over the place. The only places that looked remotely civilian were the captain and admiral's spaces. Even the senior officers had to share cabins with each other. The turrets took up an enormous amount of interior space in the hull--they ran down all the way to the keel, and inside they were just stacked full of shells and equipment for getting the shells and powder bags to the guns. Inside the actual topside structure of the turret is even more claustrophobic, and you actually have to climb over equipment to get to most of the stations. The engine spaces were big, but slam full of...well, the engines, and everything that was needed to make them go. The only big open space inside the ship was the enlisted mess, and it was maybe half the size of my high school cafeteria.

And if a battleship isn't crowded enough for you, try a WWII diesel submarine, which is really a better analogy to what a space warship would be like. The interiors of my ships are based on that experience, minus a few open spaces for crews to get exercise and relieve the claustrophobia and just get some space between themselves and other people for a while. And even they serve dual roles--the basketball court is adjacent to the sickbay, and is an emergency triage bay during battle if sickbay overflows; the observation lounge is a cargo sorting bay.

I like doing indoor scenes, so I usually sketch those out first. A few of those helps me form a concrete idea of where I want to go with interior layout. Once I have a rough idea of how the work and living spaces take shape and interact, then I try a few hull arrangements. I hate to say it, but I probably lean towards what's aesthetically pleasing.

There are usually 2 ways I approach making a ship, form then function or function then form. BY that I mean I will sometimes just doodle away until an interesting shape or idea takes my fancy and then I stop and think to myself "what role does this shape lend itself too?" If it looks very much like a fighter then I begin to add fighter elements in the best places and fill out the details and shape until complete.

The other way (function then form) is to think of what I want to make and then create something to do just that. I look at how it's been done before, how it's done now and try to find out the reasons behind the designs that are in use.

Take a battleship for instance, as mentioned they are basically a floating armoured battery of heavy guns. The guns are mounted fore and aft to provide some fire cover in all directions, but are designed to allow them to fire all main guns in a broadside at the enemy as the main tactic. The upper turrets are superfiring (over the other turret) to save some space and still allow large guns, the ship is narrow enough to allow a good top speed but not so narrow as keel over when the broadside is fired. The sensors are mounted high to give the best visibility, the hull is armoured and compartmentalised to prevent sinking from shell hits, particularly at and below the waterline. With the right combination of firepower, armour and speed you have a good looking ship that works well, as form follows function.

Do the same with your own designs, figure out what you want it to do and look at how best to do it. Once you have that, build the rest of the ship around it so that it's able to do that job as best it can, and as if you had to live on the thing yourself. As RedImperator pointed out, military ships tend to be cramped affairs, and probably always will be despite increases in power and miniaturisation. If you could build a subs reactor half the size that gave the same power, the military would fit two and get twice the power and reliability. Same for weapons, if you made a powerful laser half the size of a ships main gun, they'd make one twice as large and twice as powerful and stick it in the same space as before. Keep that in mind and you wont go far wrong.

How do you deal with windows, ensignia or symbols. I normaly don't draw these unless I have to (most of my ST UFP designs don't have name or registry number visible any were on the hull).

I try and make it look as futuristic and advanced as possible. Elegantly crafting the exterior as if it were a piece of modern art. then I design the interior based on that, because the better looking the ship is the more advanced it is. Elegant swooping wings, transformable systems, and the possibility for detatchable portions.