8472 vs Alderaan

Shrykull · Post by **Shrykull** » 2003-11-15 01:06am

Could several 8472 ships cut through the plantary shield and destroy Alderaan. Maybe they could if more than 8 could join together and make a more powerful beam, how much stronger is Coruscant's planetary shield?

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2003-11-15 01:23am

Impossible to say. I'd lean towards "no", because the 8472 beam appeared to have little DET component if any, but anyone who claims to know is full of it. We barely know anything about the 8472 beam; all we know is what it isn't.

However, since it appears to be a non DET beam, the safe answer is no.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2003-11-15 01:40am

Little information available about the nature of the Species 8472 planet killer. So no conclusion could be made

Post by **AdmiralKanos** » 2003-11-15 01:45am

Well, we do know that after an extended firing sequence of several seconds, the planet was glowing and had ejected a large plume of matter into space but there was no bulk movement of matter and that it took some 15 seconds before it abruptly exploded. We can deduce that the bulk of the energy of the event was generated after the weapon stopped firing. We also know that the Alderaan energy shield stopped the DS superlaser blast for something like a tenth of a second IIRC, which means it absorbed orders of magnitude more energy than we observed in the "Scorpion" planet immediately after the beam-firing. So while it's possible that secondary mechanisms might cause massive damage on the surface, it's not unreasonable to predict that it's more likely for the shield to hold than to fail.

Shrykull · Post by **Shrykull** » 2003-11-15 02:10am

AdmiralKanos wrote:Well, we do know that after an extended firing sequence of several seconds, the planet was glowing and had ejected a large plume of matter into space but there was no bulk movement of matter and that it took some 15 seconds before it abruptly exploded. We can deduce that the bulk of the energy of the event was generated after the weapon stopped firing. We also know that the Alderaan energy shield stopped the DS superlaser blast for something like a tenth of a second IIRC, which means it absorbed orders of magnitude more energy than we observed in the "Scorpion" planet immediately after the beam-firing. So while it's possible that secondary mechanisms might cause massive damage on the surface, it's not unreasonable to predict that it's more likely for the shield to hold than to fail.

Can the shield be "worn down" after extended firing? Remember Han Solo was saying it would take 1000 imperial ships to destroy Alderaan (he knew it had a shield, right?) Did he mean one collective shot with every turbolaser of every ship? Or did he mean they could wear it down and get through eventually? But then we have admiral Dodonna saying the whole DS (superlaser and turbolasers) carry firepower equal to half the starfleet (I don't know how many ships the empire had at the time of ANH)

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2003-11-15 02:30am

Shrykull wrote:Can the shield be "worn down" after extended firing? Remember Han Solo was saying it would take 1000 imperial ships to destroy Alderaan (he knew it had a shield, right?) Did he mean one collective shot with every turbolaser of every ship? Or did he mean they could wear it down and get through eventually? But then we have admiral Dodonna saying the whole DS (superlaser and turbolasers) carry firepower equal to half the starfleet (I don't know how many ships the empire had at the time of ANH)

General Veers wrote:"My Lord, the fleet has moved out of lightspeed and has entered the Hoth system. Com-scan has detected an energy shield surrounding an area on the sixth planet. The shield is strong enough to withstand any bombardment."

—Star Wars Ep. V: The Empire Strikes Back

This is one of the reasons the Death Stars were built in the first place.

Kamakazie Sith · Post by **Kamakazie Sith** » 2003-11-15 04:37pm

Patrick Degan wrote:
Shrykull wrote:Can the shield be "worn down" after extended firing? Remember Han Solo was saying it would take 1000 imperial ships to destroy Alderaan (he knew it had a shield, right?) Did he mean one collective shot with every turbolaser of every ship? Or did he mean they could wear it down and get through eventually? But then we have admiral Dodonna saying the whole DS (superlaser and turbolasers) carry firepower equal to half the starfleet (I don't know how many ships the empire had at the time of ANH)

General Veers wrote:"My Lord, the fleet has moved out of lightspeed and has entered the Hoth system. Com-scan has detected an energy shield surrounding an area on the sixth planet. The shield is strong enough to withstand any bombardment."

—Star Wars Ep. V: The Empire Strikes Back
This is one of the reasons the Death Stars were built in the first place.

That and the torpedo spheres........

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-11-15 10:36pm

Perhaps he meant any bombardment the Executor and its escort ISDs could dish out. Surely he couldn't possibly mean the entire Imperial Starfleet is incapable of penetrating the theater shield after continuous bombardments, right?

Solauren · Post by **Solauren** » 2003-11-15 11:35pm

Indiscrimate bombardment was the problem.

I mean, sure, they could have ordered in lots of ships and performed a full power BDZ on the planet, and that would have taken out the shield in time, but that also risks the shields going out and a volley of Turbolaser firing hitting the assests Vader wanted (i.e Luke, Han, Leia, the Falcon, his old droids...) intact.

Would you recommend blasting a shield and risking that knowing Vader wanted prisoners?

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2003-11-16 11:58am

Shrykull wrote:Can the shield be "worn down" after extended firing? Remember Han Solo was saying it would take 1000 imperial ships to destroy Alderaan (he knew it had a shield, right?) Did he mean one collective shot with every turbolaser of every ship? Or did he mean they could wear it down and get through eventually? But then we have admiral Dodonna saying the whole DS (superlaser and turbolasers) carry firepower equal to half the starfleet (I don't know how many ships the empire had at the time of ANH)

Han Solo said something like "it would take a thousand ships with more power than..." and was cut off. He didn't just say "1000 imperial ships" or "1000 of the strongest imperial ship", he was implying it would take a thousand ships of an unknown power, likely higher firepower than any known ship in existence. At least that's what I understood.

I think he also meant the power needed to blow a planet into bits, not overcome shields and stuff.

Shrykull · Post by **Shrykull** » 2003-11-16 04:57pm

General Veers wrote:"My Lord, the fleet has moved out of lightspeed and has entered the Hoth system. Com-scan has detected an energy shield surrounding an area on the sixth planet. The shield is strong enough to withstand any bombardment."
This is one of the reasons the Death Stars were built in the first place.

How did the AT-AT's get down to the planet? What kind of ship drops them off? And why is it they'd be able to get through the shield (if it was a dome shaped shield covering a huge area which included the rebel base) with thier blasters if a ISD couldn't get through it with it's turbolasers. We've seen the droids from TPM walk through an energy shield, how could they? Guess the AT AT's must have been able too as well.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-11-16 05:16pm

Patrick Degan wrote:This is one of the reasons the Death Stars were built in the first place.

An Imperial armada bashed down the shields of Coruscant in the months preceding Palpatine's return and the launch of Operation Shadowhand, IIRC.

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2003-11-16 08:45pm

Shrykull wrote:
General Veers wrote:"My Lord, the fleet has moved out of lightspeed and has entered the Hoth system. Com-scan has detected an energy shield surrounding an area on the sixth planet. The shield is strong enough to withstand any bombardment."
This is one of the reasons the Death Stars were built in the first place.
How did the AT-AT's get down to the planet? What kind of ship drops them off? And why is it they'd be able to get through the shield (if it was a dome shaped shield covering a huge area which included the rebel base) with thier blasters if a ISD couldn't get through it with it's turbolasers. We've seen the droids from TPM walk through an energy shield, how could they? Guess the AT AT's must have been able too as well.

I believe the AT-ATs drop to the surface on repulsorlifts. They're boarded on stardestroyers along with the assault batallions. And it appears that there is a certain degree of field interference at ground level which can allow a slow-moving object to slip in beneath the perimetre of the energy-field envelope.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2003-11-17 01:33am

Actually Hoth didn't have a real planetary shield. A planetary shield has multiple generators over the whole planet which project peices of it and form together to be one giant barrier. Hoth only had one planetary shield generator, not enough to cover the whole planet, projecting a shield up over the base and surrounding area to prevent an ISD from just waltzing up and BDZing the base.

All the AT-AT's had to do was land off to the side of the shield and walk under it.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2003-11-17 07:26am

I believe the AT-ATs drop to the surface on repulsorlifts. They're boarded on stardestroyers along with the assault batallions. And it appears that there is a certain degree of field interference at ground level which can allow a slow-moving object to slip in beneath the perimetre of the energy-field envelope.

Maybe the hoth shield acted like the Gun Gun theater shield which allows slow moving objects to pass through.