Photon grenades and Fed Tanks??

[Uraniun235]

I mean, the very image of them zapping "helpless" people (theoretically landlocked, even if the planet is aerospace-capable) from space... that can't be good for your standing!

However, with this hypothetical besieged planet, Starfleet can tightly control the information that comes out of it - even moreso if they don't land troops on it. Ship to home communications can be tightly censored, and communications from the planet can be jammed. Furthermore, any civilian ships straying near the combat zone in hopes of picking up a scoop can be intercepted and detained, and their captains charged with failure to file a flight plan. (as established in TOS Mudd's Women)

The truth won't come out until after the war, and at that point I'm sure an adept politician could whip up some other minor crisis to distract the public attention until they forget about it.

Besides, it's not like they're going to be incinerating the cities and civilians en masse; just the major space-capable military resources.

[Edward Yee]

So much for the moral authority... (Which I assume is a paramount of Federation-specific Trekkies.)

[NecronLord]

Are gigawatt figures for phasers valid? I've never actually done the math for them, and I'm quite sure they work by CR and not DET.

This is the kind of thing that happens when you set off gigajoule range weapons in sci-fi. Note how it relates to the thirty meter wide ship. Additionally, Data states the yeild of a phaser rifle. It's under two 'megawatts per second' which is Data-speak for megawatts and is, despite what it seems, not a rate of change.

[NecronLord]

On the phasor issue, if phasors are so all powerful that they "vaporize" virtually anything as some trekkies claim, then why aren't ships "vaporized" upon getting hit after their shields fail?

Incidentally, this happened to a klingon starship at least once in TOS, so we know it to be possible.

[brianeyci]

It may not be possible in the TNG+ period. Given we've seen so much fighting in DS9 and no total vaporization... even in TWOK, there wasn't total vaporization by the phasers, so maybe by then these anti-phaser hulls were already in use.

Brian

[NecronLord]

Indeed. Some materials resist phasorisation. It's possible that ship hulls are alloyed with them. Though I will point out that a borg disruptor phasorises a big hole in a ship in Emissary.

[Bounty]

Not just a big hole, most of the saucer was simply gone.

Pic
Pic

[brianeyci]

I am aware of instances of partially phasorized hulls. My particular favourite is this the one where a Miranda's saucer section gets phasorized, and as the Miranda heads towards the television screen the effect continues eating away the saucer section.

We never see a whole ship phasorized like in TOS though.

<edit>Oh the Borg firepower isn't inconsistent. They had Picard so they knew how to lower the ship's shields, and it's not like the Enterprise-D succumbed to one hit like the Oberth? in Emissary, so it's possible the two ships are made of different hull materials anyway. Oberth is a science vessel anyway.</edit>

Brian

[Bounty]

My particular favourite is this the one where a Miranda's saucer section gets phasorized, and as the Miranda heads towards the television screen the effect continues eating away the saucer section.

The Majestic ?

[Uraniun235]

<edit>Oh the Borg firepower isn't inconsistent. They had Picard so they knew how to lower the ship's shields, and it's not like the Enterprise-D succumbed to one hit like the Oberth? in Emissary, so it's possible the two ships are made of different hull materials anyway. Oberth is a science vessel anyway.</edit>

what?

The scene from Emissary shows an Excelsior class getting phasorized.

As for that Miranda, that was from one of the retarded DS9 battles.

[Ted C]

Their counter argument is that if other AQ powers have tanks or ground vehicles and that the Federation has beaten them in war, the Federation must have tanks.

Since when has the Federation beaten a rival AQ power in a war?

The war with the Romulans was essentially a standoff, and the Federation conceeded the right to ever develop cloaking technology to get that.

The actual outcome of the Cardassian war is unclear, but the Federation ceded substantial amounts of territory to the Cardassians to get peace terms, and the Cardassians continued to behave aggressively.

The peace with the Klingons was largely a point of honor for the Enteprise-C attempting to defend a Klingon outpost against a Romulan attack; in an alternate timeline, the Federation was steadily losing to the Klingons.

The Federation needed the help of the Klingons and Romulans to hold back the Dominion, and that war was essentially only won because the "Prophets" intervened to block Dominion reinforcements.

The outcomes of the Federation wars with the Tholians and Talarians aren't really known, but we know the Federation enjoys a massive naval advantage over the Talarians, at least.

Using the Federation's "past victories" to support claims of substantial surface forces is completely unjustified.

[Augustus Caesar]

Since when has the Federation beaten a rival AQ power in a war?

The war with the Romulans was essentially a standoff, and the Federation conceeded the right to ever develop cloaking technology to get that.

The actual outcome of the Cardassian war is unclear, but the Federation ceded substantial amounts of territory to the Cardassians to get peace terms, and the Cardassians continued to behave aggressively.

The peace with the Klingons was largely a point of honor for the Enteprise-C attempting to defend a Klingon outpost against a Romulan attack; in an alternate timeline, the Federation was steadily losing to the Klingons.

The Federation needed the help of the Klingons and Romulans to hold back the Dominion, and that war was essentially only won because the "Prophets" intervened to block Dominion reinforcements.

The outcomes of the Federation wars with the Tholians and Talarians aren't really known, but we know the Federation enjoys a massive naval advantage over the Talarians, at least.

Using the Federation's "past victories" to support claims of substantial surface forces is completely unjustified.

So I take it the Federation is somewhat like the space equivalent of Athens in an AQ Greece?

[Edward Yee]

Well, that almost certainly is the intended ideal...