What Voyager crewmember might be suitable for command?

[Crayz9000]

Assuming that Voyager manages to return early, in the middle of the Dominion War (when Starfleet needs captains desperately), who from its crew might be considered for command rank by Starfleet?

I know already that most of the crew couldn't think their way out of a paper bag, so while the sentiment of wanting them all to die painfully may be amusing to some, it's not like the show gave us much to work with here. Your thoughts?

[Crazedwraith]

Tuvok seemed to have his head on straight in most episodes and I thought did rather well in that episode where they did leave Janeway and Chakotay behind for some fun times for their shippers.

[Mr Bean]

The Doctor, what is needed here is cold logical rationally backed up by an excellent signing voice.

Tom Paris is a know incompetent as is Harry Kim.
Seven lacks rationality, and Torres can't take pressure and breaks under it.
That leaves Tuvok, Chakotay or the Doctor and of the three I'd trust them in reverse order, The Doctor, Chakotay and then Tuvok. Tuvok's does not work well with others will end up getting them killed sooner or later leaving only a program or a former captain as their only two choices. So keep on Vice-Captaining Chakotay, without a homicidal mass murdering social-path I'm sure you'll do a much better job.

[Stofsk]

Tuvok seemed to have his head on straight in most episodes and I thought did rather well in that episode where they did leave Janeway and Chakotay behind for some fun times for their shippers.

He was doing fine up until the part where he told Paris to reverse course.

[JME2]

Tuvok seemed to have his head on straight in most episodes and I thought did rather well in that episode where they did leave Janeway and Chakotay behind for some fun times for their shippers.

He was doing fine up until the part where he told Paris to reverse course.

Heh.

[FaxModem1]

I voted for Chakotay, Tuvok, and Tom Paris.

Tom Paris is a capable pilot, field medic, decent designer of ships and only bad point is that he is a maverick when the plot requires it.

Tuvok is logical, smart, a good fighter and kept the ship rather well run.

Chakotay, well, look at his command skills in Scorpion, he commanded the ship rather well and when the Borg started to try and betray them, Chakotay vented them out the airlock.

[Dominus Atheos]

Is it weird that I think Seven would make a good admiral but a bad captain? I don't think she could lead a team of people well, but she would make good command decisions. I remember an episode where she was had people working under her and demoted Harry Kim from a higher number to a lower number, what episode was that?

[lord Martiya]

I voted for the Doctor, and amazingly enough, Seska. I know she was actually a Cardassian in disguise, but she managed to have the Kazon act efficiently, and the little 'gift' she left behind was a nice trap.
For the Doctor, he's the one actually using his smarts. He may be annoying when he wants, but he's a better captain than anyone else.

[Darmalus]

I think Tuvok and Chakotay would both make okay captains, they have their faults and their strength but nothing that would do more damage than incoming fire. They both seem intelligent when the plot doesn't require they be morons, and they can pull out the ruthlessness for those tough decisions when needed.

I think the Doctor has the potential to be a good captain, but he suffers from a lack of command experience outside the sickbay. He might also encounter resistance from any crew he was intended to command, I can hear grumbling about "being bossed around by a computer program" from here.

Tom Paris was my runner up, I like him as a character but I just can't see him as a captain.

[Chris OFarrell]

Well looking at the senior officers;

Chakotay if Janeway was dead and he didn't have to risk her coming back and killing him for doing something she didn't like might be okay. There were a few episodes that were annoying because we just might have seen him start to show himself as an officer worthy of the big chair (also known as episodes where Robert Beltran was actually given a green light to TRY and act). Scorpion being a good example, as were moments in Equinox, Shattered and Distant Origin.

But most of the time he was a useless background character for all intents and purposes.

Tuvok clearly has the head to lead, although that one time he was put in command, he really needed to put some of the lesser officers in their places when they openly started questioning him. He has shown he can work well in a crisis and has the experience to lead.

Harry Kim is useless as a leader. Dito Paris, he's a flyboy and...thats about it.

Torres is a good engineer, or at least so I suppose for keeping Voyager running as she has for so long and looking like she just came out of spacedock.

The Doctor, horrible ECH subplot aside, is just not suited for command. He makes a great CMO, but he's not someone I'd want in command, anymore then I'd want McCoy or Crusher in the Big Chair.

Seven...is a great science department head, but a Captain she isn't, her people skills are still firmly stuck in the Collective 'We are the Borg, we act and think as one' moment.

[Thanas]

Kim apparently did quite well as a captain in Star Trek....until he let future Admiral Janeway steal the newest weapons and break about several time directives as well. No Backbone.

[Crayz9000]

Okay, what smartass voted for Neelix?

[Aaron]

Okay, what smartass voted for Neelix?

He'll get you home through the power of interpretive dance!

[Sela]

Actually, I felt that Paris might make a decent captain. Realize that a lot of his long-term changed behavior in the show probably stems from the fact that he's chafing under the thumb of a retarded captain and a half-bit crew.

Earlier on, he demonstrates lots of resourcefulness, is an excellent pilot (useful if put in command of a smaller combat ship in the dominion war), a wide variety of talents, a natural charisma, and a decent level of tolerance for incompetent failures (like Harry Kim).

Perhaps most importantly though are his willingness to question and defy orders from his superiors that are either illogical or immoral. It takes a special breed of captain in the repressive federation to violate the prime directive in Janeway's time. It takes a certain level of moral fiber and conviction to stand up to a captain who would doubtlessly feel totally at ease jettisoning you out of an airlock. Paris has done both and on more than one occasion. While I'd be leery of giving him a promotion to captain given his past history and starfleet criminal status, he would be *suitable* for command.


While being led by a hologram would definitely be something new, the EMH shows capacity and personality well in excess of any other hologram we see in the series. Further, he makes good tactical decisions when given the opportunity and even managed to bluff an opponent ('the photonic cannon') which demonstrates he isn't as prone to the "rigid-logic-failure" that so many ST:TOS and star trek computers/robots in general seemed to demonstrate. EMH gets a vote.


Seven of Nine quickly became a feature-of-the-week on the show. Of course as a side-effect she was given wanktastic powers and knowledge well in excess of what your average captain might have. While she'd be ideal as a science officer, she on more than one occasion has saved the crew from danger and has frequently outperformed Janeway in terms of assessing and dealing with a tactical situation. She inspires respect/awe in those that listen to her from among the crew - though I wouldn't go so far as to say she's liked.
Still, no example springs to mind for her being in a command situation, so perhaps this wasn't my best choice.


Tuvok intially seems like a good pick. Vulcan, logical, what's not to like? But I'm not sure that starfleet humans are ready for a vulcan captain. Particularly not one as inflexible as Tuvok (Remember how he trained the kids by trying to teach them to meditate? Tried to train the Maquis by pointlessly making them run around in starfleet gymsuits and picking on trivial uniform issues?). It's not that he'd necessarily fail at it, but I just don't see him bending the rules when needed to accomodate a difficult situation. He certainly wouldn't do what Sisko did "In the Pale Moonlight"

[CaptJodan]

Chuck's quasi recent review of Tuvok's holodeck program about the Maquis rebellion reminded me how good a Captain Chakotay would have been had he stuck to the roots the show implied he had in the first episode. I'm not sure if that makes Tuvok the good Captain for seeing possibilities in characters we could have had, or if certain choices had been made, Chakotay could really have been that no-nonsense Captain that wouldn't pussyfoot around with Federation regulations and just get the crew home.

Tuvok would be a close second, and it would depend on whether or not Chakotay grew the balls we saw in Tuvok's program. If not, Tuvok would probably get my vote. He has his flaws though, most already mentioned. He could be a good CO if he had a strong XO at his side to give him a more emotional lens to consider during times when that would be needed.

[Purple]

What ever you say about Nelix he did canonically spend a lot of time as a starship captain in the delta quadrant. So he can't be all that bad at it.

Furthermore, he repeatedly demonstrates the sort of stubborn stupidity and capability to push him self and others around him until he gets what he wants. And those are all qualities that would make him a good commander or at least XO given the chance.

If anything he might be a rather good XO if given a Tuvok like captain to work with. Someone who can reign in the stupidity but also be pushed into thinking outside the box by the ever incessant Nelix.

[Thanas]

^You got to be kidding me. You think somebody who has sconsistently lied to further his own goals, who even makes a point of withholding coffee to his superiors is a good choice for captaining a starship? Really?

[Purple]

About the coffee thing, this is a man who until recently (well several years) spent time on a starship without a replicator where water was scarce. And at that point in time Voyager was running low on replicator fuel (or what ever it is called).

So it might have been a mater of innate fear with him not wanting to get to the point where starvation is a factor. And than his conscious and stupid mind covering it up with blabling about stuff. That is how the scene seemed to me at least.

And considering that the episode used that situation to make a point of how low supplies were it might be just the inner Nelix shouting: "Save stuff, don't waste it! We are doomed! Doomed! ZOMG!"

[Thanas]

So what qualifies him for command? Is he good with people? Is he a strategic mastermind?

Sorry, but surviving in the Delta quadrant is not an indicator of success, especially seeing how without Voyagers intervention kes would have been dead and Neelix most likely as well.

[Purple]

Sorry, but surviving in the Delta quadrant is not an indicator of success, especially seeing how without Voyagers intervention kes would have been dead and Neelix most likely as well.

Yes it is. Staying alive and prospering in a small craft barely larger than a shuttle in Kazon infested space might not sound like much. But it puts him at being at least as capable a character as say Han Solo.

Is he good with people?

Yes. He demonstrates the ability to get people motivated to do stuff for him (or at least to get rid of him).

Is he a strategic mastermind?

Is Janevay?

Keep in mind that in the 1st episode the implication is that out of all the participants he was the only one that got what he wanted.

Voyager did not get a way home (and destroyed the array), the Kazon got nothing for their trouble (and indeed damaged ships) while Nelix got a nice bed, a comfortable starship to live in with a crew that will keep feeding him and giving him water and he saved his girlfriend.

He certainly has his times when he shows the capability to get the things he wants rather efficiently.


He has also demonstrated the ability to know just when he can push his way into something and be certain that the other side will simply give up. (as evidenced by the kitchen he made) And I have newer seen him make a move like that and not turn out wining in the end.

[Thanas]

Yes it is. Staying alive and prospering in a small craft barely larger than a shuttle in Kazon infested space might not sound like much. But it puts him at being at least as capable a character as say Han Solo.

How so? Note that Han Solo attended the Imperial Academy, defeated an Imperial invasion of kessel, achieved several navigational and pilot fleets, took on Hutt clans and won etc. What has Neelix done that is even comparable?

Yes. He demonstrates the ability to get people motivated to do stuff for him (or at least to get rid of him).

That is a bit of a non-answer. Were has he shown of being capable of leading several hundreds of people?

Keep in mind that in the 1st episode the implication is that out of all the participants he was the only one that got what he wanted.

Voyager did not get a way home (and destroyed the array), the Kazon got nothing for their trouble (and indeed damaged ships) while Nelix got a nice bed, a comfortable starship to live in with a crew that will keep feeding him and giving him water and he saved his girlfriend.

He certainly has his times when he shows the capability to get the things he wants rather efficiently.

That is not a qualification for command. That makes him an effective manipulator, nothing more.

[Purple]

How so? Note that Han Solo attended the Imperial Academy, defeated an Imperial invasion of kessel, achieved several navigational and pilot fleets, took on Hutt clans and won etc. What has Neelix done that is even comparable?

I meant the movie only version, not the EU version.
I apologize for not making that clear when I should have.

In the movies he just seems like a minor smuggler in trouble and owing money to a crime bos (sound familiar) but turns out to be quite the hero in the end. And we have seen Nelix pull at least some heroic moments (like the scene in the kitchen where he fights the Kazon invader with only a frying pan).

That is a bit of a non-answer. Were has he shown of being capable of leading several hundreds of people?

I admit that he has not. On the other hand, he has not exactly had a chance to either.

That is not a qualification for command. That makes him an effective manipulator, nothing more.

And that is an important quality to have considering how often Federation starships are deployed on diplomatic or cold war like missions where the skill to manipulate and get his own way might help him more than anything else.

And with the Federation, most negotiations seem to be undertaken by the Captain of what ever starship is passing by rather than a dedicated diplomat.

And his risk taking (as pointed out by me in my last post) might serve him quite well in such situations. But as I said, he would need an XO that is his counterpart to give him sanity when he needs it.

[Sela]

While I appreciate anyone who makes a logical devil's advocate argument. . .
. . .I think you're making your stand on *very* thin ground here.

Firstly, very few people on this board would consider Janeway "suitable for command"; hardly a good ruler to use against Neelix. Secondly, whatever his achievements, you can't deny the fact that Neelix is fundamentally stupid. I mean, there are *core* things you need to know about your ship, its capabilities etc. . . and he just doesn't. Case in point: "infinite velocity". . . (oh so that means you're going really fast, right?) from thereshhold.

Also, you keep emphasizing that he has a way of worming his way into what he wants. Well that may be, and it's bizzare i'll grant you that. But does it demonstrate an insight into human character or an ability to manipulate? In other words - is he doing this well or just being stubborn and getting lucky that nobody files obstruction charges against him? It's pretty clear that Neelix fails this test, seeing as to how he needed Chakotay to explain the concept of 'jealousy' to him. And his subsequent acts of jealousy and stupidity even under life-threatening conditions (towards Paris) show just how poorly he handled himself.

You go on about how he'd do well if he was reigned in. I would disagree and say that a command-officer shouldn't *NEED* to have his stupidity reigned in. Or rather, his defining feature should not be that he's stupid. Or that he should irritate people into coming up with ideas of their own Abbot and Costello style. We can emply chatbots for that role.

Take Picard for example, or Kirk - better example. Kirk is hardly the most "grounded, stable, non-risk taking" type. That said his general command style IS. He only needs Spock to reign in his more out-there ideas. And it's frequently HIM coming up with his gambits, tactics and ideas. What brilliant tactics or ideas has Neelix ever brought to the table? When has he ever shown an understanding for "chain of command" and what it means to obey orders - something everyone except possibly the supreme dictator of starfleet command must do?

Neelix reacts to 'orders' as things to be totally brushed aside and ignored. "Go investigate this explosion on that M class planet, Captain Neelix." "Yes Sir but - oooh - i've got the most wonderful recipe for snargloff tail! Let's send a landing party and get food from somewhere else instead!"

[Sela]

Ghetto Edit:

Actually, it's worth pointing out, that the few times Neelix did have to make tactical decisions in the first couple seasons (I can't speak to the others) it ended in disaster.

* His landing party that was to forage for food . . . and lost a man due to his not realizing dead bones in front of a cave-mouth are a bad thing to meddle with.

* His decision to trust an ex-con making a shady deal and going armed. (Sure, he owed him a favor, but the problem is that he went in BLINDLY trusting him.)

* His belief that Janeway was looking for an excuse to dump him off ship. And subsequent plans to trade ship plasma for maps!

* His mistrust of fellow officers which led him to compromise a ship investigation in the Michael Jonas arc. (Rather than trusting it to Tuvok and security who were doing an undercover op.)

[Aaron]

The thought that career military officers are going to allow themselves to put under the command of a rodent they picked up off a shuttle craft is too laughable for words. Come on, in the very first episode, he lied to the Captain and got them in shit with the Kazon so he could get his humpmuffin back.

The guy would be shot in the back on his first away mission.

This is like saying a beachcomber would make a good frigate CO.