Moderator: Vympel
”EnterpriseSovereign”
”Batman”
”Crazedwraith”
Sooooo, one episode left.“Bilateralrope”
TBH I don't see how they can wrap this up satisfyingly in one episode. I've also heard John DeLancie is in season 3 and it was filmed at the same time as 2. So I'm not putting some kind of cliff hanger or Q induced open ending happening beyond it.
Let’s hope so…Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2022-05-02 01:09pmTBH I don't see how they can wrap this up satisfyingly in one episode. I've also heard John DeLancie is in season 3 and it was filmed at the same time as 2. So I'm not putting some kind of cliff hanger or Q induced open ending happening beyond it.
I thought last season saved itself with a relatively strong ending (a new Soong and Picard's death/android rebirth withstanding) but I'm leaning towards eye rolling for this one. Talking Q around with the power of love maybe?
For all Picard has talked about the Prime Directive in his past, he's not going to say anything about Tallinn or whoever she works for meddling with humanity. Nor will we get any information about who those watchers are or what happened to them after the Federation formed.
Maybe it’s a personality thing? The “old” Renee dies while the new inspired one takes flight?bilateralrope wrote: ↑2022-05-03 07:59amFor all Picard has talked about the Prime Directive in his past, he's not going to say anything about Tallinn or whoever she works for meddling with humanity. Nor will we get any information about who those watchers are or what happened to them after the Federation formed.
Tallinn might disguise herself as Renée to be the one who dies. Or we will get some nonsense explanation of that line.
Soong will get come upance. At least one renee will complete the europa mission. Teresa and her son will go full Gillian Taylor and be taken bak to the future.
If that's what happens, then the line has no importance.
The options for them returning themselves to the future are limited. Q has lost his powers. Their ship is gone. Tallinn doesn't appear to have a ship and, even if she did, there is still the problem of navigating time travel.Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2022-05-03 01:29pm Extreme outside chance that they all stay in the past and we get hit with the downer ending of continuity: and hear how they all horribly died in wwiii not long after. (When was WWIII?)
bilateralrope wrote: ↑2022-05-04 12:19am The options for them returning themselves to the future are limited. Q has lost his powers. Their ship is gone. Tallinn doesn't appear to have a ship and, even if she did, there is still the problem of navigating time travel.
I only see two options:
- Someone disables the aging algorithm in Picard's body so that he can survive the centuries while hidden away somewhere.
- They leave a message with Guinan. The Federation believes her message when she finally delivers it.
”EnterpriseSovereign”
”Batman”
”Crazedwraith”
Annnnnnd... it more or less ends as a mashup of what we expected:“Bilateralrope”
With the detail of Weasley using what looks like a typical transporter, instead of the fog-transporter effect. So that's one more question I have about them.
Yeah. I'm not buying that the trauma went unresolved for so long. I doubt his mothers suicide went unrecorded by the authorities* and something like that should have come up in whatever psychological evaluation the academy performs on cadets. Then there are his decades in Starfleet encountering various telepaths. Including Troi.The idea that Picard never had a real love life because he had secret mommy traumaz as a child all along is rather absurd. That's not to say that childhood traumas can't cause life long issues of course; but apart from his decision to pursue his relationship with Laris it changes very little about him.
The lack of explicit WWIII reference really pissed me off. Elephant in the room unaddressed.
There's some confusion as to whether the Eugenics Wars were actually part of WWIII since they had to do a retcon when the original date passed.I didn't recognise him until he said he was Wesley. I've barely watched anything he did since TNG.
How ?EnterpriseSovereign wrote: ↑2022-05-06 11:41pm Rios didn't have to stay in the past, he could have brought the good doctor and her son with him to the future,
The first episode of Strange New Worlds clarifies that point.There's some confusion as to whether the Eugenics Wars were actually part of WWIII since they had to do a retcon when the original date passed.
He's been in Big Bang Theory (playing himself) so I recognised him immediately, at least it reveals exactly what he did after he left the Enterprise with the Traveller and his part in protecting Renée Picard.I didn't recognise him until he said he was Wesley. I've barely watched anything he did since TNG.
Is that what Q meant? I didn't pick that up, though I'm sure the writers could still have made that work.They were all preparing to live in the past until Q offered them a way back to their time. A way he said would kill him. Even if Q was lying about that, convincing him to bring along two extra people seems unlikely.
SNW doesn't come to the UK until late next month, and I'm not going to sign up to another streaming service for just one showThe first episode of Strange New Worlds clarifies that point.
Like Robert Picard, Q Jr seems to have... disappeared. Apparently even the Q are not immune to the whims of the writers.
Maybe he was booted out, and is now pretending? Even the Travellers must have their limits when it comes to Wesley Crusher.bilateralrope wrote:With the detail of Weasley using what looks like a typical transporter, instead of the fog-transporter effect. So that's one more question I have about them.
Or that time when Picard and Dr Crusher literally had devices telepathically linking them together and were discussing Picard's love for her, yet his mother was never brought up.bilateralrope wrote:Yeah. I'm not buying that the trauma went unresolved for so long. I doubt his mothers suicide went unrecorded by the authorities* and something like that should have come up in whatever psychological evaluation the academy performs on cadets. Then there are his decades in Starfleet encountering various telepaths. Including Troi.
*Though they might not have discovered that he let her out.
There's enough elephants in the room that Jurati could've just used them block to explosion instead of the fleetCrazedwraith wrote:The lack of explicit WWIII reference really pissed me off. Elephant in the room unaddressed.
True, I forgot about that.Crazedwraith wrote: Khan and the Eugenics War was 1990s unless they've retconned it. It's more likely a reference to Enterprise's Arik Soong who created/rescued Augments. I forget the precise details.
Given Seven's options between Commander Poorly-Researched-And-Walking-Native-Stereotype Chakotay, Chronically-Sexually Confused/Abused Ensign Kim, Perverted Holo Doctor who really ought to follow medical ethics when it comes to patients, Boring Dream Borg Boyfriend Living on Other Side of the Galaxy, Stupid Angry Nazi Husband From Alternate Timeline or Raffi... tbh I think this is the best match she's made so far!EnterpriseSovereign wrote:Seven Of Nine's sexuality changing from straight to bisexual (anyone remember her relationship with Chakotay?) was less than convincing- I don't recall her showing any sign of attraction to any other women and she had her share of male admirers on Voyager.
Ya the writers could have easily made it work. In the story, Q makes it clear that he only had enough energy to send the crew back, and Rios deciding to stay left enough surplus to bring Elnor back. Q also states that in his weakened state this act would "kill" him... or at least end his existence in this particular universe and send his consciousness off somewhere (it's possible that what he was hinting at when he insisted on saying he was "moving on" instead of "dying", unless he was just being in denial). Q admits he doesn't know what will actually happen when he "dies," which is why he was initially hoping to enjoy the experience (much like Quinn).bilateralrope wrote: They were all preparing to live in the past until Q offered them a way back to their time. A way he said would kill him. Even if Q was lying about that, convincing him to bring along two extra people seems unlikely.
EnterpriseSovereign wrote:Is that what Q meant? I didn't pick that up, though I'm sure the writers could still have made that work
Ya, kinda silly how they solved that problem (well, the explosion, not the conduit itself) so quickly.EnterpriseSovereign wrote: It was very rushed the way they suddenly returned to the future and how they immediately went do deal with a discharge from some anomaly they just discovered and how it threatened the quadrant/sector, which was about as plausible as the Hobus supernova somehow posing a similar threat. It wouldn't surprise me if said anomaly was something the Borg themselves inadvertently caused, perhaps a trying to set up another transwarp hub and it blowing up in their faces.
Apart from his prejudice towards victims of the Borg, he seemed a rude but possibly reasonable. Maybe not a captain I'd put on any diplomatic missions, but one who could be quite suitable on a ship that operates within Federation borders and/or on outright military missions. Or maybe he behaves differently when he isn't around Starfleet officers who are acting very suspiciously.Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2023-02-18 11:12am Captain Dick making her go by Hansen and his remarks against Picard show xB prejudice is still alive and well.
A bit of chicken and egg situation here? Is he refusing Picard/Riker a favour because he's a colossal dick and hates them. Or is he being a colossal dick because Picard/Riker have forced their way onto his ship on dubious pretences and asking favour without even buttering him up much first.bilateralrope wrote: ↑2023-02-19 07:57amApart from his prejudice towards victims of the Borg, he seemed a rude but possibly reasonable. Maybe not a captain I'd put on any diplomatic missions, but one who could be quite suitable on a ship that operates within Federation borders and/or on outright military missions. Or maybe he behaves differently when he isn't around Starfleet officers who are acting very suspiciously.Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2023-02-18 11:12am Captain Dick making her go by Hansen and his remarks against Picard show xB prejudice is still alive and well.
I'm guessing even in something mildly military as Starfleet you don't have much choice where you're assigned. And Seven has matured significantly since that Voyager episode. Still that maybe the very reasoning Starfleet personnel went for. Captain Dick (Shaw's his real name?) may have a rep as a bit of stickler and martinet and they thought they would rub along well.Though I've got to wonder how Seven ended up as an officer on his ship. I've also got some vague memories of a Voyager episode where Seven was put in charge of something and was reassigning designations to the crew under her command. So I've got questions about how much she would care about it. If Captain Dick is the one she can serve under best and the name change is just something she's willing to adapt to.
How often was an Admiral visiting a ship a good thing for that ship in other Trek series ?Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2023-02-19 11:27am A bit of chicken and egg situation here? Is he refusing Picard/Riker a favour because he's a colossal dick and hates them. Or is he being a colossal dick because Picard/Riker have forced their way onto his ship on dubious pretences and asking favour without even buttering him up much first.
The actual decision not to do them a favour actually seems reasonably reasoned, it's just he was such a dick, lol. But They are retired and he has actual orders from his actual chain of command. Of course, the only apparent downside to doing them said favour would be having to haul arse a bit and maybe burn some more fuel. Maybe has to sign the receipts at the antimatter station?
Or it's a figure of speech that's remained after its literal meaning has gone away. If you want to get into a discussion on if the Federation has money at various points in its history, there are stronger pieces of evidence elsewhere.Tangentially, the mention of paygrades seemed incongruent for Star Trek TNG as well.
That's what makes it interesting for speculation. We don't even know how Seven feels about being told which name to use.Since we see so little of them outside Picard/Riker's visit and nothing at all about Shaw's command of his crew since he leaves it all to Seven, it hard to tell what his actual attitude is.
Eh, I'm not sure I like them getting Meta about the evil admiral thing.bilateralrope wrote: ↑2023-02-19 12:42pm How often was an Admiral visiting a ship a good thing for that ship in other Trek series ?
Add in his apparent like of everything going as planned and their reputation for regularly going well outside the rules and I can see why he'd dislike them from reputation alone.
Yes, I imagine that it's a figure of speech but it's not a figure of speech I remember them often using prior in TNG era Star Trek, which is what makes it seem incongruent to me. (though I could easily have forgotten it) It's not inexplicable or wrong it just stood out to me.Or it's a figure of speech that's remained after its literal meaning has gone away. If you want to get into a discussion on if the Federation has money at various points in its history, there are stronger pieces of evidence elsewhere.
From Ryan's acting and from Seven's explicit frustrations with Starfleet later, I'm going to assume she doesn't like it at all. Her preferring the name Seven over Annika Hansen is long established.That's what makes it interesting for speculation. We don't even know how Seven feels about being told which name to use.
Seven might not have much choice. But I remember a scene with Picard discussing why he chose Riker to be his first officer, so it looks like the captain does have some influence over the decision. At least the ability to choose between available officers.Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2023-02-19 11:27am I'm guessing even in something mildly military as Starfleet you don't have much choice where you're assigned. And Seven has matured significantly since that Voyager episode. Still that maybe the very reasoning Starfleet personnel went for. Captain Dick (Shaw's his real name?) may have a rep as a bit of stickler and martinet and they thought they would rub along well.
That attitude from the Lower Decks crew might be due to bias about what they hear about other ships. They are going to hear a lot more about the times when things don't go as planned.I've not seen more than a few clips of Lower Decks but I think the implication that E-D's adventures were remarkable and reckless here is interesting when Lower Decks get a lot of mileage about all of Starfleet getting into weird hijinks every week. (could be wrong)
Agreed. Especially since they made a point of saying that the Titan had gone through a major refit.Crazedwraith wrote: ↑2023-02-25 07:40am Disappointed in episode 2.
We saw it coming but Jack Crusher being Picard's son is very very disappointing. It's cliche and it jobs the scenario of all principles. It's not about not negotiating with bounty hunters or the right for a fair trial, it's just 'must protect bio-kid at all costs'. ugh
I just don't buy than a random mercenary vessel is so much more powerful than a Starfleet vessel, it's there to force the dilemma which I don't like the resolution of.
At this point we can't be sure if Raffi is working for the Federation or some other intelligence agency has been lying to her.Is Raffi Section 31 like the Ferengi says? Fuck that, not as bad as Disco S2 legitimisation for them but not good
His conversation with Laris gave the impression that he was planning to leave Earth with her. Though I'm unclear if that was permanent or just a short trip while he was on leave from the academy.Why isn't Picard running Starfleet Academy anymore?
