ISD vs. GCS

[Lord Pounder]

In Darksaber the Star Dreadnaught Knight Hammer managed to cause massive damage to Yavin IV, forest fires so bad they where visible in space IIRC, and it was only a light random bombardment.

[Gustav32Vasa]

In Darksaber the Star Dreadnaught Knight Hammer managed to cause massive damage to Yavin IV, forest fires so bad they where visible in space IIRC, and it was only a light random bombardment.

Are you sure it was a light bombardment? That doesnt sound like Daala. When she noticed that Palleons ISD's was missing she was very pissed.

[Lord Pounder]

Yeah but she detected the large Imperial strike force on the ground. Daala may be thick but she's not that thick enough to willfully destroy Imperial hardware.

[Lord Revan]

Are you sure it was a light bombardment? That doesnt sound like Daala. When she noticed that Palleons ISD's was missing she was very pissed.

I meant to destroy the massassi structures in Yavin IV so so heavy bombarment would have been an overkill (Daala may be stupid sometimes, but she's still an admiral) and the forest wasn't targeted

[Gustav32Vasa]

Yeah but she detected the large Imperial strike force on the ground. Daala may be thick but she's not that thick enough to willfully destroy Imperial hardware.

Eh, Daala? If she sees a target she doesnt care whats between her and that target.

[Gustav32Vasa]

Are you sure it was a light bombardment? That doesnt sound like Daala. When she noticed that Palleons ISD's was missing she was very pissed.

I meant to destroy the massassi structures in Yavin IV so so heavy bombarment would have been an overkill (Daala may be stupid sometimes, but she's still an admiral) and the forest wasn't targeted

Overkill, you mean like send a fleet of 17 ISD's and one SSD to destroy a undefended school?

[Lord Revan]

Overkill, you mean like send a fleet of 17 ISD's and one SSD to destroy a undefended school?

a Jedi Academy is not same thing as a public school on Corusant and no capship bombarments were used Daala arrived (only ground forces anf/or TIEs).

[Gustav32Vasa]

Overkill, you mean like send a fleet of 17 ISD's and one SSD to destroy a undefended school?

a Jedi Academy is not same thing as a public school on Corusant and no capship bombarments were used Daala arrived (only ground forces anf/or TIEs).

You're rught that first only TIEs and those walking elephants was used, but when Daala arrived and she saw that Palleon was gone she ordered her fighters to stand down and used the ships weapons instead.

[Lord Revan]

You're rught that first only TIEs and those walking elephants was used, but when Daala arrived and she saw that Palleon was gone she ordered her fighters to stand down and used the ships weapons instead.

as she didn't know what was happend as the SDs were gone, but the troops remained (so she played it safe and desided to use ship gun to destroy the Academy (again only buildings were targeted), in case there was a Rebel taskforce that forced the SDs to flee)

[PainRack]

Okay, the idea that "light" bombardment was used is a bit silly, considering that Daala ordered "full power" to weapons. The initial strikes on the planet were most definitely full power strikes, strikes that caused entire strips of forest to disappear, visible from space. The "forest begins to burn" thus takes on a different connotation here, considering the scale of the effects involved, it most likely doesn't refer to smoke rising from the planet, visible in space, but more likely, burning debris and vapourised material thrown into the air after the attack.

The attacks from the perspective of the ground however was most likely precision attacks conducted by Daala, in support of her ground troops. This will explain the disparity between the two scenes.

[Gustav32Vasa]

Okay, the idea that "light" bombardment was used is a bit silly, considering that Daala ordered "full power" to weapons. The initial strikes on the planet were most definitely full power strikes, strikes that caused entire strips of forest to disappear, visible from space. The "forest begins to burn" thus takes on a different connotation here, considering the scale of the effects involved, it most likely doesn't refer to smoke rising from the planet, visible in space, but more likely, burning debris and vapourised material thrown into the air after the attack.

The attacks from the perspective of the ground however was most likely precision attacks conducted by Daala, in support of her ground troops. This will explain the disparity between the two scenes.

Why would one send groundtroops against the Jedi? I would think that 17 ISDs is enough to bombard the planet. And this was Palleons idea not Daalas.

[SirNitram]

Just a question, how many people here have actually considered how much energy is required to light signifigant chunks of a continent on fire, before declaring this bombardment puny?

[Darth Wong]

Just FYI, a 100 gigaton blast would produce a fireball less than 100km wide (although it will last for a rather long time; more than ten minutes). If it ignited continent-wide fires it would have to do so through secondary effects and favourable environmental conditions such as drought; even trees which were well within the blast radius of nuclear tests in the 1950s and 1960s were usually not lit on fire.

But of course, none of that will matter to the sort of person who makes pseudoscientific predictions of damage effects based on gut instinct rather than research.

[Sriad]

The damage done was no were near 200GT or even 200kT. One turbolaser hit a tree and the tree began to burn.

He's referring to ship-mounted weapons, not the blasters on a light scout walker.

I suspected that he was refering AT-ST blaster canons, since to date we have not seen turbolaser hit ground targets in the movies.

Hopefully in episode three.

[Lord Poe]

What these "Darksaber" idiots have refused to understand for years now is, that if you fire into a JUNGLE from orbit, of COURSE the surrounding foliage would catch on fire. It doesn't MATTER if the ship was targeting structures! Jump in the shower and try to get the top of your head wet and keep your hair dry!

[Connor MacLeod]

still need an edit button anyway

the imperials only had 4 bulk cruisers, 3 dreads, 2 carracks and ~ 50 tie fighters/customs ships. not much of a fleet

the hutts got toughter a lot of armed freighters/transports/yachts (big and small size), a collection of older star fighters and pirates/mercs (a few corvettes/partol ships etc.) to fight for them.

So the only time we have seen a BDZ is in NJO.

We never saw one in the NJO.

The Nar Shaddaa one was a BDZ and was mentioned to (in the Essential Chronology) to reduce the moon to "molten slag". Its worth noting that Nar Shaddaa was covered with kilometers-high buildings Coruscant-style as well.

And they expected to execute it within fifteen minutes. With 3 Dreadnaughts, 4 Bulk Cruisers, and a score or so of light patrol craft.

[Connor MacLeod]

Regarding Darksaber, its worth noting that according to the ANH novelization, the Massassi temples were extraordinarily resilient to "modern" weapons, so its likely that the apparent lack of damage is due to the fact the attacks were largely concentrated on the temples, rather than a general "depopulation" effort.

[Gustav32Vasa]

still need an edit button anyway

the imperials only had 4 bulk cruisers, 3 dreads, 2 carracks and ~ 50 tie fighters/customs ships. not much of a fleet

the hutts got toughter a lot of armed freighters/transports/yachts (big and small size), a collection of older star fighters and pirates/mercs (a few corvettes/partol ships etc.) to fight for them.

So the only time we have seen a BDZ is in NJO.

We never saw one in the NJO.

Yes we did. In Rebel Dawn the a SSD uses it on the Vong and the rebels were just a couple of kilometers away from the bombardment.

[Darth Fanboy]

That was an orbital bombardment, but not a full fledged BDZ.

[Darth Fanboy]

addendum to previous post:

The rebels could not be "a couple of kilometers" away from a BDZ. BDZ's cover the entire planet.

[Gustav32Vasa]

That was an orbital bombardment, but not a full fledged BDZ.

Whats the difference?

[Firefox]

BDZ (Base Delta Zero) is the order given to destroy all the resources of a planet (basically the upper crust is turned to slag). In other words, every scrap of land is melted, rivers, lakes and oceans are vaporized, and the atmosphere is blown away in the process. IIRC, even deep planetary shelters are wiped out.

The action described previously is only a targeted bombardment, not a full BDZ.

[Gustav32Vasa]

BDZ (Base Delta Zero) is the order given to destroy all the resources of a planet (basically the upper crust is turned to slag). In other words, every scrap of land is melted, rivers, lakes and oceans are vaporized, and the atmosphere is blown away in the process. IIRC, even deep planetary shelters are wiped out.

The action described previously is only a targeted bombardment, not a full BDZ.

But if the guns are 200GT+ then how can people survive km away? And not getting blinded looking.

[Firefox]

But if the guns are 200GT+ then how can people survive km away? And not getting blinded looking.

Because the rebels could have looked away, in addition to the yield of the weapons dialed down to avoid collateral damage.

[Gustav32Vasa]

But if the guns are 200GT+ then how can people survive km away? And not getting blinded looking.

Because the rebels could have looked away, in addition to the yield of the weapons dialed down to avoid collateral damage.

They didnt look away, atleast not Jaina. If they did dial down how could they cause as much damage to the enemy?