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Something which I wondered about is: Why haven't we seen a single Romulan warship bigger than a scout but smaller than a D'Deridex until the Valdore was introduced in "Nemesis"??

The Federation and Klingons have a lot of size variation in their fleet, so why did the Romulans limit themselves to small scout ships and really big dreadnoughts until ~2378 (where I suppose Nemesis is set), when they finally introduced a medium-scale cruiser??

I'm not the only one aware of this lack of diversity, since all the "Star Trek: Armada" and "Starfleet Command" computer games have included a horde of made-up-on-the-spot Romulan warships to fill the size gap between the scout ship and D'Deridex.

Writer's stupidity?

[hijack]Actually, whats even stranger is that all organizations have a formula for making ships:
Starfleet: 1 saucer, 1 OR 2 engineering hulls, 2, 3 OR 4 nacelles
Borg: Large geometric shapes
Klingons: Bridge, really skinny neck and wings
Romulans: Large ships with holes in them.
[/hijack]

could be explained be the fact that only the larger D'Deridex class was allowed to operate near the border or outside Romulan borders because they wanted to give the illusion of the Romulan fleet being only larger ships while the smaller classes were limited to the Romulan territories or restricted from decloaking and being seen much.

The Romulans go for impressions a lot.

Think of it: You're in your Starfleet ship minding ya own buisness when 1.6 km of green nasty looking ship de-cloaks in your face.

How would you react? The Romulans love intimidating people.

Prehaps its just not in their mantality. From what I gather, they prefer to either slip pat the enemy in small craft and infilitrate or blow their way in and devour what they want.

Or they just didn't see the need for it as they are rather stupid.

Actually, the old Star Trek RPG FASA Romulan Ship Guide has lots of Romulan ships classes in them. Most of them look like birds.

I think the Romulans in the TNG era just switched all production to those massive D'Dredrix class warships. Probably as a mass-production consideration.

I mean, think about it.

By hand, it takes what 1 month to build a car if you have the parts and tools by yourself? Versus 24 hours on an assembly line?

I think the Romulans where planning to go into "massproduction" assembly line mode with the warbird.

Which is scary...

I would think of it as an example of Romulan battle tactics. The Romulans think of their ships (after the failed encounter in TOS) perhaps the same way that the Spanish viewed their Galleons. Huge vessels with remarkable firepower, capable of carring a large force of troopers to take territory (either space or land).

The Race built Galleons of the British could out manuver the Spanish Galleons but still were out gunned by the bigger ships. The Spanish viewed them as floating castle's.

The Romulans could be thinking in simular terms; with the benifit of the Romulan Cloak, the need for intermeadiate ships is deminished and large multi purpose assualt ships with the ability to move freely in enemy territory and hold off a significant amount of enemy ships is located would be perferable (in their minds) than a large fleet with primary, secondary, and tershiary vessels.

As always, IMHO.

It might also (still using SoD here) be a matter of the Romulans primarily relying on artificially generated quantum singularities to run their warp cores. They may be able to run those warp cores of hydrogen run over the QS to generate plasma, thus removing the need for antimatter generation and storage and simplifying their logistics and infrastructure, but generating a tiny, stable black hole can't be cheap.

Therefore, it might be a matter of cost effectiveness. If it costs the same to produce a QS core for a big ship or for a small ship, and if it costs a lot either way, why build small ships unless you really have to? It would be much more cost effective to build the biggest effective warships that a QS warp core can support.

Unfortunately, it's just a logical idea, and thus not terribly Trek.

[Talshiar mode] Yes, no ships besides those. The *Valdore* is our newest and most advanced ship. [/Talshiar mode]

They're out there.


>>edit<< fixed spelling

Jeremy wrote:[Talshiar mode] Yes, no ships besides those. The *Valdore* is our newest and most advanced ship. [/Talshiar mode]

Their out there.

Everyone, be quiet or you might scare this noob away.

Jeramy, you might just make it here.

The reason is that the guy who made the D'deridex did a very good job and they never matched it in terms of coolness, thus they didn't bother..

Seriously, assuming all capabilities were equal, which would you rather fly around in a GCS or a D'deridex?

The in universe explanation would be that the romulans seek to intimidate their enemies, thus they use a very large design. Interestingly we only have one that is designated as a D'deridex, it is possible that several different classes of ship are based on the same design and fulfill different roles in the fleet.

NecronLord wrote:Seriously, assuming all capabilities were equal, which would you rather fly around in a GCS or a D'deridex?

Can there be any doubt? A nice, good-looking, intimidating pleasure cruiser or Blow-Ups Happen Inc.'s masterpiece?

Something which I wondered about is: Why haven't we seen a single Romulan warship bigger than a scout but smaller than a D'Deridex until the Valdore was introduced in "Nemesis"??

The Federation and Klingons have a lot of size variation in their fleet, so why did the Romulans limit themselves to small scout ships and really big dreadnoughts until ~2378 (where I suppose Nemesis is set), when they finally introduced a medium-scale cruiser??

I'm not the only one aware of this lack of diversity, since all the "Star Trek: Armada" and "Starfleet Command" computer games have included a horde of made-up-on-the-spot Romulan warships to fill the size gap between the scout ship and D'Deridex.

The reason for the warbird being the primary romulan warship may have something do with its advanced power plant.

The romulans are capable of generating stable artificial quantom singularities. They apparantly consider quantom singularities superior to conventional matter / anti - matter based power generation for they use them to power the mighty romulan warbird. Quantom singularity power plants may take significant space and require extensive safety and support systems, making them impractical for deployment aboard smaller starship. This is similar to modern day nuclear reactors which are more powerful than a conventional power source but can not be used in small ships due their great size. Considering how well the warbirds powered by singularities has served their cause over the years the romulans may not be willing to settle for a less powerful power generation system. This would force them rely exclusively on large vessels such as the warbird and the scimatar.

NecronLord wrote: Interestingly we only have one that is designated as a D'deridex, it is possible that several different classes of ship are based on the same design and fulfill different roles in the fleet.

Funnily enough, in "Star Trek: Armada", most of the non-D'deridex Romulan ships appeared to be scaled-down D'Deridexes. (However, in later games they became more distinct from the D'Deridex)

Funnily enough, in "Star Trek: Armada", most of the non-D'deridex Romulan ships appeared to be scaled-down D'Deridexes. (However, in later games they became more distinct from the D'Deridex)

IMHO they were just close enough that you could easily tell who had built them, but far enough apart that you could still easily tell which class they were. Shrikes and Griffins are kick ass designs IMHO, and actually look like they are TNG+ Romulan designs. Also why I liked the Valdore. It was close enough that one could easily tell she's a Romulan design, yet also distinct enough to never be mistaken for a D'deridex.

Also, the more distinct from D'deridex versions from various Trek games are the ones that look less "Romulan" to me. (shrug)

Simon H.Johansen wrote:Something which I wondered about is: Why haven't we seen a single Romulan warship bigger than a scout but smaller than a D'Deridex until the Valdore was introduced in "Nemesis"??

It is easier to kitbash Fed ships than it is Romulan and Klingon ships. This is why during the era of TNG and DS9 you really only saw two new Klingon and one new Romulan class. With more reliance on CGI now a days, you will see more. That is why you are getting more classes on Nemesis and Enterforaprize.

Wicked Pilot wrote: That is why you are getting more classes on Nemesis and Enterforaprize.

I thought the Romulan ships of Enterprise looked a lot like the Romulan warship from TOS??

HappyTarget wrote:

Funnily enough, in "Star Trek: Armada", most of the non-D'deridex Romulan ships appeared to be scaled-down D'Deridexes. (However, in later games they became more distinct from the D'Deridex)

IMHO they were just close enough that you could easily tell who had built them, but far enough apart that you could still easily tell which class they were.

Pics??

http://www.st-armada.com/
Just look around. Click on the Romulan icon. Also check the sketches.
Personally, I thought they were very reasonable designs, by ST standards. Significant reseblence to the warbird, but most were single-hulled and all looked different enough that you could tell them apart at a glance.

Simon H.Johansen wrote:

Wicked Pilot wrote: That is why you are getting more classes on Nemesis and Enterforaprize.

I thought the Romulan ships of Enterprise looked a lot like the Romulan warship from TOS??

Did you expect to see a warbird?

Simon H.Johansen wrote:I thought the Romulan ships of Enterprise looked a lot like the Romulan warship from TOS??

TOS




ENT




They have similiar structure, but the ENT one is given the green TNG treatment.

Wicked Pilot wrote:They have similiar structure, but the ENT one is given the green TNG treatment.

Also, the Enterprise version looks much more advanced than TOS version. Especially the nacelles.
The FASA games version of Romulan ships from that era were oh-so much more acceptable. They were limited to artwork in a manual, and only one picture IIRC, but it MADE SENSE!

The reason could also be a result of placing the greater premium on standardisation. They have one or two designs they know will work reliably, so they simply build lots of those.

Consider: from what is observable in the various episodes, the Romulans appear essentially to be isolationists. This is a "power" which vanished from galactipolitics altogether for fifty-three years from what can reasonably judged to have been some sort of internal upheaval. Their overall strategic approach seems to be oriented towards destabilisation of their enemies and armed neutrality. They're not interested in having a large expansive empire as much as ensuring that nobody can invade and conquer their homespaces. Aiding the Duras Revolution is aimed at breaking the Federation/Klingon alliance and throwing the Empire into chaos; the pitiful "invasion" attempt of Vulcan with only 2000 ground troops less a serious effort at conquest and more a demonstration that the Federation cannot effectively defend its own territory —prompting either internal chaos within the Federation or encouraging another power to attack a Federation exposed as a paper-tiger.

If the Romulans are isolationists, they have no need for a wide variety of ship-types. All they require are platforms which deliver raw brute-force when and where needed and for long-range scouting. Also, the Romulans may lack the industrial base required to produce a star-navy filled out with a wide variety of ship-types to perform specialised missions or tactical functions.

Wicked Pilot wrote:They have similiar structure, but the ENT one is given the green TNG treatment.

Why is green as a colour used to denote "alien-ness" in sci-fi so often??

Wicked Pilot wrote:They have similiar structure, but the ENT one is given the green TNG treatment.

This also happened to the klingons from TOS to the movies and TNG. I think that they wanted to a bigger difference in ship color other than a bird bird painted on the hull.