What's B&B's biggest crime?

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2002-11-13 04:10pm

Laziness. Everything that they have ever done to ST has derived from their laziness to actually learn about it and actually make an effort.

Perinquus · Post by **Perinquus** » 2002-11-13 04:21pm

neoolong wrote:Laziness. Everything that they have ever done to ST has derived from their laziness to actually learn about it and actually make an effort.

There's something to that, I think. Plus, back in the mid 60s, Star Trek was kind of a dream project for Gene Roddenberry - the chance to do something interesting, new, and visionary - intelligent sci-fi, for mature as well as younger viewers, without all the kid stuff and schlock it mostly had before that. It was an actual labor of love.

For B&B, it's just a cash cow they can milk. I don't think they really give a rat's ass about the franchise in its own right.

Admiral Drason · Post by **Admiral Drason** » 2002-11-13 05:59pm

It was all of Voyager, and Generations that did it for me.
B&B can rot in hell for there crimes against humanity.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2002-11-13 06:09pm

Perinquus wrote:
neoolong wrote:Laziness. Everything that they have ever done to ST has derived from their laziness to actually learn about it and actually make an effort.
There's something to that, I think. Plus, back in the mid 60s, Star Trek was kind of a dream project for Gene Roddenberry - the chance to do something interesting, new, and visionary - intelligent sci-fi, for mature as well as younger viewers, without all the kid stuff and schlock it mostly had before that. It was an actual labor of love.

For B&B, it's just a cash cow they can milk. I don't think they really give a rat's ass about the franchise in its own right.

Didn't they even say that they have never even watched TOS? They also seemed to take pride in that.

Perinquus · Post by **Perinquus** » 2002-11-13 06:18pm

neoolong wrote:
Perinquus wrote:
neoolong wrote:Laziness. Everything that they have ever done to ST has derived from their laziness to actually learn about it and actually make an effort.
There's something to that, I think. Plus, back in the mid 60s, Star Trek was kind of a dream project for Gene Roddenberry - the chance to do something interesting, new, and visionary - intelligent sci-fi, for mature as well as younger viewers, without all the kid stuff and schlock it mostly had before that. It was an actual labor of love.

For B&B, it's just a cash cow they can milk. I don't think they really give a rat's ass about the franchise in its own right.
Didn't they even say that they have never even watched TOS? They also seemed to take pride in that.

If they did, it just goes to show how out of touch they are with what Star Trek's oldest and most loyal fans want. And how out of touch Paramount is for letting them do it.

This is one of those things that just stupefies you when you think about it. Paramount has this money machine called Star Trek, and rather than leave it in the hands of people who can give the fans what they want, and assure it long life (and incidentally, lure in new fans by offering the same kind of quality shows that drew the old ones in in the first place), they turn it over to these two no-talent literary prostitutes, and watch them take pride in pissing all over the show, alienate its fan base, and sneeringly dismiss the things that made it great in the first place.

It's not just that Paramount seems to be destroying the goose that laid the golden egg; it's like they want to destroy it.

CNS Sarajevo · Post by **CNS Sarajevo** » 2002-11-13 06:40pm

If B&B never watched TOS, that explains a lot.

Having no respect for TOS and turning the Federation into a p*ssified, socialistic shadow of itself.

There's a line from the movie Kuffs: "Never trust a bald barber. He has no respect for your hair."

Hmm....who instead?

J Michael Straczynski: Babylon 5 was a landmark of science fiction, but I watch Star Trek to have fun, not probe metaphysics of why <vorlon>we have always been here</vorlon>.

David Kemper (Farscape): Not bad. The wisecracking and the action would've gone along with the spirit of TOS. I don't know if it'd be as good for a show about the Enterprise as it would for a band of smugglers in the neutral zone, though.

Joss Whedon (Buffy): Also not bad. Lots of good action, always freaky.

Anyway, I'm rambling.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-11-13 06:41pm

Their biggest crime is Enterprise. Terrible premise+terrible characters+terrible plots=terrible show.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2002-11-13 06:52pm

I don't think it was that they did not ever watch TOS, I think it was that they did not like TOS.

Ronald Moore, who was a major force in DS9 and who left Voyager some time after joining, wrote a big criticism of Voyager and to a lesser extent B&B.

I encourage you all to download and read it.

http://www.geocities.com/brain1701/voyager.txt

Perinquus · Post by **Perinquus** » 2002-11-13 06:52pm

Now that I think of it, there is an old quote by Abraham Lincoln I am reminded of. I wish I could give the exact quote, but paraphrased he said: beware of those who above all else thirst and burn for distinction, for they can seldom find satisfaction in maintaining an edifice erected by others.

That describes B&B to a fucking tee! They can't be satisfied in maintaining the edifice of Star Trek that Roddenberry created, but they have to pull it all down and remake it in their image. Unfortunately for us, their image sucks like a hoover on steroids.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman · Post by **Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman** » 2002-11-13 09:01pm

JANEWAY

ViciousMink · Post by **ViciousMink** » 2002-11-13 10:00pm

Uraniun235 wrote:I don't think it was that they did not ever watch TOS, I think it was that they did not like TOS.

Ronald Moore, who was a major force in DS9 and who left Voyager some time after joining, wrote a big criticism of Voyager and to a lesser extent B&B.

I encourage you all to download and read it.

http://www.geocities.com/brain1701/voyager.txt

I had a read through this. It is a LONG document, put aside some time to read it. I think he sums up very nicely what happened to Trek. And even though he's polite throughout the whole thing, it seems to me that it was a REALLY bad spat from Brannon that made him pack up and leave.

Mike_6002 · Post by **Mike_6002** » 2002-11-14 03:17pm

Creating Enterprise, Voyager, ruining TNG(Whenever they got there) ,DS9 (Season 4+)

Ruining Star Trek, and selling it's soul to the devil for shitloads of money

Being alive

I want LT. Hit-Man (ASVS) to kill the little fuckers very slowly, and very painfully using the Dark side of the force to the max

And if LT. gave me the corpses to dispose of I would send it back to paramount one tiny piece at a time

Muhahahaha

johnmarkley · Post by **johnmarkley** » 2002-11-14 04:11pm

Failed Glory wrote:Because every time I look Berman and Braga manage to outdo themselves, I think they're greatest crime against sci-fi is yet to come.

Good God, don't even joke about that!

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2002-11-14 04:14pm

CNS Sarajevo wrote:

Having no respect for TOS and turning the Federation into a p*ssified, socialistic shadow of itself.

Wait.. I'm confusedm but isn't that what Gene had wanted? Didn't he envision a socialist utopia?

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2002-11-14 06:03pm

VF5SS wrote:
CNS Sarajevo wrote:

Having no respect for TOS and turning the Federation into a p*ssified, socialistic shadow of itself.
Wait.. I'm confusedm but isn't that what Gene had wanted? Didn't he envision a socialist utopia?

Seemed like it. Roddenberry's ideas weren't always good. Though B&B did still screw it up.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2002-11-14 07:54pm

neoolong wrote:
VF5SS wrote:
CNS Sarajevo wrote:

Having no respect for TOS and turning the Federation into a p*ssified, socialistic shadow of itself.
Wait.. I'm confusedm but isn't that what Gene had wanted? Didn't he envision a socialist utopia?
Seemed like it. Roddenberry's ideas weren't always good. Though B&B did still screw it up.

It was and it was stupid. But that doesn't mean B&B aren't running with it and ruining trek further.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2002-11-14 08:02pm

"There's a crack in the event horizon..."

Mike_6002 · Post by **Mike_6002** » 2002-11-14 09:57pm

In repsonse to GTA statement

Worse anal rape of science ever want to send Tony Sorpano after B&B

Damn writer can't respect mathmatical bounderys

bozman · Post by **bozman** » 2002-11-14 11:16pm

Here is what I hate most about B & B (well, maybe not MOST, but this one really pissed me off). They f*$^#@* up the entire concept of the Borg. The Borg were introduced into Trek as being an unstoppable collective of really scary cyborgs that basically go around and force people to become part of them. These guys were basically meant to be an enemy that could not be conquered militarily. That is how they started.

Enter B & B with Voyager: The Borg are now the villian of the week. "Oh look, it's a Borg cube! Let's arm the phasers and destroy them so we can continue our trip home. Oh yes, we can negotiate with them now if we need to." Thanks B & B for f-ing up my favorite villain of all time. THANKS ALOT.

As if this wasn't enough, B & B expect us to believe that Janeway can stop the Borg, even if Picard could not. What? Janeway's stupid ass Intrepid class ship (the worst and lamest of the fleet... Oh look, the nacelles can move on a hinge!) is more powerful than the Enterprise? Or did she defeat them because of her superior command skills? I am really pissed off! F- you, B & B!

Zoink · Post by **Zoink** » 2002-11-19 01:19pm

B&B's worst crime is every episode of Voyager. As evidence I present to you the Voyager Episode that was on Last Night:

In this crapisode, Kes becomes fatally ill after exposure to a biogenic field. Its up to Janeway to find a cure! Janeway must put aside her natural instinct for rational analysis and put faith in a higher power. Science vs Faith!

Janeway is introduced as the "scientist." She staunchly believes that a rational scientific analysis can solve *any* problem. The doctor takes on this role, attempting without success to cure Kes throughout the episode.

A native of the planet explains that Janeway must go on a spiritual quest to find the cure. Janeway does, and through it she learns that her scientific beliefs are no different from religion (as she has "faith" in her laws and theories); and you must at times put aside rational thinking to just "believe" in something.

After much up-chucking from the TV viewers, we eventually get to the end of the episode. Against every natural instinct and every scientific analysis, Janeway must throw herself into the deadly biogenic field. She does and eventually this leads to the cure for Kes...

The moral of the story: Jumping off a building is OK as long as you have faith that you'll be OK. Thank you B&B!

Dennis Toy · Post by **Dennis Toy** » 2002-11-19 04:13pm

&B's worst crime is every episode of Voyager. As evidence I present to you the Voyager Episode that was on Last Night :

In this crapisode, Kes becomes fatally ill after exposure to a biogenic field. Its up to Janeway to find a cure! Janeway must put aside her natural instinct for rational analysis and put faith in a higher power. Science vs Faith!

Janeway is introduced as the "scientist." She staunchly believes that a rational scientific analysis can solve *any* problem. The doctor takes on this role, attempting without success to cure Kes throughout the episode.

A native of the planet explains that Janeway must go on a spiritual quest to find the cure. Janeway does, and through it she learns that her scientific beliefs are no different from religion (as she has "faith" in her laws and theories); and you must at times put aside rational thinking to just "believe" in something.

After much up-chucking from the TV viewers, we eventually get to the end of the episode. Against every natural instinct and every scientific analysis, Janeway must throw herself into the deadly biogenic field. She does and eventually this leads to the cure for Kes...

The moral of the story: Jumping off a building is OK as long as you have faith that you'll be OK. Thank you B&B!

You live in DC? I saw the first 4 min and said "nuff' said"

[/i]

Zoink · Post by **Zoink** » 2002-11-19 04:25pm

Dennis Toy wrote: You live in DC? I saw the first 4 min and said "nuff' said"

No Canada, but I (and most people in eastern Canada, I think) get the Fox feed from Rochester.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

What's B&B's biggest crime?

Crimes against Humanity

Oh, I know