Please, Mr. Wongs site and his reborn Empire, serve as an editorial device he uses as a bases for his analytical disscussion of the SW universe and how it would fair against the ST universe. One tends to have a pretense to start such research, much like you found his site as a pretense to start an argument over it.
Weather or not a Reborn Empire or an Imperial Remmenant goes up against the Federation, the science and the mathmatics of the two civilizations will still be the same. A 200GT turbolasere is still 200GT's weather it is mounted on an Remmenant stardestroyer or a Reborn Imperial stardestroyer.
Your argument is fluff, and no substance. Your want to argue the pretext in which Mr. Wong used to start his comparison of the two cultures and military, and have no interest to argue the comparison itself.
Fluff? Mr. Wong wouldn't answer this, so perhaps you would have. Please tell me how your totally unsupported argument that the Remnant would easily beat the Federation is at all supportable.
1. Pellaeon has shown his willingness to make peace with the Republic. He is not a warmonger, so the premise that he would even attack at all is suspect.
2. Lets go with a conservative estimate and say that the Remnant still has 150 Star Destroyers. How make can they spare when they are in a fight trying to stave off EXTINCTION at the hands of the Vong? How much resources would Pellaeon spare on attacking a galaxy of largely unknowns while gravitic anomalies are squeezing Munnilinnst or Bastion in half?
3. The Empire is one one-thousandth the size it was. Anyone who thinks, just in general, that it would be just as easy for the Remnant to conquer the Feds (and allies) as the Empire is smoking crack, plain and simple.
Basically I've heard two arguments today...
1. The Remnant would conquer the Feds just as easily as the Empire, even in the middle of their own fight for their lives! I don't have to prove this because if someone determines the right answer to a math problem is 1, and I take 5-3 and get 1, then the process really doesn't matter!
2. You are attacking my fan fiction! That has no bearing on my arguments, even when I argue that the Feds and the Empire should be compared AS THEY ARE!!
Neither is overly convincing.
Uggh.
The Imperial Remnant contains, according to the EU, 2,000 systems. How m,any does the UFP have. 350. I certainly do not need to state the obvious firepower, tech, and speed advantages the Imp Remnant. Your arguement is totally moronic. You are basically trying to knock down everthing that has been proved so far about the Empire vs the Feds.
Back out before you get hurt.
Triforcer wrote:whine whine whine whine whine 50,000 years whine whine whine whine NOT VALID whine whine whine whine whine whine whine CURRENT technology levels.
You seem to have a problem with your brain's higher functions. There's no such thing as CURRENT technology levels for Star Trek and Star Wars, since none of the stories is taking place during December 3, 2002 (I don't see any Galaxy-class ships flying around. Do you?) Maybe implanting some monkey cells in your brain will uplift you to near-human standards?
Nah.
We need to implant Thrawn's brain cells to even bring him up to ape level. he has the thinking capabilty of a goldfish. He is trying to tackle an issue far larger than he should be. Troll.
Triforcer wrote:whine whine whine whine whine 50,000 years whine whine whine whine NOT VALID whine whine whine whine whine whine whine CURRENT technology levels.
You seem to have a problem with your brain's higher functions. There's no such thing as CURRENT technology levels for Star Trek and Star Wars, since none of the stories is taking place during December 3, 2002 (I don't see any Galaxy-class ships flying around. Do you?) Maybe implanting some monkey cells in your brain will uplift you to near-human standards?
Nah.
We need to implant Thrawn's brain cells to even bring him up to ape level. he has the thinking capabilty of a goldfish. He is trying to tackle an issue far larger than he should be. Troll.
Scratch that, I meant uplift you closer to sub-human standards
Slartibartfast wrote:
You seem to have a problem with your brain's higher functions. There's no such thing as CURRENT technology levels for Star Trek and Star Wars, since none of the stories is taking place during December 3, 2002 (I don't see any Galaxy-class ships flying around. Do you?) Maybe implanting some monkey cells in your brain will uplift you to near-human standards?
Nah.
We need to implant Thrawn's brain cells to even bring him up to ape level. he has the thinking capabilty of a goldfish. He is trying to tackle an issue far larger than he should be. Troll.
Scratch that, I meant uplift you closer to sub-human standards
1: At current time Empie is now Empire Remenant. Can they still beat the federation?
short answer: Yes. the remenant is still vastly more powerful than the Fed.
2: Will the Remenant attack the Fed?
Answer: Yes. A quick scouting operation could easily reveal how weak the AQ powers are. Once they've got the AQ they can build up forces and tkae the rest of the galaxy. A galaxy full of resources ripe for the picking. Resources that could bring the Remenant back up to strength. They aren't going to pass up on a chance like that. Barring an act of Q the galaxy should be a pushover (apart from the Borg but they would eventually succomb - see other threads on the board) this leads us nicely on to ...
3: Riker once had the mental powers of Q. blah blah blah ....
Answer:
A) since when were mental powers classed as technology?
B) Would/could Riker use his powers against the remenant? As a starfleet officer he has certain moral obligations, as well as his own morals. Also, if he is for all intents and purposes Q, do the rules of the continuim affect him? They once stripped Q of his powers for being a pain in the arse. If Riker uses his powers to cause mass destruction to the Remenant they could do the same thing, and they could easily repair the damage.
I think these are his main points. anyone spot any more?
Ph34r teh eyebrow!!11!Writers GuildSluggitePawn of ChaosWYGIWYGAINGW so now i have to put ACPATHNTDWATGODW in my sigEBC-Honorary Geordie Hammerman! Hammer!
Master of Ossus wrote:LMAO! So that's where this guy comes from. If he's in the least bit representative of their board (and the high respect that Arthur tells us he is afforded demonstrates him to be such), then I could crush their board with the EU tied behind my back!
Sadly, he's one of the most rational people on that wretched hive of scum and idiocy. I can honestly say that I've never encountered more concentrated stupidity in one place. How the developers of the game can stomach to post there is beyond my mere mortal mind to fathom.
"I'm so fast that last night I turned off the light switch in my hotel room and was in bed before the room was dark." - Muhammad Ali
"Dating is not supposed to be easy. It's supposed to be a heart-pounding, stomach-wrenching, gut-churning exercise in pitting your fear of rejection and public humiliation against your desire to find a mate. Enjoy." - Darth Wong
The problem I have with this whole thing, well actually I have two problems now but I digress......
You claim that Mike Wong has made a "crucial error", and he hasn't. A crucial error would be if he accidently added an order of magnitude to his ISD firepower calculations. This is a small and insignificant nitpick, and it changes nothing. In fact your making it look worse for the UFP because now everyone that didn't really think about it before now realizes that the Imperial Remnant with their 200 ISDs and 1 SSD can still defeat the UFP.
The other problem I have is your acting like Darkstar, you make your claim, people explain.....you reitterate.....we explain again.....you reitterate again.....and the vicious circle repeats itself over and over till everyone justs yells FUCK IT. Your "discovery" is insignificant.....please drive through.
For some reason, the new guy seems to gloss over ONE VERY IMPORTANT ISSUE:
"A Long Time Ago In A Galaxy Far, Far Away..."
These stories with Luke and co. could have taken place in Earth's biblical times for all we know. A temporal monkey wrench is REQUIRED for there to be any argument in the first place.
He must stare at the screen in slack-jawed paralysis when "Yesterday's Enterprise" or "Trial and Tribble-ations"is shown....
"Brian, if I parked a supertanker in Central Park, painted it neon orange, and set it on fire, it would be less obvious than your stupidity." --RedImperator
And if you claim that the Q would instantly help the Federations, then I's ask you where they were during the Borg and all others invasions.
When did I ever said the Q would help the Federation? The ONLY statement I made is that WHEN William Riker had the powers of the Q, he could have handed any Empire invasion fleet their ass.
One is EMPIRE techonoly. The other is certainly not FEDERATION.
For a very short time period when Riker had it, IT WAS. And Mr. Wong said that precise points on the timeline mean nothing to him. So I pick the time when it was Federation technology, in the sense that this website defines it.
That’s nice; Voyager showed that the Q are simply humans with very advanced technology. After upgrades Voyager was able to combat them. Real Impressive.
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
Indeed, let's look at what the Q have actually accomplished:
1) Lots of illusions
2) Stopped a warp core breach
3) Adjusted the orbit of a moon
4) Made a star go nova
Hmmm ... how do we go from that to "omnipotence?" Indeed, if you took Centrepoint Station and some Talosians, you could achieve pretty much anything and everything that Q has ever done in Star Trek.
Trekkies seem to enjoy assuming that Q is God. What if Q is more like the Wizard of Oz?
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
PS. I'm still waiting for him to point out a "crucial error" in my site, rather than simply complaining that he doesn't like the plot device I used to pit the Empire against the Feds.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
I believe when Mike was debating with Robert Walper, who nitpicked that a match couldn't happen because the Empire fell, and Mike came up with the analogy "It's like saying a match beween the 1927 Yankees and the 1999 Yankees couldn't happen because the 1927 Yankees are dead".
Still, the Imperial Remnant, even at a fraction of it's origional strength, still is more than a match for the Federation.
Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi wrote:I believe when Mike was debating with Robert Walper, who nitpicked that a match couldn't happen because the Empire fell, and Mike came up with the analogy "It's like saying a match beween the 1927 Yankees and the 1999 Yankees couldn't happen because the 1927 Yankees are dead".
Still, the Imperial Remnant, even at a fraction of it's origional strength, still is more than a match for the Federation.
Indeed.
Acutally, one single ISD would do a helluva lotta damage to the Feddies.
Hey the Remnants could take the federation with its ground forces. Remeber the Romulans were going to take Vulcan with 5000 troops. It would be an easy victory .
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RIP Pegasus. You died like you lived, killing toasters
Darth Wong wrote:PS. I'm still waiting for him to point out a "crucial error" in my site, rather than simply complaining that he doesn't like the plot device I used to pit the Empire against the Feds.
You are going to be waiting a long time.
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
Hey Dont look at me all my clones are accounted for
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Bureaucrat and BOFH of the HAB,
Skunk Works director of the Mecha Maniacs,
Black Mage,
If you read the site and the background of the story, you find out that the Empire was reborn from the New Republic and became an Empire dealing with the rebels and all.
When it was written, the NJO didn't exist, nor had the Imps made peace with the NR.
Nowhere in the site does Wong mention anything about politics as to whether the imps would attack the feddies because of political slants of leaders.
Wong uses the EXACT SAME TECHNOLOGY THAT EXISTED UPTO AND INCLUDING THE EU. Therefore it doesn't matter as to how long after "current" times it happens, he uses "current" technology.
Go, tell the Spartans, stranger passing by,
That here, obedient to their laws, we lie.
