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NanoGator @ Home (00:14 AM) :
in any case, if the last ep was a hint of what's to come, enterprise might shape up quite nicely
kojikun (00:15 AM) :
well, next episode has BORG in it..
kojikun (00:15 AM) :
on EARTH
NanoGator @ Home (00:15 AM) :
yep yep
kojikun (00:15 AM) :
because B&B need to defecate on continuity.
NanoGator @ Home (00:15 AM) :
problem is, will they be pussified like in voyager
NanoGator @ Home (00:15 AM) :
um
NanoGator @ Home (00:15 AM) :
dumbass
NanoGator @ Home (00:15 AM) :
why would the borg be on earth in archer's time?
kojikun (00:16 AM) :
EXACTLY MY POINT
NanoGator @ Home (00:16 AM) :
um no, you need to explain that point
NanoGator @ Home (00:16 AM) :
hehe
kojikun (00:16 AM) :
They were discovered for the first time in Q Who, in TNG, and yet theyre on EARTH before KIRK existed?! WTF
kojikun (00:16 AM) :
seriously, B&B are shitting all over continuity
NanoGator @ Home (00:16 AM) :
oh geez you're thick
kojikun (00:16 AM) :
i know, but not very long
NanoGator @ Home (00:16 AM) :
you're missing the most obvious point where the borg would be found on earth
kojikun (00:17 AM) :
Antartica.
NanoGator @ Home (00:17 AM) :
point in time
kojikun (00:17 AM) :
Oh do tell.
NanoGator @ Home (00:17 AM) :
c'mon dude, work it out
kojikun (00:17 AM) :
im thinking, and all i see is "pre TNG = no borg"
NanoGator @ Home (00:17 AM) :
im sick of people not noticing that happened even tho they've all seen it
kojikun (00:18 AM) :
oh go on, tell me. ive not seen much so explain it
NanoGator @ Home (00:18 AM) :
you've seen this
NanoGator @ Home (00:18 AM) :
heh
kojikun (00:18 AM) :
seen what???
NanoGator @ Home (00:18 AM) :
wen the borg were at earth pre-TNG
kojikun (00:19 AM) :
You mean in FC? Sorry, the borg never landed on earth, they were destroyed entirely while in orbit.
NanoGator @ Home (00:19 AM) :
it's about fucking time you got the point
kojikun (00:19 AM) :
I entertained that theory when i first heard about the episode, but its just not possible
NanoGator @ Home (00:19 AM) :
it's totally possible
kojikun (00:19 AM) :
the sphere was completely destroyed, and no borg ever beamed down to the ground
NanoGator @ Home (00:19 AM) :
how do ya know it was completely destroyed?
kojikun (00:20 AM) :
because i saw it blow up in the movie?
NanoGator @ Home (00:20 AM) :
um
NanoGator @ Home (00:20 AM) :
you saw a distant shot of it blow up
NanoGator @ Home (00:20 AM) :
the debris'd be too small for ya to see
NanoGator @ Home (00:20 AM) :
eventually some of it would make it to the planet
kojikun (00:20 AM) :
actually no
NanoGator @ Home (00:20 AM) :
actually yes
kojikun (00:20 AM) :
it would burn up in reentry
NanoGator @ Home (00:20 AM) :
no it wouldnt
kojikun (00:20 AM) :
yes it would dude
NanoGator @ Home (00:20 AM) :
no it wouldnt dude
kojikun (00:20 AM) :
Justify your reasoning, then.
NanoGator @ Home (00:21 AM) :
oh i dunno, maybe when a borg ship got really close to a star?
kojikun (00:21 AM) :
Shields, dumbass
kojikun (00:21 AM) :
little pieces do not have shields
kojikun (00:21 AM) :
and reentry is very different from sitting in the sun
NanoGator @ Home (00:21 AM) :
they'd still have to have some resistent metals to build their ship
NanoGator @ Home (00:21 AM) :
otherwise a simple intertial dampner failure would crumple the ship
kojikun (00:22 AM) :
reentry heating is convectionary, while a star is radiative
NanoGator @ Home (00:22 AM) :
*shrug*
kojikun (00:22 AM) :
their ships are also ridiculously hollow
NanoGator @ Home (00:22 AM) :
still advanced matierials from a very advanced race
kojikun (00:22 AM) :
true enough, but they wouldnt survive reentry
NanoGator @ Home (00:22 AM) :
i dont see why not
kojikun (00:22 AM) :
the impact would destroy the ship
kojikun (00:23 AM) :
and any borg in it
NanoGator @ Home (00:23 AM) :
you mean the same species that had holes blown through their ship and just 'willed it' to regrow back into place?
kojikun (00:23 AM) :
cant will anything to regrown if theres nothing to will.
kojikun (00:23 AM) :
besides, if the drones are dead, there is no willing anything
NanoGator @ Home (00:24 AM) :
geez
kojikun (00:25 AM) :
geez nothing
NanoGator @ Home (00:25 AM) :
ur funny
kojikun (00:25 AM) :
they cant withstand rentry and impact, simple as that
NanoGator @ Home (00:25 AM) :
once you get dead set on some idea, you cant shake it free no matter how ridiculous you sound
kojikun (00:25 AM) :
and yet youre not providing any arguement, now youre attacking me personally
kojikun (00:25 AM) :
Concession accepted.
NanoGator @ Home (00:25 AM) :
meanwhile, im looking forward to enjoying the ep. And if it sucks (and if voyager's any indication, it probably will) at least it opens the door to som e interesting stuf
NanoGator @ Home (00:25 AM) :
heh 'cothethion athepted'
kojikun (00:25 AM) :
I want to see TNG borg
kojikun (00:25 AM) :
they kicekd ASS
NanoGator @ Home (00:26 AM) :
yep i agree
kojikun (00:26 AM) :
they were like.. Gothy techvampires
NanoGator @ Home (00:26 AM) :
and i hope since those are the same borg they'll keep tha tin mind
NanoGator @ Home (00:27 AM) :
btw, 'concession accpeted' <-- that usually means the other side's sick of arguing with somembody who's not open to ideas he really should be aware of.
kojikun (00:27 AM) :
the FC borg were TOTALLY Voyager borg. No comparison between FC and TNG
NanoGator @ Home (00:27 AM) :
um the borg in that movie were pretty cool
NanoGator @ Home (00:27 AM) :
it was when voyager got a hold of them that they really fucked it up
kojikun (00:27 AM) :
maybe to you, but to me they were stupid.
NanoGator @ Home (00:27 AM) :
okie doke
NanoGator @ Home (00:27 AM) :
kinda like how farscape's stupid, right?
NanoGator @ Home (00:27 AM) :
heheh
kojikun (00:27 AM) :
to you, yep.
kojikun (00:28 AM) :
but the fact remainds, TNG Borg != FC Borg
NanoGator @ Home (00:28 AM) :
interesting
NanoGator @ Home (00:28 AM) :
i didnt say they were the same borg, i said they were cool
NanoGator @ Home (00:28 AM) :
and the 'to you' point you made applies very well to this convo
kojikun (00:29 AM) :
why did the borg become interested in assimilating people?
kojikun (00:29 AM) :
they were never interested in people.
NanoGator @ Home (00:29 AM) :
well you can build cool shit, but you still need people to work it.
NanoGator @ Home (00:30 AM) :
frankly, the assymilation concept is a lot better than 'we grow babies'
kojikun (00:30 AM) :
bullshit. its stupid. growing babies makes sense according to their priorities.
NanoGator @ Home (00:30 AM) :
it's ridiculous
NanoGator @ Home (00:30 AM) :
not very scary either.
kojikun (00:30 AM) :
they were never interested in people! they were only interested in technology
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
the vampyre element was much more interesting and much more like what they should be
kojikun (00:31 AM) :
hardly. theyre not supposed to be human vampires, theyre supposed to be TECH vampires
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
oh please
kojikun (00:31 AM) :
interested in ships and technology they can use
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
that'd be boring as hell
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
"we walk around and steal calculators'
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
gripping
kojikun (00:31 AM) :
doesnt matter
kojikun (00:31 AM) :
you just want to change history
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
all the federation would need to do is send them some schematics and they'd leave them alone
NanoGator @ Home (00:32 AM) :
i just want to change history? That's your rebuttal? Buahahahahahaahahahaa
NanoGator @ Home (00:32 AM) :
hahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahaaahaahah
NanoGator @ Home (00:32 AM) :
hahahaahahahahahahahha
NanoGator @ Home (00:32 AM) :
that was the DORKIEST argument ive ever heard
kojikun (00:32 AM) :
o_O
kojikun (00:32 AM) :
it wasnt an arguement, it was a simple comment
kojikun (00:32 AM) :
dumbass
NanoGator @ Home (00:32 AM) :
it was pretty lame
kojikun (00:33 AM) :
you dont like the TNG borg, so you want to make them into the Voyager borg
NanoGator @ Home (00:33 AM) :
lol
NanoGator @ Home (00:33 AM) :
it gets funnier!
NanoGator @ Home (00:33 AM) :
i never said i dont like the tng borg, and i said i hated the voyager borg
kojikun (00:34 AM) :
"the vampyre element was much more interesting and much more like what they should be"
NanoGator @ Home (00:34 AM) :
right... and?
kojikun (00:34 AM) :
The VAMPIRE element you like is NOT TNG borg, it is PURE Voyager borg
NanoGator @ Home (00:34 AM) :
nope
kojikun (00:34 AM) :
Yes.
kojikun (00:34 AM) :
Or was I mistaken when the borg completely ignored people and instead started cutting the Enterprise to pieces?
kojikun (00:35 AM) :
Whats that? I'm right in saying the borg were never bloodsuckers in TNG? And that VOY turned them into vampires? Thank you. I knew you'd accept reality.
NanoGator @ Home (00:36 AM) :
lol
kojikun (00:36 AM) :
Bravo, youre laughing is the best rebuttal so far.
kojikun (00:36 AM) :
Even better then your cackling.
NanoGator @ Home (00:36 AM) :
"I have a weak argument, so im gonna try to drill in a point that seems relevent, then declare victory berfore you respond!"
kojikun (00:36 AM) :
A WEAK ARGUEMENT?
NanoGator @ Home (00:36 AM) :
yeah
kojikun (00:36 AM) :
You have NO arguement!
NanoGator @ Home (00:36 AM) :
a;) you're operating under a false assumption
NanoGator @ Home (00:37 AM) :
b.) you're trying to apply absolutist logic that cannot possibly apply
kojikun (00:37 AM) :
The false assumption that the Borg wanted technology only, as was stated repeatedly in Q Who and elsewhere?
NanoGator @ Home (00:37 AM) :
c.) you have a very thick line drawn between different flavors of borg that' makes you feel like you have some interesting point
kojikun (00:37 AM) :
Or was it the assumption that the only time they assimilated anyone in TNG was when they took Picard, and that was for strategical reasons?
NanoGator @ Home (00:38 AM) :
id answer except you're trying to wedge me into some sort of argument you think you can win by over-tightly definiting the rules
kojikun (00:38 AM) :
Or maybe it was my assumption that you'd have an actual arguement other then snide remarks about my arguements and not about Star Trek?
NanoGator @ Home (00:38 AM) :
heh
kojikun (00:38 AM) :
Hey dick head, i defined no rules, i simply said that in TNG they never assimilated people, only technology
kojikun (00:38 AM) :
there is no arguement, its a simple fucking fact
NanoGator @ Home (00:38 AM) :
no you didnt hehe i cant believe yuou're getting mad
NanoGator @ Home (00:39 AM) :
you're trying too wedge me into some argument you think you can winn
kojikun (00:39 AM) :
oh so youre saying this is completely non existant:
"kojikun (00:30 AM) :
they were never interested in people! they were only interested in technology"
kojikun (00:39 AM) :
?
kojikun (00:39 AM) :
Now youre lying
NanoGator @ Home (00:39 AM) :
"well, you dont like the tng borg" (which i didnt say) so you must really like the voyager borg (which i already said that i didnt like)
kojikun (00:40 AM) :
You said you didnt like the techvampire borg but you did like the peoplevampire borg
kojikun (00:40 AM) :
the tech vampires are TNG borg, and the people vampires are VOY borg
kojikun (00:40 AM) :
THERE IS NO ARGUEMENT
NanoGator @ Home (00:40 AM) :
i didnt say i didnt like the techvamypre borg
NanoGator @ Home (00:40 AM) :
you said that
NanoGator @ Home (00:40 AM) :
(you said that i said that I mean)
kojikun (00:41 AM) :
kojikun (00:31 AM) :
interested in ships and technology they can use
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
that'd be boring as hell
NanoGator @ Home (00:41 AM) :
right
kojikun (00:41 AM) :
Caught in a lie. Thank you.
NanoGator @ Home (00:41 AM) :
hehe no pe
kojikun (00:41 AM) :
You dont like tech vampirism. You find it boring. Concession accepted.
NanoGator @ Home (00:41 AM) :
so "would be boring as hell" == "i dont like it at all"?
NanoGator @ Home (00:41 AM) :
honestly dude, youu're capable of much greater undrstanding than that
kojikun (00:41 AM) :
Oh wait, where'd that "at all" come it?
kojikun (00:42 AM) :
I never said at all, dick head.
NanoGator @ Home (00:42 AM) :
you said i dont like tng borg
NanoGator @ Home (00:42 AM) :
that's not whta was said in my quote
kojikun (00:42 AM) :
You find them boring right?
NanoGator @ Home (00:42 AM) :
no that's not what is aid
kojikun (00:42 AM) :
NanoGator @ Home (00:31 AM) :
that'd be boring as hell
kojikun (00:42 AM) :
Dumbass.
NanoGator @ Home (00:43 AM) :
um yeah genius, that doesnt mean i didnt like them
kojikun (00:43 AM) :
So you like boring shit?
kojikun (00:43 AM) :
RETARD.
NanoGator @ Home (00:43 AM) :
heheh
NanoGator @ Home (00:43 AM) :
"rethard. Im gonna inthult you coth im too thtupid to underthtand."
kojikun (00:43 AM) :
Wait wai, so youre saying you DO like boring stuff?
kojikun (00:43 AM) :
yes or no
kojikun (00:43 AM) :
do you?
NanoGator @ Home (00:43 AM) :
or
kojikun (00:44 AM) :
Do you?
kojikun (00:44 AM) :
Cmon
kojikun (00:44 AM) :
answer the question
kojikun (00:44 AM) :
or are you afraid or looking stupid?
NanoGator @ Home (00:44 AM) :
well the problem with answering that is that you're trying to use it to corner me into saying something i didnt say
NanoGator @ Home (00:44 AM) :
so i dont haveta answer since it wont provide any useful information
kojikun (00:44 AM) :
so you deny saying the TNG borg are boring?
NanoGator @ Home (00:44 AM) :
nope
NanoGator @ Home (00:44 AM) :
actdually yes
NanoGator @ Home (00:44 AM) :
i didnt say they are boring
NanoGator @ Home (00:44 AM) :
i said 'would be'
kojikun (00:45 AM) :
LMFAO
kojikun (00:45 AM) :
theyd be boring if they were jsut tech vampires
NanoGator @ Home (00:45 AM) :
rightg
kojikun (00:45 AM) :
THEY WERE JUST TECH VAMPIRES
kojikun (00:45 AM) :
until voyager came along
NanoGator @ Home (00:45 AM) :
first contact pre-dated voyager's borg
kojikun (00:46 AM) :
But the VOY tv show came before FC, so the FC borg were inspire by the VOY borg
kojikun (00:46 AM) :
Your arguement is shit, Nano. You dont like the tech vampire borg, and theyre from TNG, so you dont like the TNG borg. ACCEPT IT.
kojikun (00:47 AM) :
Your arguement has been shot to shit. Bow out while you still have some dignity left.
NanoGator @ Home (00:49 AM) :
hold on
kojikun (00:49 AM) :
No. I'm not going to wait for your lies.
kojikun (00:49 AM) :
You lie to me NOW, or give up.
NanoGator @ Home (00:51 AM) :
you're completely wrong.
kojikun (00:51 AM) :
ABOUT WHAT
NanoGator @ Home (00:51 AM) :
first contact predated the borg's appearance in voyager
NanoGator @ Home (00:51 AM) :
first contact was released inn november 96, the borg apppeared in march of 97
kojikun (00:51 AM) :
lmfao
kojikun (00:52 AM) :
one second
NanoGator @ Home (00:52 AM) :
unless you know of an ep i dont. (which is possible, i never followed voyager)
NanoGator @ Home (00:52 AM) :
and if you find that they were, that's fine, you can have that
NanoGator @ Home (00:52 AM) :
uh what are we arguing about again? You're more into the discussion than i am
kojikun (00:52 AM) :
You dislike the TNG borg.
NanoGator @ Home (00:52 AM) :
never said that
NanoGator @ Home (00:52 AM) :
i proved ya wrong on that but ya still think you're making a point
kojikun (00:53 AM) :
How so? You said you dislike the tech vampires, retard
NanoGator @ Home (00:53 AM) :
never said that
kojikun (00:53 AM) :
oh my GODS
NanoGator @ Home (00:53 AM) :
i said it'd be boring if they continued like that
kojikun (00:53 AM) :
SO YOU THOUGHT THEY WERE BORING
NanoGator @ Home (00:53 AM) :
there'd be nowhere fro that to go because they'd have no reason to be interested in engaging earth
NanoGator @ Home (00:53 AM) :
no, i thouoght they would be boring numbnuts
kojikun (00:53 AM) :
oh christ you are ridiculous.
NanoGator @ Home (00:53 AM) :
i.e if the borg in enterprise are like thhat
NanoGator @ Home (00:53 AM) :
you know, the part we were discussing
NanoGator @ Home (00:55 AM) :
heh im ridiculous? a.) you're the one who's pissed and name calling. b.) yuou're the one who's saying i said stuff i didnt. c.) you're the one trying to argue with me without making any attempt to understand. d.) you're the owe attempting to win with a 'debate fataility'
NanoGator @ Home (00:55 AM) :
so yeah, spare me the "im ridiculous' bit. you're the one with all teh issues dude
NanoGator @ Home (00:55 AM) :
througout all this, you're still trying to get me to say i said something i didnt, instead of trying to get me to clarify my stance
kojikun (00:55 AM) :
Go back to your lair, Darkstar.
NanoGator @ Home (00:55 AM) :
i was never given a chance to do that originally
NanoGator @ Home (00:55 AM) :
awww concession accepted buddy. *Hug*
kojikun (00:56 AM) :
You conceeded when you said you liked TNG borg then said they were boring (or would be boring if they stayed the same borg they had always been, which is the exact same thing)
NanoGator @ Home (00:56 AM) :
okay, for the last time, i didnt say "they were borign"
NanoGator @ Home (00:56 AM) :
now repeat what i said "Nano never said they WERE boring"
kojikun (00:56 AM) :
YOU SAID THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN IF THEY DIDNT CHANGE
kojikun (00:57 AM) :
WHICH
kojikun (00:57 AM) :
means that their previous form was boring
NanoGator @ Home (00:57 AM) :
exactly
NanoGator @ Home (00:57 AM) :
thank you
kojikun (00:57 AM) :
So shut your fucking mouth.
NanoGator @ Home (00:57 AM) :
now please act on your understanding of that point instead of going back to it like a woman

I blocked him, and when i told him he went off cackling like a typical trekkie retard.

Christ, I swear, if I knew him IRL I'd bludgeon him to death.

reads thru post



Here's 5 minutes of my life I cant get back, you know that?

Unfortunately, this sort of reasoning likely reflects why B&B are doing this sort of BS in the first place.

They seem to be cast as Ismay on the Titanic, with a reserved seat on the last boat out, and get to turn their back as the ship breaks in half and sinks.......

Holy shit, talk about worming out of the hook! Gah!

FYI thanks to Voyager we know that Q Who with Picard was not the first time the Borg were known about. The Hansons knew about them and were researching them and using a ship of Starfleet design. This ENT episide will actualy tie up some loose ends and explain how the Hansons knew about the Borg yet Picard made the first well known contact. In the ENT episode Earth gets its first taste and they quickly classify the information and keep it very secret. Eventualy they send the Hansons out to study the Borg, then some years later Picard and Co. make the first offical contact and survive.

That was a painful debate to read. You kept yout temper better than i would have Koji

I will however pont out one thing. Borg are interested in Technology and Biology.

"We are the Borg, Lower Your Shields And Power Down Your Weapons. Your Biological and Technological Distinctiveness Will Be Added To Our Own. Resistance Is Futile"

this isnt the first time me and him have argued, and he usually argues style over substance. its so typical. and yet so annoying.

Darth Pounder wrote:That was a painful debate to read. You kept yout temper better than i would have Koji

I will however pont out one thing. Borg are interested in Technology and Biology.

"We are the Borg, Lower Your Shields And Power Down Your Weapons. Your Biological and Technological Distinctiveness Will Be Added To Our Own. Resistance Is Futile"

Wait a minute. As I recall, the first time we heard that speech was when Picard delivered a different version of it as Locutus. Does anyone have that first version handy?

EDIT: My sympathies on the migraine that exchange must've given you, Koji... having read it, I'm convinced that you were actually having a conversation with Berman & Braga's favorite Ouija Board...

Wow, I took way to fucking long to stop reading that and continue on with the thread.

anarchistbunny wrote:Wow, I took way to fucking long to stop reading that and continue on with the thread.

Funny, I never read much more then a few lines of an arguement before posting. Mainly because with the trektards, the arguement is summed up in the first few lines and repeats thereafter.

That was painful to read.

Alyeska wrote:FYI thanks to Voyager we know that Q Who with Picard was not the first time the Borg were known about. The Hansons knew about them and were researching them and using a ship of Starfleet design. This ENT episide will actualy tie up some loose ends and explain how the Hansons knew about the Borg yet Picard made the first well known contact. In the ENT episode Earth gets its first taste and they quickly classify the information and keep it very secret. Eventualy they send the Hansons out to study the Borg, then some years later Picard and Co. make the first offical contact and survive.

But didn't the Hansons have a model of a Borg cube and were looking for that? Even assuming somehow all the above was true, how would they have a model of a Borg cube, since at best they've got only a junked up piece of a Sphere for Borg ship design?



And incidently, I find it funny as hell that this Nanogator fellow is tell you that you don't make sense, kojikun, when he is the one talking bullshit. That argument he made (with the whole glassjaw Borg Drones surviving getting exploded/entry into the atmosphere/slamming into the drone at orbital speeds, and not only that, landing on the opposite side of the planet from where the ship exploded thing) didn't fly the first time I heard it and doesn't fly now.

I hope that wasn't your friend's real screen name that you just posted to a public BBS for anyone to see. If somebody read it and gave him shit he might trace it back to you.

Oh, its his real screenname on ICQ. I'll post his # later. and hes been blocked permanently, so i dont care if he traces it back to me. if anything, he'll come to SDN and try to DEFEND his point of view! then the well knowledges engineer fellows, like mike, can lay the smackdown on his ass.

kojikun wrote:Oh, its his real screenname on ICQ. I'll post his # later. and hes been blocked permanently, so i dont care if he traces it back to me. if anything, he'll come to SDN and try to DEFEND his point of view! then the well knowledges engineer fellows, like mike, can lay the smackdown on his ass.

You're damn well not going to post his number. Inviting harassment over your private spats with some one is not acceptable, is that understood?