Federation Socialist and Monocultural origins

Spyder · Post by **Spyder** » 2003-05-26 07:57am

Has it ever been explained at exactly which point the Federation decided to stop using money and everyone turned around and said "our way of life sucks, let's become a race of nerds!"?

I'd like to know what the official justification is because there is so much in human nature that seems to get brushed aside with a hand wave. Why would all the Jihads stop? Why would Isreal and Palestine stop going at it? Why would Bill Gates suddenly decide that money wasn't really that important? What could possibly make 90% of the world's population abandon what they believe in?

Tribun · Post by **Tribun** » 2003-05-26 08:41am

Don't really know. Must have happend sometimes between ST VI and TNG. I really wonder how that kind of state can work? It reminds me greatly of the German Democratic Republic (In German called the "DDR") which ceased th exist 1990. They called themselves "the first socialist state on German ground".
Somehow the Federation reminds me of them....

Dark Primus · Post by **Dark Primus** » 2003-05-26 11:22am

I seriously doubt people were willing to give upp the advantages of being wealthy. But I do find it strange that people are accepting it.
For the generation who gave it up must have been a hard time. But the generation that came after probably didn't have any problems.

TrailerParkJawa · Post by **TrailerParkJawa** » 2003-05-26 12:03pm

Im still curious how they handle property. Picard's family is has land in France, but do they have a deed of title? Or does the Federation simply hand out land based on service or merit.

Tribun · Post by **Tribun** » 2003-05-26 01:25pm

If I remember correct, in the communist states in Europe, all what was bigger than a vehicle (ergo houses, land, factories) were property of the state. You could buy in a house, but didn't own it, but bought the permission to live in it. Similar for land.
If it is really this way in the federation, the state owns all bigger than vehicles, than they must have sized all that property, to then tell the former owners, that they are now at the mercy of the state.

Cruel idea......

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 2003-05-26 05:03pm

What if these cocked up Universal Translators send out signals that convince people of the righteousness of the UFP's cause. I would expect that this device has a limited range so one per person. I would also think that other races have a device that works similarily but is not the same model, thus they are not under Federation control. This device's affect may work in such a way that after a few years in service, the person is completely lost.

So is that plausible or not?

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2003-05-26 05:14pm

Perhaps the betazoids are communist and when they achieved first contact, invisible psychic dominators were put on earth and make everyone believe "a socialist paradise" is a good idea, as detrimental as it is to development and progression notwithstanding.

Blame it on the betazoids i say.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2003-05-26 06:05pm

Concilors my ass. Troi's a political officer!

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » 2003-05-26 07:52pm

So then how the hell did Betazoid get captured by the Dominion? Don't you think they would have that very well guarded?

HappyTarget · Post by **HappyTarget** » 2003-05-27 12:02am

^ Merely a carefully constructed propaganda campagin backed up by some telepathic suggestions. This way no one would suspect that they are really in charge, for if they were that powerful, they most certainly would never have been overrun right?

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-05-27 05:25am

Rye wrote:Perhaps the betazoids are communist and when they achieved first contact, invisible psychic dominators were put on earth and make everyone believe "a socialist paradise" is a good idea, as detrimental as it is to development and progression notwithstanding.

(The theme from "Hunt For Red October" starts playing)

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2003-05-27 08:02am

Rye wrote:Perhaps the betazoids are communist and when they achieved first contact, invisible psychic dominators were put on earth and make everyone believe "a socialist paradise" is a good idea, as detrimental as it is to development and progression notwithstanding.

Blame it on the betazoids i say.

Blame Betazed!
Blame Betazed!

They're not even a real planet anyway...

JodoForce · Post by **JodoForce** » 2003-05-27 08:48am

Simon H.Johansen wrote: (The theme from "Hunt For Red October" starts playing)

Which theme?

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-05-27 09:44am

Some form of mind control is involved, or they’ve altered there genes to be less independent and greedy.

Smiling Bandit · Post by **Smiling Bandit** » 2003-05-27 11:06am

Why would all the Jihads stop? Why would Isreal and Palestine stop going at it? Why would Bill Gates suddenly decide that money wasn't really that important? What could possibly make 90% of the world's population abandon what they believe in?

As I recall, pretty much all the Israelis, Palestinians, and so forth got blowed up by nuclear war. I may be misremembering.

Posbi · Post by **Posbi** » 2003-05-27 11:37am

Who the hell would waste nukes on them?

TrailerParkJawa · Post by **TrailerParkJawa** » 2003-05-27 11:44am

Posbi wrote:Who the hell would waste nukes on them?

I think the notion is that they nuked each other. Have we ever seen any good references to how many people died and what nations dissappeared in the various wars ST refers too?

apocolypse · Post by **apocolypse** » 2003-05-27 11:54am

TrailerParkJawa wrote:
Posbi wrote:Who the hell would waste nukes on them?
I think the notion is that they nuked each other. Have we ever seen any good references to how many people died and what nations dissappeared in the various wars ST refers too?

IIRC Riker said that 600 million died in WWIII.

Tribun · Post by **Tribun** » 2003-05-27 11:59am

IIRC Riker said that 600 million died in WWIII.

By the way it seems to be a way to low calc. Over a billion would be more plausible.....

apocolypse · Post by **apocolypse** » 2003-05-27 12:03pm

And actually, just thought about this too. *raises flame shields* Why the hell is everyone so obsessed with the Feds either being or not being socialist. Okay, we don't really know enough about how the economy works. The creation and usage of replicators has altered the economic structure. They claim to not use money, yet we've seen currency being exchanged in DS9. Everyone wants to harp on the "evil commie Feds!!" but point is, it works for them. As far as anyone knows, it's not a bad system. People are fed and cared for (and before anyone goes there, I'm not commie/socialist/Trekkie wanker/etc) and seem to basically get whatever they want.

And as far as land ownership, you don't own the land you live on either. At least not in America. You can buy and own your house, but if you don't pay your property tax, the government can and will take it from you.

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2003-05-27 01:23pm

JodoForce wrote:
Simon H.Johansen wrote: (The theme from "Hunt For Red October" starts playing)
Which theme?

The one with the chorus singing in Russian. "Hymn To Red October", I think it's called.

Setzer · Post by **Setzer** » 2003-05-27 05:57pm

Posbi wrote:Who the hell would waste nukes on them?

Whaddya mean, WASTE? It's the only Middle East peace plan that might actually succeed.