501st Legion vs. Romulans from Unification

[Asdeed]

As long as a one AT-AT is crewed by the 501st, then the 501st would be invincible, Nothing the Rommies have can take down an AT-AT, or an AT-ST for that matter. I imagine that firing the AT-AT's weapons wouldn't be too hard. You don't even need to move it, just build a defensive position around it.

You imagine[/] it's not too hard? You don't actually know how hard it would be to even start up the thing. It's a military vehicle, there could even be safeguards that the 501st would have no clue how to deal with.

And AT-STs probably have similer controls to Tanks and fighter craft. Any pilots or tankers could probably learn to drive them before all of them are totaled.

That's wishful thinking, period.

And none of these guys are idiots, so they would know that thermal detonators are thrown and how to activate them etc.

Great, so what's the delay time between arming it and 'BOOM'? Are all grenades time delayed or do some have different triggering mechanisms? How do they tell the difference between a frag grenade and a smoke grenade? What are the effective blast radii of any of these weapons? You don't know, so don't assume.

Hovertanks work just like real tanks, or maybe even cars.

It's a nice thought, but that doesn't necessarily make it true.

And don't forget, the average Imperial unit has some war-droids and regular droids, they would know how to do their job.

Right, well if there are some there, i'll grant you they'd probably do a damn good job. And still lose.

And what about E-webs? Hijack some pickups and stick an E-Web on the back. Then you have a mobile assault force.

And? Unarmored vehicles with exposed weapons crews in the back? Inexperienced crews at that. Scary.

I have thought this up in less than a minute. And these are SW fanatics. They would never ever lose to an ST army. THey would never live it down. THe humiliation would be terrible.

They're a disorganized mob going into battle with an organized military force. They wouldn't have to live it down, they'd be dead.

And the Darkside users just have to get angry, and they would become weapons of mass destruction.

Clone troopers took out Jedi masters pretty well, don't see the Romulan infoantry having THAT much trouble with a bunch of untrained force users.

Anakin and Luke both unconsouscly channeled the force with no experiance, so these guys probably could too. ANd the Rommies might become demoralized by the firepower of the ggroup they are facing. And Stormie helmets are simple to use for basic tasks like vision and protection from shrapnel. ITs the extra more advanced features that are hard to use. And running at the Rommies with blasters on full auto would probably wipe them out in no time. Mortars would be easy to use, although coordinating fire would be a challenge, perhaps impossible, but with gas, you don't need precise hits. And we know how TIEs work. THey work almost exactly like real fighter planes. Any certified pilots could do some damage with them. Shoulder mounted torp launchers aren't hard to figure out either. Even without military training, a bunch of guys with blasters, imp armor, and heavy weapons charging straight into enemy fire could wipe out the Rommies. Once sided massacre in favor of the 501st.

Anakin developed some limited abilities on his own, whoopie. You don't know how complicated Stormie helmets are, enough with the assumptions. Charging head long at the Romulans? That's just a lot of dead 501st.

TIE's, rocket launchers, etc... no, it's not easy to use.

You're right about one thing though, it would probably be a massacre. Except you picked the wrong side.

[Trooper TK12746]

Up, down, left right. accelerate, deaccelerate. Its like the difference between flying one type of plane or another. We know basic TIE performance. Given your flying into space, the only thing you could crash into would be the other TIE (they are not that stupid or untalanted) or the warbird (in which case the impact would blow it up anyway).

[Asdeed]

Up, down, left right. accelerate, deaccelerate. Its like the difference between flying one type of plane or another. We know basic TIE performance. Given your flying into space, the only thing you could crash into would be the other TIE (they are not that stupid or untalanted) or the warbird (in which case the impact would blow it up anyway).

And with no clue how to operate the sensors, or read them even if you did, you find the Warbird how?

[Lord Revan]

How may times most this told, these are nerds who like in SW costumes, not the true "Vader's Fist". It's pratically impossible for them have anmy experience on SW equiptment and vehicles (and lot more then it's told in the book or Movie in military hardware(even in SW))

[Ender]

As long as a one AT-AT is crewed by the 501st, then the 501st would be invincible, Nothing the Rommies have can take down an AT-AT,

True, assuming conventional infanrty vs APC tactics. But let us remember that this is city fighting, which will severly hampr its usage (turning ability vs intersections anyone?)

or an AT-ST for that matter.

Oh bullshit. Ewoks and a single wookiee managed to capture and take out these, with no good weapons and in a forest environment. Assault weapons and a city environment will greatly aid them.

I imagine that firing the AT-AT's weapons wouldn't be too hard. You don't even need to move it, just build a defensive position around it.

So you just sit tight and let them rig whatever they need to around you? Hell, if I was the romulans I'd just blow up a building and let the debris take it out when the structure falls over. It's not like you can't improvise an explosive with stuff all around in a city.

And AT-STs probably have similer controls to Tanks and fighter craft. Any pilots or tankers could probably learn to drive them before all of them are totaled.

No, in fact the safe bet is that the controls are radically different. Legs change things. You have to have balance controls, and a ton of other stuff.

An AT-AT would be really hard to destroy, even by the crew.

And yet the Imperials did that to 3 of them on Hoth, and they are trained on the suckers (ref ITWOT)

And none of these guys are idiots, so they would know that thermal detonators are thrown and how to activate them etc.

No, it doesn't say they get that knowledge. The OP specifically says they have to figure their equipment.

Not to mention mortars and hovertanks. [/quiote]Do you know how to drive a tank or use a mortar?

Hovertanks work just like real tanks, or maybe even cars.

Back that statement up chuckles.

And don't forget, the average Imperial unit has some war-droids and regular droids, they would know how to do their job.

Only thing I recall is that they have seeker droids to help them scout as seen in ANH. So which of them understands wistles and beeps? Who has the computer capable of understanding nonbinary (ref dark journey) transmissions Which one can translate the read out o what the droid says into english (that should be real fun, as what WEG says is the alphabet completely doesn't match the movies, I would love to see the fanboys argue that one)?

And what about E-webs?

How many of these people do you think know how to run a nuclear generator?

Hijack some pickups and stick an E-Web on the back. Then you have a mobile assault force.

How many do you think know how to hotwire a car?

I have thought this up in less than a minute.

It shows.

And these are SW fanatics. They would never ever lose to an ST army. THey would never live it down. THe humiliation would be terrible.

Irrelevent.

And the Darkside users just have to get angry, and they would become weapons of mass destruction. Anakin and Luke both unconsouscly channeled the force with no experiance, so these guys probably could too.

When did Luke do so? And there is a diference between using it to get a split second bit of intuition, and using it usefully like you claim they would.

ANd the Rommies might become demoralized by the firepower of the ggroup they are facing.

The firepower of the weapons would likely be offset by ther inepitude at using them.

And Stormie helmets are simple to use for basic tasks like vision and protection from shrapnel. ITs the extra more advanced features that are hard to use. And running at the Rommies with blasters on full auto would probably wipe them out in no time.

Congratulations, you are a fucking moron. Did the fact that this behavior is refered to derisevly not indicate that its a bad idea?

Mortars would be easy to use,

And the basis for this assumption is?

although coordinating fire would be a challenge, perhaps impossible, but with gas, you don't need precise hits.

Gas will backfire here unless they know how to seal the armor for CBR attacks. Funny how Luke and Han didn't know how to do that.

And we know how TIEs work. THey work almost exactly like real fighter planes.

Like Hell. Name for me one fighter plane that carries an onboard reactor, or can take itself out due to thermal bloom from its weapons on full power. Name for me one fighter plane that can vaporize itself if the engiens are messed with.

Any certified pilots could do some damage with them.

I doubt they can even turn them on. You really seem to have no grasp of how much technical knowledge is required to operate some of these devices.

Shoulder mounted torp launchers aren't hard to figure out either.

Yeah, because yoyu want to sling around nuclear missiles in a city.

Even without military training, a bunch of guys with blasters, imp armor, and heavy weapons charging straight into enemy fire could wipe out the Rommies. Once sided massacre in favor of the 501st.

That is such a stupid statement I may have to sig it.

[Ender]

Up, down, left right. accelerate, deaccelerate. Its like the difference between flying one type of plane or another.

You stupidity is simply bottomless, isn't it?

How do you start up the hpermatter reactor?
How do you dial down the weapons?
How do you turn on the repulsors?
How do you overcome the safety interlocks?
How do you manage the thermal radiatiors?
How do you activate the ion engines?
How do you budget delta V?

Flying a space craft is nothing close to an atmospheric craft.

We know basic TIE performance.

Playing TIE Fighter does not mean you know how to pilot one of these things into combat sparky.

Given your flying into space, the only thing you could crash into would be the other TIE (they are not that stupid or untalanted) or the warbird (in which case the impact would blow it up anyway).

Funny how these things ignore almost 700 meter long ships ramming them then, when a 2 meter ball will do it.

[Trooper TK12746]

We have seen TIE sensors, they look almost like radar. ANd the warbird would be right above the city.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
As long as a one AT-AT is crewed by the 501st, then the 501st would be invincible, Nothing the Rommies have can take down an AT-AT, or an AT-ST for that matter. I imagine that firing the AT-AT's weapons wouldn't be too hard. You don't even need to move it, just build a defensive position around it.


You imagine[/] it's not too hard? You don't actually know how hard it would be to even start up the thing. It's a military vehicle, there could even be safeguards that the 501st would have no clue how to deal with.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
And AT-STs probably have similer controls to Tanks and fighter craft. Any pilots or tankers could probably learn to drive them before all of them are totaled.


That's wishful thinking, period.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
And none of these guys are idiots, so they would know that thermal detonators are thrown and how to activate them etc.


Great, so what's the delay time between arming it and 'BOOM'? Are all grenades time delayed or do some have different triggering mechanisms? How do they tell the difference between a frag grenade and a smoke grenade? What are the effective blast radii of any of these weapons? You don't know, so don't assume.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
Hovertanks work just like real tanks, or maybe even cars.


It's a nice thought, but that doesn't necessarily make it true.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
And don't forget, the average Imperial unit has some war-droids and regular droids, they would know how to do their job.


Right, well if there are some there, i'll grant you they'd probably do a damn good job. And still lose.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
And what about E-webs? Hijack some pickups and stick an E-Web on the back. Then you have a mobile assault force.


And? Unarmored vehicles with exposed weapons crews in the back? Inexperienced crews at that. Scary.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
I have thought this up in less than a minute. And these are SW fanatics. They would never ever lose to an ST army. THey would never live it down. THe humiliation would be terrible.


They're a disorganized mob going into battle with an organized military force. They wouldn't have to live it down, they'd be dead.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
And the Darkside users just have to get angry, and they would become weapons of mass destruction.


Clone troopers took out Jedi masters pretty well, don't see the Romulan infoantry having THAT much trouble with a bunch of untrained force users.

Trooper TK12746 wrote:
Anakin and Luke both unconsouscly channeled the force with no experiance, so these guys probably could too. ANd the Rommies might become demoralized by the firepower of the ggroup they are facing. And Stormie helmets are simple to use for basic tasks like vision and protection from shrapnel. ITs the extra more advanced features that are hard to use. And running at the Rommies with blasters on full auto would probably wipe them out in no time. Mortars would be easy to use, although coordinating fire would be a challenge, perhaps impossible, but with gas, you don't need precise hits. And we know how TIEs work. THey work almost exactly like real fighter planes. Any certified pilots could do some damage with them. Shoulder mounted torp launchers aren't hard to figure out either. Even without military training, a bunch of guys with blasters, imp armor, and heavy weapons charging straight into enemy fire could wipe out the Rommies. Once sided massacre in favor of the 501st.


Anakin developed some limited abilities on his own, whoopie. You don't know how complicated Stormie helmets are, enough with the assumptions. Charging head long at the Romulans? That's just a lot of dead 501st.

TIE's, rocket launchers, etc... no, it's not easy to use.

The equipment has no safegaurds at the moment, it is ready to be used. And what can the Rommies do while the 501st figures it out?

They wouldn't just hold the TDs in their hands, and the blast radius is small enough that they are good grenades.

Accordign to ICC hovertanks use pedals and a control stick. Not hard to figure out.

Pickups go fast, you only need to get in and out. THe Rommies don't have enough range to take the pickup out before the E-web takes them out. And they have no anti-armor weapons.

I was just saying the have motivation.

They took them out unawares from behind, and they were the Jedi's "loyal" troops. You can take out anyone like that.

Check SW VD for stormie helmets, relatively easy to operate basic features. At least one of these powerful forceusers would develop these abilities. 501st can kill Rommies before they are in range of the disruptors.

Rocket launchers are easy to use, and for the walkers all you need to know is how to fire. TIEs aren't hard to figure out. We already know how all this stuff works.

[Ender]

501st already knows how to counter transporters, heck, they could probably block transporters by accident.

Bullshit, prove this statement. We know things that block it, but we don't know why or how. Which means that us, people who have studied this intently, would be limited in our ability to do so, much less a group that doesn't bother with other series.

Are orbital bombardments even allowed in this scenario? And the TIEs could take out the warbird no problem. You would only need maybe two of them.

Yeah, because that several orders of magnitude difference in weapons and shield strenght ain't shit!

[Ender]

It has been said in various books what the TIE controls are. They are almost exactly the same as prop plane controls. Any pilots in the group could use them easily.

You, my good sir, are a fucking liar. TIE controls have never been fully laid out in other sources. Further, the source we do have show fighter controsl to be nothing like plane controls.

A worthless fucking liar, plain and simple.

[Ender]

We have seen TIE sensors, they look almost like radar. ANd the warbird would be right above the city.

Actually, they look absolutely nothing like radar. Have you ever seen a real radar display? Because I and a number of other posters have.

You picked the wrong board to try and bullshit kid.

The equipment has no safegaurds at the moment, it is ready to be used.

Says who exactly? You because you need it to be that way for your wank to succeed?

And what can the Rommies do while the 501st figures it out?

Gee, maybe manuver for superior position? There is a reason time is valuable in combat.

They wouldn't just hold the TDs in their hands, and the blast radius is small enough that they are good grenades.

The blast radius is about 45 feet. How far can you thow a multi kg device?

Accordign to ICC hovertanks use pedals and a control stick. Not hard to figure out.

What the hell is the ICC (I assume ICS)? And when did we see an Imperial hovertank in one? Oh yeah, never.
And more to the point, Which one is the gear shift? Which one is forward? which one brake? How do you start the reactor? How do you start the repulsors? How do you transferse the turret? how do you aim? How do you fire? how do you read the sensors?

I'm getting the distinct impression you are another one of those fools who thinks the military is a job only for buffoons who couldn't get other employment and totally take for granted the intense technical training involved in our job.

Pickups go fast, you only need to get in and out. THe Rommies don't have enough range to take the pickup out before the E-web takes them out.

I call bullshit again; demonstrated range is sufficient. Plus city fighting means everyone has short range, they will be undercover, and you still haven't covered how they will get these trucks and how they will start up and use the E-webs.

And they have no anti-armor weapons.

Yeah, because a couple of mm of aluminum constitue armor and will stop a 10 MJ shot.

I was just saying the have motivation.

I'd think "Don't die" would be better motivation.

Check SW VD for stormie helmets, relatively easy to operate basic features.

Again, full of shit. How many eyeblinks do you use to flip screens? How many tongue presses to select? Eas to operate if you have been trained is one thing. Easy to operate if you just grab one is diferent.

At least one of these powerful forceusers would develop these abilities.

Proof? Latent abilities seen so far are useless in combat, and nothing says how to use the force beyond "concentrate"


501st can kill Rommies before they are in range of the disruptors.[/quote]Phaser/disruptor range is sufficient for this engagement.

Rocket launchers are easy to use,

Yet real soldiers need a lot of training. Funny that. And multi kt devices in a city are bad.

and for the walkers all you need to know is how to fire.

And drive. And start up the onboard reactor. And work the sensors. And overcome the interlocks.

TIEs aren't hard to figure out.

Keep saying that. I'll keep laughing at your ignorant ass.

We already know how all this stuff works.

No we don't hence the reason for this site and other like it, we are trying to figure it out.

[Asdeed]

We have seen TIE sensors, they look almost like radar. ANd the warbird would be right above the city.

I'm sorry, that just stupid.

The equipment has no safegaurds at the moment, it is ready to be used. And what can the Rommies do while the 501st figures it out?

Oh, you've declared 'no safeguards' and therefore it's so? Horseshit. And the Rommies could beam their troops into position while the 501st are still trying to open an AT AT hatch.

They wouldn't just hold the TDs in their hands, and the blast radius is small enough that they are good grenades.

So you're answer to having made to many assumptions is ANOTHER assumption? HOW? DO? YOU? KNOW?

Accordign to ICC hovertanks use pedals and a control stick. Not hard to figure out.

How do you lock/unlock the entry hatch? Where's the power switch? You don't know, do you?

Pickups go fast, you only need to get in and out. THe Rommies don't have enough range to take the pickup out before the E-web takes them out. And they have no anti-armor weapons.

So now you know the range of Romulan infantry weapons? You know they don't have anti-armor weapons? You know that's worse than the range on an improvised vehicle mount in the hands of a bunch of fans?

No, you know nothing, you assume.

Assumptions = you being an idiot

I was just saying the have motivation.

So the 501st are motivated the Rommie's want to die? Oh grow up.

They took them out unawares from behind, and they were the Jedi's "loyal" troops. You can take out anyone like that.

Oh please. Jedi died fighting on Geonosis. Jedi died across the galaxy at the end of the war. Why? Massed blaster fire kills jedi. Force wielding fans are royally screwed.

Check SW VD for stormie helmets, relatively easy to operate basic features. At least one of these powerful forceusers would develop these abilities. 501st can kill Rommies before they are in range of the disruptors.

Rocket launchers are easy to use, and for the walkers all you need to know is how to fire. TIEs aren't hard to figure out. We already know how all this stuff works.

'wouldn't be that hard' 'easy to use' 'my mommy says i'm cool' these aren't fucking arguments!

[Trooper TK12746]

As long as a one AT-AT is crewed by the 501st, then the 501st would be invincible, Nothing the Rommies have can take down an AT-AT,
True, assuming conventional infanrty vs APC tactics. But let us remember that this is city fighting, which will severly hampr its usage (turning ability vs intersections anyone?)

You don't need to move it.

Quote:
or an AT-ST for that matter.
Oh bullshit. Ewoks and a single wookiee managed to capture and take out these, with no good weapons and in a forest environment. Assault weapons and a city environment will greatly aid them.

And they managed to use it with no previous experiance and on forested terrain! Against other trained crews! And where have we ever seen assault weapons with the Rommies?

Quote:
I imagine that firing the AT-AT's weapons wouldn't be too hard. You don't even need to move it, just build a defensive position around it.
So you just sit tight and let them rig whatever they need to around you? Hell, if I was the romulans I'd just blow up a building and let the debris take it out when the structure falls over. It's not like you can't improvise an explosive with stuff all around in a city.

You can't just knock over an AT-AT. Howdo you find those kinds of high explosives lying around in a city? It took prior knowledge of Imperial weapons and Imperial defectors (as well as highly advanced technology) for the rebels to take out some of the AT-ATs, and tripping wouldn't work if they aren't moving.

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And AT-STs probably have similer controls to Tanks and fighter craft. Any pilots or tankers could probably learn to drive them before all of them are totaled.
No, in fact the safe bet is that the controls are radically different. Legs change things. You have to have balance controls, and a ton of other stuff.

You have me there. But if ewoks and a wookie can handle one and use it effectively with no prior experiance, so could the fans.

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An AT-AT would be really hard to destroy, even by the crew.

And yet the Imperials did that to 3 of them on Hoth, and they are trained on the suckers (ref ITWOT)

The Imps never blew up their own walkers! The rebs blew them up!

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And none of these guys are idiots, so they would know that thermal detonators are thrown and how to activate them etc.
No, it doesn't say they get that knowledge. The OP specifically says they have to figure their equipment.

They are SW fans, they know the stuff. They just have to figure out how to do it physically. Otherwise he would have said that they were just random people instead of members of the 501st.

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Not to mention mortars and hovertanks. [/quiote]Do you know how to drive a tank or use a mortar?

Yes to both. Although aiming the mortar accuratly is a bit of a problem.

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Hovertanks work just like real tanks, or maybe even cars.
Back that statement up chuckles.

ICC

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And don't forget, the average Imperial unit has some war-droids and regular droids, they would know how to do their job.
Only thing I recall is that they have seeker droids to help them scout as seen in ANH. So which of them understands wistles and beeps? Who has the computer capable of understanding nonbinary (ref dark journey) transmissions Which one can translate the read out o what the droid says into english (that should be real fun, as what WEG says is the alphabet completely doesn't match the movies, I would love to see the fanboys argue that one)?

He said that everything was in English. And they have SD-10s, SD-9s, astromechs, medical droids, etc.

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And what about E-webs?
How many of these people do you think know how to run a nuclear generator?

You turn it on. It regulates itself. Otherwise there would have been snowtroopers trying to keep it stable.

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Hijack some pickups and stick an E-Web on the back. Then you have a mobile assault force.
How many do you think know how to hotwire a car?

Enough. And some of them might still have their keys in them.

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And these are SW fanatics. They would never ever lose to an ST army. THey would never live it down. THe humiliation would be terrible.
Irrelevent.

That is true.

And the Darkside users just have to get angry, and they would become weapons of mass destruction. Anakin and Luke both unconsouscly channeled the force with no experiance, so these guys probably could too.
When did Luke do so? And there is a diference between using it to get a split second bit of intuition, and using it usefully like you claim they would.

Luke used it over the DS. And split second intuition can be useful too.

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ANd the Rommies might become demoralized by the firepower of the ggroup they are facing.
The firepower of the weapons would likely be offset by ther inepitude at using them.

I don't that would be an issue.

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And Stormie helmets are simple to use for basic tasks like vision and protection from shrapnel. ITs the extra more advanced features that are hard to use. And running at the Rommies with blasters on full auto would probably wipe them out in no time.
Congratulations, you are a fucking moron. Did the fact that this behavior is refered to derisevly not indicate that its a bad idea?

Under most circumstances it is a bad idea, but against the rommies with their disruptors and given superior numbers and weopons, it could actually do some damage.

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Mortars would be easy to use,

And the basis for this assumption is?

use, not aim. Load and shoot.

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although coordinating fire would be a challenge, perhaps impossible, but with gas, you don't need precise hits.
Gas will backfire here unless they know how to seal the armor for CBR attacks. Funny how Luke and Han didn't know how to do that.

where did you get the bit about Luke and Han?

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And we know how TIEs work. THey work almost exactly like real fighter planes.
Like Hell. Name for me one fighter plane that carries an onboard reactor, or can take itself out due to thermal bloom from its weapons on full power. Name for me one fighter plane that can vaporize itself if the engiens are messed with.

Why would they mess with the engines, why would the onboard reactor matter? The boom of the weapons would mean they were hitting something. In fact, they could just ram the warbird, ejecting before they hit it.

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Any certified pilots could do some damage with them.

I doubt they can even turn them on. You really seem to have no grasp of how much technical knowledge is required to operate some of these devices.

the wonders of the on/off switch

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Shoulder mounted torp launchers aren't hard to figure out either.
Yeah, because yoyu want to sling around nuclear missiles in a city.

They could be concussion missiles, they don't have to be proton torps. And the directional weapons would cause damage in one direction.

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Even without military training, a bunch of guys with blasters, imp armor, and heavy weapons charging straight into enemy fire could wipe out the Rommies. Once sided massacre in favor of the 501st.
That is such a stupid statement I may have to sig it.

Or it just shows that the firepower of the 501st is just that much of an advantage.

[Asdeed]

Mass of unwarranted assumptions

Fortified AT-ATs? Blast it from orbit with disruptors. That'll kill anyone protecting the immobile heap, then either beam down a team to break into it or.... just ignore it. It's AT BEST a fixed emplacement. Big bloody deal.

AT-STs? In the reeeeally unlikely event that they get moving, use some explosives to knock buildings over on them. Since the Romulans have the sensor advantage, they'll know where they are at all times anyway.

Pick up trucks? Find some cover, wait for it, kill it. City fighting sucks ass.

Grenades, mortars and rocket launchers? Probably be more friendly fire casualties than anything else. No, you still haven't demonstrated a disorganized mass of civilians are competent to handle them.

Charging headlong guns a blazing? Seriously, are you stupid enough to think that would work?

[Ender]

Hey retard, learn to use the fucking quote function.

As long as a one AT-AT is crewed by the 501st, then the 501st would be invincible, Nothing the Rommies have can take down an AT-AT,
True, assuming conventional infanrty vs APC tactics. But let us remember that this is city fighting, which will severly hampr its usage (turning ability vs intersections anyone?)

You don't need to move it.

Right, because staying in one place and letting the enemy manuver all around you is not total suicide.

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or an AT-ST for that matter.
Oh bullshit. Ewoks and a single wookiee managed to capture and take out these, with no good weapons and in a forest environment. Assault weapons and a city environment will greatly aid them.

And they managed to use it with no previous experiance and on forested terrain! Against other trained crews!

Bullshit, the wookiee fought in the clone wars with republic troops and equipment. Then he worked as a slave repairing Imperial technology. Chewie had plenty of experience.

And where have we ever seen assault weapons with the Rommies?

We don't know what the romulans have, hence why no one is taling about that.

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I imagine that firing the AT-AT's weapons wouldn't be too hard. You don't even need to move it, just build a defensive position around it.
So you just sit tight and let them rig whatever they need to around you? Hell, if I was the romulans I'd just blow up a building and let the debris take it out when the structure falls over. It's not like you can't improvise an explosive with stuff all around in a city.

You can't just knock over an AT-AT.

Yes, you can. Hence why walkers and a high center of gravity suck ass.

Howdo you find those kinds of high explosives lying around in a city?

You're kidding me, right? Did you see what Timothy McVeigh did with fertilizer and motor oil? A trip to Walmart and Pepboys and they have what they need.

It took prior knowledge of Imperial weapons and Imperial defectors (as well as highly advanced technology) for the rebels to take out some of the AT-ATs, and tripping wouldn't work if they aren't moving.

Dropping a few hundred tons of steel and concrete will do the jo just fine numbnuts.

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And AT-STs probably have similer controls to Tanks and fighter craft. Any pilots or tankers could probably learn to drive them before all of them are totaled.
No, in fact the safe bet is that the controls are radically different. Legs change things. You have to have balance controls, and a ton of other stuff.

You have me there. But if ewoks and a wookie can handle one and use it effectively with no prior experiance, so could the fans.

The wookiee fought int he clone wars and repaired this stuf for years, not to mention growing up in a universe where running this kind of stuff is to him what the internet is to you and me. Huge difference. You way overestimate the dateless loser brigade here.

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An AT-AT would be really hard to destroy, even by the crew.

And yet the Imperials did that to 3 of them on Hoth, and they are trained on the suckers (ref ITWOT)

The Imps never blew up their own walkers! The rebs blew them up!

Did it occur to your retarded ass I might have given a source for a reason? The Imperials most certainly did lose walkers to their own poor driving and overconfidence.

After losing 3 Walkers to crevasses of eastern ice flow, Blizzard 4's AT-AT group retreat to more manageable westerly route

ITWOT, page 21

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And none of these guys are idiots, so they would know that thermal detonators are thrown and how to activate them etc.
No, it doesn't say they get that knowledge. The OP specifically says they have to figure their equipment.

They are SW fans, they know the stuff.

The stuff has never been said how to work, so I sincerely fucking doubt it you decietful little snot.

They just have to figure out how to do it physically. Otherwise he would have said that they were just random people instead of members of the 501st.

If there is nothing that says how it works, the fans might as well be normal people.

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Not to mention mortars and hovertanks. [/quiote]Do you know how to drive a tank or use a mortar?

Yes to both. Although aiming the mortar accuratly is a bit of a problem.

I call bullshit to both. No actual soldier would think running directly ath the enemy screaming and firing at full auto would be a good idea.

By the way, playing Battlfield 1942 does not mean you know how to drive takns and fire mortars.

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Hovertanks work just like real tanks, or maybe even cars.
Back that statement up chuckles.

ICC

Which stands for... yeah, not shit. We've never seen the inside of an Imperial tank. And having pdeals and a wheel does not mean they drive the same way. How do you start it up, how do you adjust for altitude, how do you move the turet, how do you fire, how do you work the sensors...

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And don't forget, the average Imperial unit has some war-droids and regular droids, they would know how to do their job.
Only thing I recall is that they have seeker droids to help them scout as seen in ANH. So which of them understands wistles and beeps? Who has the computer capable of understanding nonbinary (ref dark journey) transmissions Which one can translate the read out o what the droid says into english (that should be real fun, as what WEG says is the alphabet completely doesn't match the movies, I would love to see the fanboys argue that one)?

He said that everything was in English.

He said the readouts do, not the droids that interface to other computers.

And they have SD-10s, SD-9s

Those are army droids, the stormtroopers are marines.

, astromechs,

seen... never. Ok, thanks.

medical droids, etc.

About the only useful thing there.

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And what about E-webs?
How many of these people do you think know how to run a nuclear generator?

You turn it on.

By all means kid, try and bullshit the nuclear technician abou how easy it is to reaqch criticality. No, you don't just "turn it on". How many of them know how to do it?

It regulates itself. Otherwise there would have been snowtroopers trying to keep it stable.

Bullshit, EGWT and ISB say differently.

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Hijack some pickups and stick an E-Web on the back. Then you have a mobile assault force.
How many do you think know how to hotwire a car?

Enough.

Yeah, kid, keep that crap up and you will get shown the door very quickly. Now prove they kno how to hotwire cars.

And some of them might still have their keys in them.

Yeah, because stormie armor has all those pockets... oh wait.

And the Darkside users just have to get angry, and they would become weapons of mass destruction. Anakin and Luke both unconsouscly channeled the force with no experiance, so these guys probably could too.
When did Luke do so? And there is a diference between using it to get a split second bit of intuition, and using it usefully like you claim they would.

Luke used it over the DS.

He had already recieved some training from Kenobi, disproving the "no experience" claim.

And split second intuition can be useful too.

You claimed force storm levels here kid. Justify it or retract it.

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ANd the Rommies might become demoralized by the firepower of the ggroup they are facing.
The firepower of the weapons would likely be offset by ther inepitude at using them.

I don't that would be an issue.

Which is why we think you are an idiot. Training matters.

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And Stormie helmets are simple to use for basic tasks like vision and protection from shrapnel. ITs the extra more advanced features that are hard to use. And running at the Rommies with blasters on full auto would probably wipe them out in no time.
Congratulations, you are a fucking moron. Did the fact that this behavior is refered to derisevly not indicate that its a bad idea?

Under most circumstances

Try under every fucking circumstance you damn fool.

it is a bad idea, but against the rommies with their disruptors and given superior numbers and weopons, it could actually do some damage.

Yeah, they will take a handfulld down. And the Romulans will mow them down by the hundred in return. Massed infantry charges have not been used since WW1 for a reason. And firing at full auto like that just means you all run out of ammo at the same time.

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Mortars would be easy to use,

And the basis for this assumption is?

use, not aim. Load and shoot.

And the fact that real life mortar operation takes training apparently just flies over your head.

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although coordinating fire would be a challenge, perhaps impossible, but with gas, you don't need precise hits.
Gas will backfire here unless they know how to seal the armor for CBR attacks. Funny how Luke and Han didn't know how to do that.

where did you get the bit about Luke and Han?

How about the movie? In ANH you can see the backs o their necks and hair from beneath the helmets. Clearly they didn't suit up right and now lack CBR protection as a result.

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And we know how TIEs work. THey work almost exactly like real fighter planes.
Like Hell. Name for me one fighter plane that carries an onboard reactor, or can take itself out due to thermal bloom from its weapons on full power. Name for me one fighter plane that can vaporize itself if the engiens are messed with.

Why would they mess with the engines, why would the onboard reactor matter?

Gee, maybe they would fire up the reactor and engines because they want to go somewhere and fire the weapons?

The boom of the weapons would mean they were hitting something.

No reactor = no power = no weapons.

In fact, they could just ram the warbird, ejecting before they hit it.

no reactor = no engines = no flight.

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Any certified pilots could do some damage with them.

I doubt they can even turn them on. You really seem to have no grasp of how much technical knowledge is required to operate some of these devices.

the wonders of the on/off switch

Yeah, because reactors just have on/of switches and don't involve a lot to warm up at all. It's not like it took a good 5 minutes to get Slave 1's reacotr on line or anything to fly off in AOTC, no sir.

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Shoulder mounted torp launchers aren't hard to figure out either.
Yeah, because yoyu want to sling around nuclear missiles in a city.

They could be concussion missiles, they don't have to be proton torps.

Even the small shoulder mounted things are multi kt devices nitwit.

And the directional weapons would cause damage in one direction.

This is so damn dumb I don't knwo how to respond. Yes, ther won't at all be atmospheric effects from the release of hundreds of terajoules into the atposphere. There won't be backwash radiation. There won't still be blinding light. IDIOT.

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Even without military training, a bunch of guys with blasters, imp armor, and heavy weapons charging straight into enemy fire could wipe out the Rommies. Once sided massacre in favor of the 501st.
That is such a stupid statement I may have to sig it.

Or it just shows that the firepower of the 501st is just that much of an advantage.

No, It pretty much only shows you are the kind of guy who needs help to not strangle himself with his shirtsleeves on accident every morning.

[Fire Fly]

For the Empire! The Romulan Empire, that is. Without extensive training, the stormtrooper armor, the sensor readouts in the helmets, and the fact that many of the 501st aren't, ahem, exactly fit to be a soldier, will be more of a hindrance than a help. The heavy equipment will be useless without extensive training. The best the 501st can do is let those with military experience take command and coordinate a defensive strategy and even that will be a challenge since they don't know how to operate the communication systems in the helmets without extensive training. The Romulans have the advantage of already being well trained with their own equipment and personnel. Their weapons might be inferior, but its good enough to kill and that's all that matters. Combined with training and experience, they'll easily route the 501st. Civilians vs. a trained military force? Yeah....

[Lord of the Farce]

but any personal armor would be real, not just costumes.

Worse than useless. The advanced optics of Stormtrooper gear make it impossible for anyone without extensive training to use the helmet, and many people will find regulation stormtrooper gear impossible to fit into.

And, well, woe betide anyone in a Vader costume.

As Sharpshooter mentioned, and everyone seems to have ignored, it says "real, not just costumes", which implies that the costumes becomes real, so anybody who can fit into their own costumes to begin with would also fit into their suit of "real" armour.

As for Warbirds providing orbital support, I don't see where in the OP that it is allowed. It says "the battle is basically between a Wars-based group of regular people with very powerful equipment, against a Trek-based group with much less capable equipment, but already an organized and trained unit", not how many seconds the 501st can survive against orbital bombardment.

On comms (and many other) systems, as long as somebody has a datapad handy, a lot can be figured out. IIRC, in Tatooine Ghost, it's shown that it's a fairly simple matter (if you have the right unit, i.e. Imperial) to set up the helmets into the right frequency.

I could be mistaken, but I seem to recall that "current" datapads can also contain the activation codes for Imperial vehicles...

[Jadeite]

I call bullshit again; demonstrated range is sufficient. Plus city fighting means everyone has short range, they will be undercover, and you still haven't covered how they will get these trucks and how they will start up and use the E-webs.

Code: Select all

Getting the trucks is easy. Indianapolis is surrounded by suburbs and other towns. Break into a house, grab the keys, take a care from the driveway or garage.

[NecronLord]

AT-AT: "Imperial Military Vehicle Interface, V 3.21

Enter User Number and Password."

501st : Shit.

[Lord of the Farce]

AT-AT: "Imperial Military Vehicle Interface, V 3.21

Enter User Number and Password."

501st : Shit.

I doubt that is how one would be required to get Imperial vehicles moving. If it is, then a single vehicle getting its computer cracked could give the Rebels all of the user number and corresponding passwords. Besides, can you imagine the mess trying to get millions the computers of millions of vehicles scattered all over the galaxy updated with current user name and passwords?

More likely, the basic security system would be (IIRC) something like special ports where one can insert rank cylinder that is keyed to a personnel of sufficient rank, clearance, etc. There's a better than even chance that at least a handful of the 501st have gone into enough detail that, based on the OT:VD, will have rank cylinders on them.

[Straha]

Romulans win if only because they know how to keep order and they have greater mobility and air support/reinforcement then the Fanboys can ever hope to dream about getting.

[Grasscutter]

Up, down, left right. accelerate, deaccelerate. Its like the difference between flying one type of plane or another. We know basic TIE performance. Given your flying into space, the only thing you could crash into would be the other TIE (they are not that stupid or untalanted) or the warbird (in which case the impact would blow it up anyway).

Because piloting a 737 is the same as piloting an F-22. Also, if the Wright Bros. were magically transported to the present they'd be able to jump into an F-22 and quickly figure out how to fly the thing. Right, glad we cleared that up.

The only way the 501st has a prayer of surviving is if the trained military and law enforcement personel grab the gear from the normal civilians before they hurt themselves. A defendable position is found as quickly as possible and everybody holes up in there for a last stand. Civillians are told to take cover. MAYBE people trained in firearms are allowed to help defend non-vital positions or act as support to the military members, but ONLY if they follow orders. Anybody who insists on disobeying and going all Rambo on the Romulans can be used as a distraction or human shield =\.[/i]

[Phyre]

With all of you Trekkies talking shit, I'm still gonna have to vote for the 501. Any retarded teenager can figure out how to point and shoot. If we take into account the arms, and lack of armor, that the rommies are using, versus the armor and arms that the 501 has... Well, the Rommies would have to get into Range first before being able to even touch the 501. 5 scout/snipers with HBCs could wipe out so many Rommies it's not even funny.
Also, you have to realize the 501, being born on Earth, have a slight advantage there. They understand the field, and the natural resources, a lot better.
And, to whomever made the fert. bomb comment: Are you retarded? You're assuming that these people have come into contact with these components before, and have the scientific know-how to create the bomb. Quite a few adults have no idea how to make a fert. bomb, and they've been on earth their entire lives...

[Asdeed]

Argh!
Look, you can't just assume the Romulans march up Napoleonic style to get cut down, no matter how much you want them to!
Range? It's a CITY FIGHT, the range is pretty damn short.

[Kamakazie Sith]

With all of you Trekkies talking shit, I'm still gonna have to vote for the 501.
[/quote[

Hey genius, just because you take Trek's side once and a while does not make you a trekkie.

Any retarded teenager can figure out how to point and shoot. If we take into account the arms, and lack of armor, that the rommies are using, versus the armor and arms that the 501 has... Well, the Rommies would have to get into Range first before being able to even touch the 501. 5 scout/snipers with HBCs could wipe out so many Rommies it's not even funny.

That's great. We're talking military tactics, command and control, the ability to actually know how to use some of the more complex weapons (AT-AT for example)

Also, you have to realize the 501, being born on Earth, have a slight advantage there. They understand the field, and the natural resources, a lot better.

Only members that have lived on the battlefield have home turf advantage. Unless you are seriously thinking that planets are so different that the Romulans would be in a completely foreign atmosphere.

And, to whomever made the fert. bomb comment: Are you retarded? You're assuming that these people have come into contact with these components before, and have the scientific know-how to create the bomb. Quite a few adults have no idea how to make a fert. bomb, and they've been on earth their entire lives...

I assume you're talking about the 501st members.

[Ender]

With all of you Trekkies talking shit, I'm still gonna have to vote for the 501.

I'm laughing at getting called a Trekkie.

Any retarded teenager can figure out how to point and shoot. If we take into account the arms, and lack of armor, that the rommies are using, versus the armor and arms that the 501 has...

Since we don't know what the romulans are packingthis is an appeal to ignorance.

Well, the Rommies would have to get into Range first before being able to even touch the 501. 5 scout/snipers with HBCs could wipe out so many Rommies it's not even funny.[/qote]City fighting, range is less important.

Also, you have to realize the 501, being born on Earth, have a slight advantage there. They understand the field, and the natural resources, a lot better.

If all of them were from Indianapolis, you might have a point.

And, to whomever made the fert. bomb comment: Are you retarded? You're assuming that these people have come into contact with these components before, and have the scientific know-how to create the bomb. Quite a few adults have no idea how to make a fert. bomb, and they've been on earth their entire lives...

Bullsahit, it's basic chemisty. My brother and his friends put a big ass crater in a farmer's field whn they were in 6th grader using clorox and aluminum just to test what they learned in school that day. You miht have an inefficient bomb because you go the ratio wrong, but it would still go boom.