Microscopic SW galaxy vs. Federation

[Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi]

Let's say some desperate Trekkie says that the DS is only a foot wide, Imperial citizens are microscopic lifeforms, and SW planets are the size of a city block, and debates with it. The Imperials still have the same number of ships, and the firepower levels are just scaled down. Who would win?

[Sea Skimmer]

I'm writing a fan fic with a 3 foot ISD.

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

The Death Star's gravity crushes them.

[Alyeska]

Well... If you shrunk down the SW galaxy to acomodate the 1.5c comment, that would mean SW has the ability to destroy a multi KM asteroid in a single shot. ST would have range and speed advantages and could easily contain the SW "Galaxy"

But any rationale person understands that the 1.5c comment is not to be taken litterally.

[Mr Bean]

The People spotaniusly die as life that small can not accudmate intellgence AND Vital Body Functons

Gold Fish for example have 3 second memories.....

And we are talking beings/stuff even smaller...


However thanks to ICS we know these Microsopic beings still weild Gigatons of Damage and yes a Single ISD could carve up the entire Federation

Or would you like to explain how in the hell the Feddys are gonna manage to hit it (This is of coures assuming the whole entire race spontatiously dies problem)

[SPOOFE]

The People spotaniusly die as life that small can not accudmate intellgence AND Vital Body Functons

Life also cannot mystically cause objects to violate the laws of gravity, or shoot lightning out of their fingers...

[His Divine Shadow]

But any rationale person understands that the 1.5c comment is not to be taken litterally.

It's actually never said to be 1.5c at all, just .5 past C, point fives of what really?

[Alyeska]

However thanks to ICS we know these Microsopic beings still weild Gigatons of Damage and yes a Single ISD could carve up the entire Federation

Actually, no. If you follow rules of canon, onscreen has higher presedence. That means Han Solo's 1.5c quote is more highly rated. Thus when you shrink everything down, they have the "equivilant" rating in the GT range. But their "rea" firepower would be much lower.

For an EXTREMELY rough comparison.

SW Galaxy is 120,000 lightyears in diameter. Lets just say that with the 1.5c quote the SW Galaxy is now 1 lighyear in diameter. That is .0008% the size of the original SW galaxy. Now lets apply this same percent to everything else (I know its not strictly correct or anything, it is a ROUGH aproximation). .0008% multiplied by 200 GT equals.

If my math is correct, 200 GT is the same as 200,000,000 KT.

200,000,000 x .0008% = 1600 KT, 1.6 MT. I seem to recall the most generous HTL scaling was 800 GT, so it scales down to 6.4 MT.

Now, what sort of range does this 6.4MT HTL have? Lets assume 10 light seconds (roughly 3 million KM)

3,000,000 x .0008% = 24km

Not exactly stunning figures anymore.

Ships that could originally got .9c are now limited to 2.16 km per second.

[Darth Wong]

The People spotaniusly die as life that small can not accudmate intellgence AND Vital Body Functons

Life also cannot mystically cause objects to violate the laws of gravity, or shoot lightning out of their fingers...

Unprecedented phenomena do not invalidate pre-existing observations. If we suspend disbelief, we accept that there are forces out there which we haven't yet observed, but it doesn't mean that a human being can be shunk to the size of an ant, because all of the pre-existing observations are still there, and they indicate a whole lot of scaling laws which preclude the idea.

{EDIT: other problems involve stars producing nuclear fusion despite the absence of sufficient gravitational force from a micro-stellar mass, planets retaining atmosphere despite the absence of sufficient gravity from their mass, etc. So if the SW galaxy were shrunk down, it would have to retain much of its mass anyway, so everything would be ultra-dense, even people. Han Solo might be able to shrug off a phaser blast}

[His Divine Shadow]

I seem to recall the most generous HTL scaling was 800 GT, so it scales down to 6.4 MT

LOL!
Whoever gave you THAT scaling?
Mine is the most generous I've encountered, 2.5TT

[Mr Bean]

Life also cannot mystically cause objects to violate the laws of gravity, or shoot lightning out of their fingers...

Explained away as extreme EM Field Control ability

You know now we can "Levitate" objects using very lage magnets? Which can also be used to cause lightning like phenmon

However this is quite diffrent as it viloates more than enough laws


1. Lungs to small to draw enough Oxygen for Bodysize
2. Vastly decreased brain capacity means Dumber than Gold-Fish people
3. Heart to slow to pump Blood far enough
4. At that size controled FIRE would be quite impossible

Also the whole Superfast Proccesors?
To big....
By size alone they are limited to. hmm quick dirty estmate

Ahh .001KHTZ Computer at best, anything else would be bigger than thier houses

[Alyeska]

I seem to recall the most generous HTL scaling was 800 GT, so it scales down to 6.4 MT

LOL!
Whoever gave you THAT scaling?
Mine is the most generous I've encountered, 2.5TT

Ok, change "generous" to mid range. Even with the extreme 2.5TT that scales down to 20MT

[His Divine Shadow]

No wait, what I meant to say, mine is the most generously /low-end/ of 2.5TT

[SPOOFE]

Unprecedented phenomena do not invalidate pre-existing observations. If we suspend disbelief, we accept that there are forces out there which we haven't yet observed, but it doesn't mean that a human being can be shunk to the size of an ant, because all of the pre-existing observations are still there, and they indicate a whole lot of scaling laws which preclude the idea.

Granted. But the OP set out a stipulation - one meant in fun and jest, obviously - so I see no reason why we should quibble about those stipulations instead of just participating in the thought experiment.

Aly...

Not exactly stunning figures anymore.

Considering that these figures are for ships about the size of a piece of spacedust, I think that's pretty impressive, actually.

[Darth Wong]

Unprecedented phenomena do not invalidate pre-existing observations. If we suspend disbelief, we accept that there are forces out there which we haven't yet observed, but it doesn't mean that a human being can be shunk to the size of an ant, because all of the pre-existing observations are still there, and they indicate a whole lot of scaling laws which preclude the idea.

Granted. But the OP set out a stipulation - one meant in fun and jest, obviously - so I see no reason why we should quibble about those stipulations instead of just participating in the thought experiment.

Fair enough, which is why I pointed out that they would have to be composed of some kind of incredibly exotic super-dense form of matter. This would make them incredibly difficult to destroy, since their small size gives them an extremely small target profile and radiation absorption cross-section, yet their mass and power would be vastly out of proportion to what we might expect from beings made of normal matter.

Not exactly stunning figures anymore.

Considering that these figures are for ships about the size of a piece of spacedust, I think that's pretty impressive, actually.

The scaling is wrong. If we use linear volume scaling, then their planets should not hold together and their suns should not light. Therefore, we must correct the scaling for mass, and find that they are made of exotic super-dense matter. Everything from ships to people.

[Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi]

Well, if a microscopic ship can fly through space without being incinerated by a star's heat because of the low (or high?) surface area-to-volume ratio, then it's made of pretty strong material.

Assuming the small DS was 1m wide, we're looking a 4E15 difference in volume, if my calculations are correct. Now, one DS blast releases 1E38 joules of energy. A 1m DS would release about 2.5E22 joules of energy in one blast, using simple scaling mehtods. Notr bad for something the size of a beach ball.

[Alyeska]

Not bad for something the size of a beach ball.

LOL, I might have to quote you on that one.

[SPOOFE]

Ha... maybe we should resign this debate as one of the silliest (though highly amusing) ideas ever.

[StarshipTitanic]

If you're taking the 1.5c quote literally, why not take the "half of the Imperial starfleet" quote literally, too.

Microscopic ISDs weilding 79 yottatons of destructive power...

[Typhonis 1]

Shoot ewbven if the Star destroyers are now wielding say 6.4 mt power this is scary from the Feds view point in that how do they hit something the size of a Terran insect?>

[Crayz9000]

Let's say some desperate Trekkie says that the DS is only a foot wide, Imperial citizens are microscopic lifeforms, and SW planets are the size of a city block, and debates with it. The Imperials still have the same number of ships, and the firepower levels are just scaled down. Who would win?

You can't just pick and choose which universal constants you want to change. If you change one, all get changed.

[Romulan_nemesis]

Either a. shoot the galaxy with a phaser, or....

beam the entire galaxy into an omega particle and detonating it, thusly destroying the sw galaxy forever, and no war with the empire.

Wait...my bad.....
study it for a very long time first....then beam it into omega and detonate the particle. Then warp out really fast.

[The Yosemite Bear]

Quick Rogue one, I'm going in and making a run on Janeways's ear, a perfect shot and only a perfect shot will hit that scaled three meter brain partcle in her head.