StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Nothing is set in stone, but this looks marginally more likely to get off the ground than other attempts, so has of course got me insanely excited.

http://www.denofgeek.com/television/102 ... pment.html

Given the quality of the last two Star Trek TV series and the 'younger cast' stupidity you'll excuse me if I'm not expecting all that much. Senior officers on starships are not going to be twens. Even Starfleet, for all their stupidity in other areas, seems to have remembered that.

How many of these revivals have been pitched anyway?

Some interesting quotes from the article:

designed to take Star Trek back to its "original series roots."

If they actually do this, that might be good.

Foster's series will take place after the Voyager series of a few years back, and won't conflict with JJ Abrams' big-screen take on the Star Trek mythos, since it's set in a different timeline.

Depending on when exactly its set, he'll still have to show the destruction of Romulus. Which I wouldn't mind seeing, so I hope he does.

Saying it'll suck because the last two series did is idiotic. By that reasoning, JJ Abrams' film should have sucked horribly, yet it didn't. It was a financial and critical success as well as the first Star Trek film to win an Oscar. The only thing that's really dubious here is the "much younger cast."

Actually I do think the JJ Abrams movie sucked horribly.

Batman wrote:Actually I do think the JJ Abrams movie sucked horribly.

I beg to differ.

It wasn't the best Star Trek film. But it was entertaining and had some great scenes. It was certainly better than a lot of Voyager and Enterprise, and better than the parts of Nemesis and Insurection I've watched.

Batman wrote:Actually I do think the JJ Abrams movie sucked horribly.

Rather have the extremely decent '09 film than the festivals of shittyness like Final Frontier, Nemesis, Insurrection, Search For Spock, aaaand of course The Motion Picture.
Also Anguirus, I think two attempts were made by him (Foster), but this time, dammit, it might just work XD

What the hell does "original series roots" mean?

The Cold War militarism, the sheer goofiness, what?

For a value of 'extremely decent' that means 'stinks horribly'. It was better than 'Nemesis' and that's about it. Even TFF, easily the worst of the classic Trek movies (The Motionless Picture, boring and costume-wise cringeworthy as it might have been, was not abysmally stupid) was better than nuTrek. About the only thing that movie did right was the looks of the reimagined Big E.

The 2009 film did a number of things right (including some of the same things a new series would have to do right), among them:

-It wasn't really dull. As someone who refers to the first film as "The Motionless Picture", I'd think you could appreciate that.

-It didn't rely primarily on technobable to resolve the plot. Kirk and Spock won with tactics and balls.

-It kept children off of the ships. Well, other than baby Kirk at the beginning.


Its main failures were the contrive coincidences in the middle of the film to justify getting all the original crew together, and (in my personal opinion) the shaky characterization of Kirk. The latter, however, is forgivable in that Kirk is supposed to be an inexperienced, somewhat reckless young man. As long as he has developed more maturity by the next film, I'll forgive this. In any case, we had Pike filling the role of bad ass experienced captain. And as a fan of both the character and the actor who portrayed him, I loved Pike in this film.

That said, I'd love a new original timeline series, as long as they don't fuck it up.

Batman wrote:Even TFF, easily the worst of the classic Trek movies (The Motionless Picture, boring and costume-wise cringeworthy as it might have been, was not abysmally stupid) was better than nuTrek.

Bullshit of the highest order, at least 09 mostly made sense, whereas TFF features the hunt for God, delivers a shitty message of him being in our hearts or whatever, and also claims the Enterprise can hop across the galaxy in five minutes of so.
Come off it, 09 was a good film

It might have been a financially successful film, but it was neither a good nor a good Star Trek film. Generations was a better Star Trek film than that and Generations stunk.

Batman wrote:It might have been a financially successful film, but it was neither a good nor a good Star Trek film. Generations was a better Star Trek film than that and Generations stunk.

You're in the minority there then.

Anyway, wasn't there an attempt at a revival series with an animated thing set in the 25th century or something? I don't think this'll necessarily amount to anything, but if they can get screenwriters who give a shit, then I'll certainly look forward to it.

Holy shit is this thread full of the lamest whinging ever.

Anyway. Until they actually come out and announce a new show, and make sure to stipulate that Rick Berman has fucking nothing to do with it, wake me. Until then, stuff like this isn't really news.

Chimaera wrote:Bullshit of the highest order, at least 09 mostly made sense

"Made sense?" The whole story turned on the most blatant piece of Plot Convenience Theatre ever seen in a Star Trek film: Kirk just managing to get himself tossed off the Enterprise onto the remote planet on which Old Spock just happened to get dumped onto by Nero Whiplash, which just happened to have Scotty exiled there as well, who just happened to have been working on a new mega-transporter, which just happened to be ready for use at the very moment Kirk needed to get back to the Enterprise. Take any one element out of that loop and the movie falls apart like a cheap suit in the rain.

I've seen better written fanfiction.

whereas TFF features the hunt for God, delivers a shitty message of him being in our hearts or whatever,

No, TFF featured the search for God and discovering that the God myth is all bullshit. THAT was the film's message. The coda was just salve to relieve the sting.

and also claims the Enterprise can hop across the galaxy in five minutes of so.

TFF made no such claim.

Come off it, 09 was a good film

Maybe a fun popcorn movie with some nice flash in it, but it was horribly flawed in so many ways that it's just not funny.

Patrick Degan wrote:

and also claims the Enterprise can hop across the galaxy in five minutes of so.

TFF made no such claim.

It kinda did - they were supposed to be heading near the galactic core.

Not that this is at all inconsistent with TOS - in each season the Enterprise visited the galactic barrier. That alone suggests a massive scale for warp drive in comparison to later shows which scaled it back.

Stofsk wrote:

Patrick Degan wrote:

and also claims the Enterprise can hop across the galaxy in five minutes of so.

TFF made no such claim.

It kinda did - they were supposed to be heading near the galactic core.

Not that this is at all inconsistent with TOS - in each season the Enterprise visited the galactic barrier. That alone suggests a massive scale for warp drive in comparison to later shows which scaled it back.

Within hours, not minutes —though, as you observed, that is not inconsistent with TOS, which was always inconsistent about the warp drive scale in any case.

Though I'm typically a Warsie, I would be thrilled to see a new Star Trek series in the main timeline show up. I was only barely aware of any Star Trek series prior to Enterprise, so being there for the first showing would be great. I have a few strong suggestions though:

• Make sure the writers pay attention to their tech advisors so they know when they're making stupid mistakes.
• Away teams should wear envirosuits the first time they beam or shuttle down to an unexplored world, regardless of whether it scans as Class M. Doesn't matter that the air is breathable, there's no telling what the hell kind of pathogens are in the air. This is simple common sense.
• Firefights should look like actual firefights, not like pistol duels at twenty paces. The opening of VOY: "State of Flux" (*Chakotay zaps Kazon* "Aarrgh!" *Kazon zaps Chakotay* "Aarrgh!" *Seska zaps Kazon* "Aarrgh!") and the Nemesis boarding action (Worf and Riker shoot at a guy standing in the middle of a corridor less than five meters away and miss) come to mind. Maybe they could enlist the fight choreographers from Stargate?
• On a related note, characters should put on armor when they know combat is imminent. Since even in Star Trek soldiers appear to be trained to aim for center of mass (when was the last time you saw somebody try for a headshot with a phaser?), something equivalent to a flak vest would satisfy me here.
• Berman and Braga are both officially banned from the studio and any related location.
• Learn a lesson from Tom Paris: lose the technobabble and tell it like it is. Other related suggestions can be summed up as, "If it makes the writers get creative instead of putting in obvious filler or insulting the viewers' intelligence, it's a good thing."
• Quit misinterpreting the Prime Directive. The PD was designed to stop the Feddies from duplicating the atrocities of the European colonial powers, and prohibits tech transfers that could cause a civilization to destroy itself. A noble principle, certainly, but it has been consistently interpreted to mean that any intervention is bad. This is not true: it is perfectly acceptable to stop an asteroid from wiping out a preindustrial civilization, for instance. There is no reason you can't pick a spot and draw the line there. (The key is to keep the spot consistent throughout the series.)
• Leave the damn civilians at home. They have no place on a starship that is put into mortal danger every other episode. That's one of the few improvements Voyager made over previous series: apart from crew they acquired in the Delta Quadrant and children born during the series, there were no civilians aboard.

My personal preference for ship class? I'd like a Prometheus (and we know they're in full service by the end of VOY), but it seems to be purpose-built as a warship so it's unlikely that the exploration/combat blend typical to Star Trek would fit well with one. The Galaxy-class has too many design flaws (fun plot idea: Leah Brahms gets court-martialed). My suggestion? Akira-class. A powerful enough combatant for the military side (it can mount tricobalt torpedoes according to one non-canon source), but isn't so obviously a warship that they can't include science episodes without insulting the viewers' intelligence.

As a fan of the Akira class I like the idea, but ultimately its more likely they'd come up with an original design, and it may make more sense than throwing out something we've see before.

Otherwise, your suggestions are all good. I'll add a few more:

-Give the Federation transwarp. This'll open up the whole Galaxy, and God knows they've been trying to build transwarp for long enough.

-Show the aftermath of the Dominion War.

-Show the destruction of Romulus.

-Have guests appearances by characters from other Star Trek shows.

The Romulan Republic wrote: Its main failures were the contrive coincidences in the middle of the film to justify getting all the original crew together, and (in my personal opinion) the shaky characterization of Kirk. The latter, however, is forgivable in that Kirk is supposed to be an inexperienced, somewhat reckless young man. As long as he has developed more maturity by the next film, I'll forgive this. In any case, we had Pike filling the role of bad ass experienced captain. And as a fan of both the character and the actor who portrayed him, I loved Pike in this film.
.

Don't forget the ending, where after saving the Earth Kirk is not only cleared of the charges against him (blatantly hacking the Kobayashi Maru) but is promoted to Captain and given the Enterprise.

So a cadet jumps every single rank (going from O-0 [zero] to O-6) and is put in command of one of the Federation's most powerful ships. This is so mind bogglingly absurd, it's a tactical nuke to SoD.

Seriously, it's like Abrams consulted a fanfic writer to pad the story.

I think the biggest problem for this show will be budgetary. If they want to do an action show with a wacky cast of aliens and new effects, it'll cost them heavily. They'll need ad revenue and thus decent ratings.

However, when done right, Trek just won't appeal to everyone, such is the nature of the thing.

StarSword wrote:My personal preference for ship class? I'd like a Prometheus (and we know they're in full service by the end of VOY), but it seems to be purpose-built as a warship so it's unlikely that the exploration/combat blend typical to Star Trek would fit well with one. The Galaxy-class has too many design flaws (fun plot idea: Leah Brahms gets court-martialed). My suggestion? Akira-class. A powerful enough combatant for the military side (it can mount tricobalt torpedoes according to one non-canon source), but isn't so obviously a warship that they can't include science episodes without insulting the viewers' intelligence.

It seems whenever a talk of Trek's future comes up, some limp dicked retard pipes up about having a POWERFUL COMBATANT for a ship. Why is it important that it's powerful?

This news sounds encouraging but too early and vague, could be a disappointment like SG: Universe and crash faster than Enterprise, and likely depends on the success of the next JJ Abrams movie: Star Trek XI was a entertaining movie that translated a 1960s cult TV show to the big screen better than long forgotton and unlamented 1990s dreck like the Lost in Space and The Avengers* movies, and was certainly better than most of the TNG films (with the exception of First Contact) but that was not exceptionally hard to do. And it depended on a gigaton of contrivances (like a young Kirk getting drafted into Starfleet on the spot and Spock HAPPENING to be in that same cave on the entire ice moon that Kirk stumbled into).

*British TV show involving a double team of private detectives/spies around 1960s/70s London, not the Marvel team.

I liked the 2009 movie's story for the most part (though the coincidences on Delta Vega especially were kinda dumb), and the effects were spectacular, but there was one glaring problem with the entire scenario: the 2387 supernova. First off, given my rudimentary knowledge of astronomy, a simple yellow star like the one shown cannot become a supernova without outside interference (not going there). Secondly, the very idea that a supernova can destroy a planet in an entirely different star system faster than Spock can travel from Vulcan at Warp 9+ is absolute bullshit: that would require the supernova to propagate at faster-than-light speeds, which is impossible (and clearly didn't happen in prime Spock's memory of the event). Also, like all explosions, the supernova's shock-front would lose power as it expanded according to the inverse-square law. By the time it reached Romulus, it should have dissipated.

The only way a supernova makes even a modicum of sense for destroying Romulus would be if it was the sun of Romulus itself, in which case the planet is going to soon be uninhabitable regardless of whether Spock can suck up the supernova with technobabble.

In addition to all the suggestions already put forward (and I like the idea of having guest stars from other Trek series making cameo appearances, ala TNG's "Relics"), may I suggest hiring J. Michael Straczynski to write out a number of episodes and story arcs?

Swindle1984 wrote:In addition to all the suggestions already put forward (and I like the idea of having guest stars from other Trek series making cameo appearances, ala TNG's "Relics"), may I suggest hiring J. Michael Straczynski to write out a number of episodes and story arcs?

I'm on the fence. B5 was a massive and unparalleled achievement in US TV sci-fi. But what has he done after it that has been as good?

Having said that, I would like to see what he can come up with in the Trek setting.

Destructionator XIII wrote:

StarSword wrote:I have a few strong suggestions though:

Only the loserest of fatty nerds give a shit about that.

There's only two things that matter:

1) likable characters

2) good stories


That's why TOS succeeded. That's why TNG succeeded. That's why the good movies succeeded.

This. Those two values are also interdependent. If you have likeable characters, good stories will follow - and if you have good stories, it will almost certainly be because the characters in them are likeable. It sounds circular, but it's still true.

Gandalf wrote:I think the biggest problem for this show will be budgetary. If they want to do an action show with a wacky cast of aliens and new effects, it'll cost them heavily. They'll need ad revenue and thus decent ratings.

Not really, dude. The problem with Star Trek was in its producers, not the budget or the talented actors and other behind the scenes specialists. Look at Enterprise. In terms of production values, it shits all over every other star trek show - for realsies. Whatever else you might think of the show, and I personally think it was fucking shit, in terms of the look of it and the locations and the effort put into making it come alive, it was really nice looking.

The problem was the producers were fuckwits and that had a transference affect on the writing. This was a show that only started hinting at its potential in its final season, when the douchebags took a step back and let someone else hold the reins. Furthermore this is Star Trek - it's going to have an in-built audience at least willing to give it a go. In many ways, this was actually the franchise's achilles heel while simultaneously and maybe paradoxically being a strength- the perception was that fans would tune in, so nobody gave a shit about what they were producing. When long-term trekkies were blasting the shows like Voyager and Enterprise, and even DS9 (because let's not forget how it split the fanbase with the Dominion War, while also getting criticised way before then as well for being basically a station and not a spaceship), and decrying B&B and so on, you know you've got problems. A lot don't much care for the JJ Abrams version of Trek either, but I have to say what JJ Abrams did was utterly necessary. Trek needed a reboot. The fact that it was a commercial and hell even a critical success, despite having some serious flaws, suggests to me there is a lot more desire for Trek than many people here give it credit for, they just did not want Berman and Braga involved.

It seems whenever a talk of Trek's future comes up, some limp dicked retard pipes up about having a POWERFUL COMBATANT for a ship. Why is it important that it's powerful?

Yeah it's a bit strange. Especially by wankers who come to a site called 'stardestroyer.net' and read through a database that cherry picks all the bad qualities of the Enterprise-D, but very few of the good qualities. Like how it got the absolute shit kicked out of it by the Borg cube in 'Best of Both Worlds' but still kept on flying and fighting.