Nemesis was not THAT bad...

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2003-05-17 09:43am

It wasn't really BAD (bad in the sense of Star Trek V or Insurrection), just hum-drum, and mostly boring and routine.

I'm not saying the space battle didn't look cool, it did. The eye candy in the movie was what I'd expect from a big budget sci fi movie nowadays.

It's just that the cloning issue seemed so... juvenile... so, 1987. It's hard to explain it, but the philosophical side didn't engage me, because I figure these people should know better. ; p

That and the plot holes, and the focus on two characters, but never really going anywhere (Picard has another "throw away" moment with a lost son? puh-leeze...).

I'll rent the DVD release, just for the sake of completeness and to see if I change my mind on a second viewing, but that's pretty much my opinion of it. It could have been much better than it was....

Anarchist Bunny · Post by **Anarchist Bunny** » 2003-05-17 10:46am

It was a good two part episode, but it was a horrible movie. A few simple changes would have made it better, like the Scimitar vs a few number of ships above earth, the scimitar busts through them but makes it a more even fight for the E-E(but still whoops it), and in his last moments Scizon decides to fire on earth, and data's death has more purpose.

Hades · Post by **Hades** » 2003-05-21 11:10am

I loved it. Its certianly in my top 4 of star trek movies.

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2003-05-21 11:55am

To me what stings soooo much about Nemesis is that 1.)it broke the even number Trek theory 2.) it had sooooo much more potential than was delivered 3.) Data's death was pointless(he deserved a more meaningful death) 4.) they cut scenes that would have been character building and left in the dune buggy chase!

really #2 is my real reason for not liking Nemesis, and along those lines they(cast&crew&B+B) hyped this movie soooo much before hand and after it bombed not one cast member(to my knowledge) defended it.

It was a cheap roughed up mix-mashed copy of TWoK and TUC.

Ignorant_Boy · Post by **Ignorant_Boy** » 2003-05-21 03:24pm

Saw it and Daredevil in one night and it wasn't horrible like Generations or Insurrection, but not to the level of TWOK or FC either. Bah, mediocre. To Nemesis' credit, it's slightly more watchable than that steaming pile of shit they called Daredevil.

kmart · Post by **kmart** » 2003-05-21 05:23pm

Death from the Sea wrote:To me what stings soooo much about Nemesis is that 1.)it broke the even number Trek theory

That seems like such a crock to me. It isn't consistently valid if you go by box office or even a lot of the critical notices. Only II and VI were any good of the even-numbered ones, while I enjoy I and V more than ANY of the NextGen flicks regardless of number. Subscribing to something as simpleminded and illogical as the odd numbered curse for trek is a kind of non-thinking about on par with saying EIGHT IS ENOUGH is a better 'family drama' than THE SOPRANOS.

Ignorant_Boy · Post by **Ignorant_Boy** » 2003-05-21 09:20pm

kmart wrote:
Death from the Sea wrote:To me what stings soooo much about Nemesis is that 1.)it broke the even number Trek theory
That seems like such a crock to me. It isn't consistently valid if you go by box office or even a lot of the critical notices. Only II and VI were any good of the even-numbered ones, while I enjoy I and V more than ANY of the NextGen flicks regardless of number . Subscribing to something as simpleminded and illogical as the odd numbered curse for trek is a kind of non-thinking about on par with saying EIGHT IS ENOUGH is a better 'family drama' than THE SOPRANOS.

You liked The Final Frontier?

kmart · Post by **kmart** » 2003-05-22 09:04pm

^Hell, yes! Once I realized the trek movies weren't going to be decent science fiction anymore (after Bennett came in on #2), I had to enjoy them for what they DID include. That meant liking it when they were all about the big 3 -- that's what they had going for them, and the ST5 KSM stuff in Yosemite and in the lounge was worth the price of admission many times over.

Plus Shatner and/or his DP knew how to shoot scope ... compositionally, alot of the live-action portion of the film (I'm talking NON-FX portions, obviously the vfx are largely abyssmal) looks good, except for the stuff where they had to blow it up to hide the scratches. The way they dolly to reframe the 3 during the first lounge scene is pretty neat, unobtrusive but reinforcing the idea of these guys as a unit, practically a single being.

Hades · Post by **Hades** » 2003-05-23 04:25am

I must admit that some of the comic elements ofFinal Frontier were good (scottys line "Dont worry, i know this ship like the back of my hand", then knocking himself unconsious on the pipe)
But as a sci-fi film it wasnt that good a story line. watchable but not good enough to write home about.