Stormtroopers vs THESE Federation troops

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-04-22 12:39pm

All this is nothing to be realistic. What have we really got here? 15-30 red shirts with special weapons, which just about put them on par with Stormies equipment and big tits. Against how many Stormtroopers? For fuck sake the Empire has millions of Stormtroopers. I see a slaughter happening. The Feddies only hope is that the Stormies get distracted by the juggely boobies.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2003-04-22 02:57pm

*falls out of seat laughing*

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2003-04-22 03:18pm

I gotta give it to the Hazard team when fighting Storm Troopers or even Clone Troopers. But the Dark Troopers I think would win out versus the Hazard team but the Hazards don't have the scary huge flying Robosuit either

EliteForce was a fun game.

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-04-22 04:57pm

Why would the Stormies be screwed against the Feds? I don't see major advantages the Feds have, unless they can use the transporter buffers to beam down heavy phaser weaponry. Does the Federation even have an equivalent to the E-WEB? I remember that one episode where they said the laser cannon (even before Kirk's time) was able to blow up half a continent, but I don't recall ever seeing heavy weapons after that point.

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2003-04-22 05:27pm

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:Why would the Stormies be screwed against the Feds? I don't see major advantages the Feds have, unless they can use the transporter buffers to beam down heavy phaser weaponry. Does the Federation even have an equivalent to the E-WEB? I remember that one episode where they said the laser cannon (even before Kirk's time) was able to blow up half a continent, but I don't recall ever seeing heavy weapons after that point.

Yes they do have the equvilant to heavy weaponry. The Photon Torpedo launcher as well as the Tetryon Gatling weapon are both heavy support weapons.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-22 05:45pm

The E-WEB is a crew-served blaster cannon repeater.

Its more analogous to the M2 .50 heavy machine gun in its original role. Now more equivalent to one of the more heavy anti-materiel heavy autocannon/machine guns out there.

The Imperial Heavy Repeater is the equivalent of a GPMG, and the Light Repeater/T-21 is obviously analogous to a M249.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-22 05:46pm

The Photon torpedo minilauncher is a long-range multi-purpose heavy anti-armor weapon.

The Tetryon gatling is probably analogous to a GPMG or SAW.

The Federation, canonically or including apocrypha, has no E-WEB equivalent.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2003-04-22 06:19pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Rarity of troops does not, in itself, indicate their role. Thrawn and the rest of the Empire did not have the time for the rigorous and in-depth training that Stormtrooper volunteers recieved in the OT--remember that much of the Chimaera's crew are inexperienced conscripts. The GeNode factories that supplied the elite Stormtroopers are also cut-off from Thrawn since they are in the Deep Core.

What the hell is a GeNode, and what is the source for it?

Alyeska, if it's any consilation to you, I think that looks kick ass. Maybe you or someone should put together a set of total information of those guys, see if it can make it in to some fanfics? Just think, Elite forces vs ARC troopers in "Twilight War"

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2003-04-22 06:24pm

Ender wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote:Rarity of troops does not, in itself, indicate their role. Thrawn and the rest of the Empire did not have the time for the rigorous and in-depth training that Stormtrooper volunteers recieved in the OT--remember that much of the Chimaera's crew are inexperienced conscripts. The GeNode factories that supplied the elite Stormtroopers are also cut-off from Thrawn since they are in the Deep Core.
What the hell is a GeNode, and what is the source for it?

Alyeska, if it's any consilation to you, I think that looks kick ass. Maybe you or someone should put together a set of total information of those guys, see if it can make it in to some fanfics? Just think, Elite forces vs ARC troopers in "Twilight War"

The thought has crossed my mind. I have been envisioning taking the good aspects of several of the games and creating an alternate star trek. In the very least it would give a good fight against the Imperials in any VS debate.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-22 06:24pm

A "GeNode" is the common term within the Imperial Stormtrooper Corps for a artificially produced genetically enhanced clone soldier.

It is from the SWGB guide--a story called Pax Emperica.

GeNodes are made in what appears to be modified Spaarti apparatii.

They were likely established in facilities in the Deep Core. They were in use a few years after the Empire's beginning and it appears they saw service throughout Palpatine's rule.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-22 06:55pm

Why are we even discussing this? It's a computer game! These units are no more canon than the SSD-sized Rebel vessel they made in "Rebellion" to balance out the gameplay.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-22 06:57pm

Darth Wong wrote:Why are we even discussing this? It's a computer game! These units are no more canon than the SSD-sized Rebel vessel they made in "Rebellion" to balance out the gameplay.

According to Valiento of the TF.net Lit Forum, that is canon and you'd better know that.

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2003-04-22 07:03pm

The battle ends as the Particle of the Week (TM) makes the portable transporters malfunctions, trapping the Dukes of Hazzard Team into them

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-04-22 07:23pm

Alyeska wrote:Yes they do have the equvilant to heavy weaponry. The Photon Torpedo launcher as well as the Tetryon Gatling weapon are both heavy support weapons.

Gee, its too bad this isn't even canon or official. Something that IS official and acceptable is the mini proton torpedo launcher carried by spacetroopers....

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-22 07:25pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:Why are we even discussing this? It's a computer game! These units are no more canon than the SSD-sized Rebel vessel they made in "Rebellion" to balance out the gameplay.
According to Valiento of the TF.net Lit Forum, that is canon and you'd better know that.

TF.net's assholes do not concern me, Admiral ...

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2003-04-22 07:25pm

Lord Poe wrote:
Alyeska wrote:Yes they do have the equvilant to heavy weaponry. The Photon Torpedo launcher as well as the Tetryon Gatling weapon are both heavy support weapons.
Gee, its too bad this isn't even canon or official. Something that IS official and acceptable is the mini proton torpedo launcher carried by spacetroopers....

Except in this thread it IS canon. For normal rules it might not work, but the entire point of the thread is showing what the game portrays.

Interesting how several people make an almost fearful response saying "But its not real!"

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-22 07:27pm

Darth Wong wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:Why are we even discussing this? It's a computer game! These units are no more canon than the SSD-sized Rebel vessel they made in "Rebellion" to balance out the gameplay.
According to Valiento of the TF.net Lit Forum, that is canon and you'd better know that.
TF.net's assholes do not concern me, Admiral ...

IRG CommandoJoe · Post by **IRG CommandoJoe** » 2003-04-22 07:52pm

Alyeska wrote:Yes they do have the equvilant to heavy weaponry. The Photon Torpedo launcher as well as the Tetryon Gatling weapon are both heavy support weapons.

Err....I meant weapons seen in movies or shows...I sort of forgot that this was a video game thread.

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-04-22 07:58pm

Alyeska wrote:
Lord Poe wrote:Gee, its too bad this isn't even canon or official. Something that IS official and acceptable is the mini proton torpedo launcher carried by spacetroopers....
Except in this thread it IS canon. For normal rules it might not work, but the entire point of the thread is showing what the game portrays.

Interesting how several people make an almost fearful response saying "But its not real!"

Interesting how you completely ignore the mini proton torpedo launcher the Empire's footsoldiers have, which are admissible by the rules in this thread and outside of it....

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2003-04-22 07:59pm

IRG CommandoJoe wrote:
Alyeska wrote:Yes they do have the equvilant to heavy weaponry. The Photon Torpedo launcher as well as the Tetryon Gatling weapon are both heavy support weapons.
Err....I meant weapons seen in movies or shows...I sort of forgot that this was a video game thread.

Thats kinda the point of this thread. Its showing just how good the Hazard Team is. It actualy builds on a decent system for an Elite Force for Starfleet to use. I think a less complicated version could be used as standard SF infantry. Kinda like how modern special forces use the same basic technology but have vastly superior training and experience.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-04-22 07:59pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Alyeska's harping about shields is probably meaningless anyway.

Not to mention irrelevant since even a full-blown capital starship shield can't stop magnetic fields from inducing current in systems inside the shield, and that's what an EMP is. See "Symbiosis". Unless he's claiming that these "Hazard Team" shields are more capable than the combat shields on a capital warship

Alyeska wrote:
Illuminatus Primus wrote:SW hand weapons are powerful enough to probably drill through ST personal shielding.

E-11 or the Stormie equivalent of the Clonetrooper rifle seen in ANH on full auto....
And then again we have the compression rifles that can blow apart large piles of rocks and blow down fairly large doors.

And harmlessly scratch packing crates.

The ST weapons will do just fine against stormtroopers.

Unless their armour is made of material as strong as a typical packing crate in ST, in which case they're fucked. Since stormies are not made of rock, and phaser effects are wildly material-dependent, I don't see why you feel the need to bring that up.

And thats just the smaller weapons. You got the photon torpedo launcher, grenade launcher, and minigun even.

All of which are line-of-sight, which won't do them much good when the stormies start using their mortars and chemical weapons. I saw those screenshots; they are wearing their standard-issue spandex. Corrosive chemical weapon mortars will eat them up nicely, even before they achieve line of sight.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2003-04-22 08:03pm

The Scavenger is low powered (which makes sense concidering a hand gatling gun with high power would be impossible to aim) requiring multiple hits to kill on unarmored targets. The Photon launcher is a anti-armor weapon, and utterly wasteful against ground targets.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2003-04-22 08:05pm

A hand gatling gun is horribly inefficient in terms of mass. Not to mention being somewhat unwieldly.

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2003-04-22 08:36pm

Darth Wong wrote:And harmlessly scratch packing crates.

And what is this from? Besides, we know that phaser rifles have multiple power settings. Insurrection and Nemesis shows that the rifles are quite powerful.

The ST weapons will do just fine against stormtroopers.
Unless their armour is made of material as strong as a typical packing crate in ST, in which case they're fucked. Since stormies are not made of rock, and phaser effects are wildly material-dependent, I don't see why you feel the need to bring that up.
The rifle pulses do not show the same properties as the beam weapons. They seem to operate under a much different principle and they have a fair amount of concussion to them. Their demonstrated firepower in both Insurrection and Nemesis is quite nice.

And thats just the smaller weapons. You got the photon torpedo launcher, grenade launcher, and minigun even.
All of which are line-of-sight, which won't do them much good when the stormies start using their mortars and chemical weapons. I saw those screenshots; they are wearing their standard-issue spandex. Corrosive chemical weapon mortars will eat them up nicely, even before they achieve line of sight.

The Hazard Team encountered corrosive chemcials in Elite Force and their shield protection prevented any real damage. Furthermore the grenade launcher is most definately not a LOS weapon. Though I gotta admit not having mortars is somewhat big, but their use is not as important considering the Hazard Team does deal with more enclosed enviroments.

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2003-04-22 09:31pm

Alyeska wrote:Besides, we know that phaser rifles have multiple power settings. Insurrection and Nemesis shows that the rifles are quite powerful.

Yeah, we saw how powerful they were in Nemesis. They broke like a broomstick when force is applied to them.

The rifle pulses do not show the same properties as the beam weapons. They seem to operate under a much different principle and they have a fair amount of concussion to them. Their demonstrated firepower in both Insurrection and Nemesis is quite nice.

What did they do in those movies that phasers haven't done?

The Hazard Team encountered corrosive chemcials in Elite Force and their shield protection prevented any real damage.

Bullshit. I played the game, and you survive as long as you have hit points. There are no "shields", and as soon as you stop screaming
"EYARRGH!!" you're dead. I refer to the derelict the team enters to fire at the Harvester ship. Where are these corrosive-stopping shields then?

Furthermore the grenade launcher is most definately not a LOS weapon.

WTF are you talking about? The grenade launcher is definitely LOS. Unless you are playing with a MOD that allows you to fire a grenade launcher behind your back and around a corner or something, Alyeska?

Though I gotta admit not having mortars is somewhat big, but their use is not as important considering the Hazard Team does deal with more enclosed enviroments.

Maybe they should jump ship to Kirk's Enterprise. He knows about Federation mortars. (Arena)