Most annoying Trek vs Wars arguments.

Jim Raynor · Post by **Jim Raynor** » 2002-12-06 12:37am

Another annoying argument that pisses me off is bullshit alliances. Although the debate is usually Empire vs. Federation, many Trekkies will try to change it to Empire vs. UFP + Klingons + Romulans + Borg + S8472 + Dominion......+every single 1 episode race ever seen in the history of Trek, as if all these different groups will suddenly act all buddy buddy. Sometimes they'll even take it further, and throw the Rebels onto the Trek side. They'll say "Well, the Rebels are likely to help the UFP. And since they can beat the Empire by themselves, we win." If you're gonna use that crappy argument, then does it still mean that ST beat SW? Also, why do they make up alliances between Trek factions with irreconcilible differences, yet assume that the Rebels and Empire can't get along when facing foreign threats (which they did do, against the Ssi-ruuk).

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-12-06 12:38am

Jim Raynor wrote:Another annoying argument that pisses me off is bullshit alliances. Although the debate is usually Empire vs. Federation, many Trekkies will try to change it to Empire vs. UFP + Klingons + Romulans + Borg + S8472 + Dominion......+every single 1 episode race ever seen in the history of Trek, as if all these different groups will suddenly act all buddy buddy. Sometimes they'll even take it further, and throw the Rebels onto the Trek side. They'll say "Well, the Rebels are likely to help the UFP. And since they can beat the Empire by themselves, we win." If you're gonna use that crappy argument, then does it still mean that ST beat SW? Also, why do they make up alliances between Trek factions with irreconcilible differences, yet assume that the Rebels and Empire can't get along when facing foreign threats (which they did do, against the Ssi-ruuk).

Generally I respond to such horrible arguments by claiming that the Borg and the Dominion would logically help the Empire, and since either of those races present an enormous threat to the UFP, the Empire wins.

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2002-12-06 02:50am

Everything about laser immunity (SW turbos being lasers or not doesn't disturb me much, I mean WHAT IF, makes no difference - a gigaton is a gigaton is a gigaton).

When Trekkies claim that Fed technology is higher because their ships look so sleek and their corridors and rooms are so big and clean. And that Star Wars tech is so low because it all looks like greasy machinery.

Warp strafing. Besides I've never seen a Star Trek ship go at warp in any direction except forward - except Cubes because well they just rotate pointlessly and stuff.

Borg ass-imilation of Technology: I've seen adapting to some extent to technology, but I've never seen Borg using any absorbed tech.

Trek tech ignoring any kind of Wars shielding for purposes of transportation and even Phaser blasts.

KhyronTheBackstabber · Post by **KhyronTheBackstabber** » 2002-12-06 03:35am

Every argument listed annoys me but the one that annoys me the most...
Q. Mother Fuckin Q. They always run to Q. God, I hate Q.

Jawawithagun · Post by **Jawawithagun** » 2002-12-06 03:48am

Ghost Rider wrote:The Laser argument...god knows how many rabid trekkies in real life I've had to ween off that one.

The senosr globe is a close second...especially given how the game reinforce it ad infintum

Especially s their ships AREN'T immune to lasers (though, maybe their shields are able to prevent laser from affecting the ship once the shields are down they're just as vulnerable). Proof? One TNG episode where the Borg use LASERS (duh) to cut a slice out of the Enterprise.

Dunno which one right now, but my Star Trek Omnipedia has a very nice piece of video evidence of it.

beyond hope · Post by **beyond hope** » 2002-12-06 09:29am

Assuming technology in the Star Wars universe must necessarily use the same mechanisms and work in the same fashion as technology in Star Trek, because it has the same name. Shields, in particular. "Oh yeah?! Well, you may have teraton shields but we'll just match frequencies and shoot through them!"

Slartibartfast wrote:When Trekkies claim that Fed technology is higher because their ships look so sleek and their corridors and rooms are so big and clean. And that Star Wars tech is so low because it all looks like greasy machinery.

don't forget a related argument: "It HAS to be primitive tech, because Trek is the most advanced sci-fi series and they don't use it."

But worst of all, and the one I think deserves immediate Village Idiot status for posting on this board: "Trek is the most realistic sci-fi series, and everything on Trek is totally realistic and based on science."
[/quote]

Captain tycho · Post by **Captain tycho** » 2002-12-06 01:00pm

beyond hope wrote:Assuming technology in the Star Wars universe must necessarily use the same mechanisms and work in the same fashion as technology in Star Trek, because it has the same name. Shields, in particular. "Oh yeah?! Well, you may have teraton shields but we'll just match frequencies and shoot through them!"

Slartibartfast wrote:When Trekkies claim that Fed technology is higher because their ships look so sleek and their corridors and rooms are so big and clean. And that Star Wars tech is so low because it all looks like greasy machinery.
don't forget a related argument: "It HAS to be primitive tech, because Trek is the most advanced sci-fi series and they don't use it."

But worst of all, and the one I think deserves immediate Village Idiot status for posting on this board: "Trek is the most realistic sci-fi series, and everything on Trek is totally realistic and based on science."

[/quote]
I once ran into a guy in a Sci-fi chatroom saying the exact same thing.
Then about 50 Warsies started flaming him to death.

Zaku-chan · Post by **Zaku-chan** » 2002-12-06 01:27pm

I ran into a guy at a sci-fi convention who said Trek is science FACT.

Another trekkie whacked him with a cardboard bal'teth for saying something so blatently stupid.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2002-12-06 03:19pm

I remember one i saw here

When will you warsies understand that in the Star Trek universe a Giga-tonne is more powerful than a Star Wars Giga-tonne

?????

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2002-12-07 02:03pm

Most annoying argument EVER?

"OMG ALL WINDOWS IN STAR TREK ARE FORCEFIELDS THAT'S SO STUPID"

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2002-12-07 04:31pm

All arguments which violate the concept of cross-universe comparisons or appeal to ignorance:

"Why would they fight anyway?"
Assuming that one side remains passive while the other side attacks, tries new tactics, inventive methods of destroying things, etc.
"If you can't prove that my unprecedented technobabble idea will not work, then it will work".
"Your sci-fi technology won't work against my sci-fi universe. But mine will work just fine against your universe."
Scenarios designed to deliberately handicap one side but whose authors refuse to admit it.
Character shields. It's a cute idea and it works fine in humourous sci-fi matchups, but I hate it when people are being serious yet still expect you to respect the superhuman abilities and sheer luck of major characters even if they lack any actual superhuman powers.
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence." See Occam's Razor.
Appealing to one's own ignorance of mathematics and science, eg- "I'm not very good with physics or math so I can't argue with your equations, but you're obviously wrong. I mean, COME ON!!!!".
Using starship explosions in order to generate firepower calcs (as opposed to destruction of inert objects such as asteroids, planets, etc). Classic example is GK's "Q Who" calcs based on blowing out a chunk of the Borg cube.
Anything Darkstar does. I honestly have never seen him make a single argument which was not grossly fallacious or unfair in some horrible way.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2002-12-07 04:45pm

"Star Trek ships are small and sleek. Star Wars ships are big and clunky."

Zaku-chan · Post by **Zaku-chan** » 2002-12-07 04:56pm

The insane belief that the Borg can adapt to superlasers.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2002-12-07 05:21pm

The lasers one just gets to me, particularly since the real-life definition of phaser is "Photon Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation." I thought there was an episode where Worf defined what a phaser is, and it was something along the lines of aligning the light waves so they don't interfere with each other, but now I can't find reference to that, so I'm not sure.

Coalition · Post by **Coalition** » 2002-12-08 01:22am

http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.a ... nym=PHASER

This paged has two acronyms.
PHAS ed
E nergy
R ectification

and "The Dark"s definition also.

The Star trek acronym there sounds like it was designed to correct something. It's just technobabble to me though.

That phasing part might explain the NDF effect though. It is partially in another dimension, so that aids the material hit when it gets turned into neutrinos.

Typhonis 1 · Post by **Typhonis 1** » 2002-12-08 02:14am

Borg can regenerate any injury

Drewcifer · Post by **Drewcifer** » 2002-12-08 02:29am

When geek/cool/uber factors become paramount to logical and rational points and extrapolations.

"The bitchin' camaro will kick everybody's ass, because, well, it's the bitchin' camaro dammit!"

Slartibartfast - thanks for a fun quote to sig

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2002-12-08 03:48am

Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote:"Star Trek ships are small and sleek. Star Wars ships are big and clunky."

Actually, there are MANY SW ships which are sleek.... such as the Mon Calamari ships, and the "hunchback" Imperial cruiser from Dark Empire....

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2002-12-08 09:03am

Simon H.Johansen wrote:
Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote:"Star Trek ships are small and sleek. Star Wars ships are big and clunky."
Actually, there are MANY SW ships which are sleek.... such as the Mon Calamari ships, and the "hunchback" Imperial cruiser from Dark Empire....

But not as sleek as the elegant E-E! So it's superior to ALL SW ships!

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2002-12-08 09:38am

The Borg.

Die. Bitch.

Evil Sadistic Bastard · Post by **Evil Sadistic Bastard** » 2002-12-08 09:43am

Defiant Phase Cloak WILL OWN ALL STAR WARS SHIPS!

ISDs have giant blind spots.

Setting 16 phasers.

Etc.

Typhonis 1 · Post by **Typhonis 1** » 2002-12-08 10:40am

You can thank WEG for the idea that destroyers have a giant blind spot to the rear and below the ship

Sr.mal · Post by **Sr.mal** » 2002-12-11 06:33pm

The borg could adapt to anything other than phasers. Also any other drival that manages to ooze its way out of a rabid trekies mouth

Crayz9000 · Post by **Crayz9000** » 2002-12-11 06:40pm

Sr.mal wrote:The borg could adapt to anything other than phasers. Also any other drival that manages to ooze its way out of a rabid trekies mouth

Hello and welcome to SD.net. This thread is inbound, for Sector C flamewars and control facilities. No eating, drinking, or smoking is permitted in these threads.

In other words, please take the time to review your positions before posting. This place is rather hostile toward newbies, as I'm sure some of our members will tell you.

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2002-12-11 06:55pm

Crayz9000: Its ok he was expressing anti trek feelings.

The Borg can adapt to things other than phasers however against HTL's it amounts to about the same as choosing between a paper bag or cardboard box to stop a small nuke (ok overstating a little)