How to defeat an ISD with Starfleet Resources

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2004-01-25 02:45pm

The Empire has found an interesting series of Hyperspace conduits that strangely lead out of their galaxy and into a new that just so happens to be the Trek Galaxy. It is after Endor and the Empire recognizes they are loosing the war. They decide to send in an expiditionary force of a single sector fleet. Governments all over the Trek galaxy start falling and most races are put on the defensive. The sheer size of the Borg collective has slown down the Imperial take over somewhat.

Through extensive spy networks conducted by Section 31 the Federation has learned the technical capabilities of the Imperial forces. In a last desperate action a single fleet (one thousand ships) has been tasked with attempting to capture an ISD.

Much of the Federation has been defeated. Of the 150 member worlds 50 are outright conquered, 80 are destroyed, and another 20 remain intact. This Federation fleet is hiding in a nebula with its own support base. Most of the Federation territory is conquered, but the Imperial garrison forces are spread thin and as previously stated the sheer size of the Borg territory has slown down the Imperial take over.

You are the Admiral in command of this fleet. Your task is to capture an ISD. Given the technology and theoretical technology at your disposal, what do you do?

Remember, Section-31 has assisted in this. That means covert technology is at your disposal such as cloaking devices, long range subspace transporters, Genesis-MK2 devices, and even star destroying technology. But remember, you have to capture the ISD, not destroy it.

Can it be done?

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2004-01-25 03:10pm

Possible, With enough Ships, Enough High exposivies yes

Basicly, Use most of your fleet as Decoys while a few(About eight or so) Are refitted as troop carrier's with cloaks and subspace transporters, Use around a wing(144) ships as sucide bombs prefable cloacking them as well while the majority of your fleet(Around 600) should lure the SD to a spot you choice where your bombs and your troop ships are waiting hidden

Preably do this near an astrod belt to use some of them as extra rams if not you can always drag some out and cloack them

While you pummel their ships with conventional torps and q-torps you pull it into the spot you want then blast the shit out of it with all your firepower then give it a two sec, start Transporting your troops over then move your reseves in to hold the thing there and port in more trops

The whole thing hings on getting the ship to the spot you want, taking a page from Thrawn(And Stravo's

) books and using rocks as missile via cloaking them and sending them in to knock down the shields to get your troops in and just overwheel them

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2004-01-25 03:11pm

Also another possiblity the Sucided bombs also have subspace transporters and while its heading in have it auto-lock onto life-signatures on the ship and and transport them aboard

Course it all hings on how well subspace transporters work aginst the SD hull

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2004-01-25 03:13pm

Ah, but how do you get the ISD in the first place? When ships like a Carrack light cruiser can effectively take on the fleet or large elements of it, you have to use something to lure the ISD into battle, or at least in to investigate what is going on.

This is where the WMDs come into play IMO. You use them to destroy or severly damage the conquered worlds to catch the Imperials attention and then setup a specific trap to catch and hold an ISD from escape.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-01-25 03:23pm

Section 31 is going to be useless. Their intelligence-gathering abilities are piss-poor outside of the Federation; they seem to be more of a counter-espionage agency than an actual espionage agency. They are far better at spying on their own people than they are at spying on others, as demonstrated by their total failure to realize what had happened when Shinzon took over the Romulan Empire. And that's with decades to build up an intel network on Romulus! Against a totally alien force from another galaxy, they're worthless. A lot of Trek fans do a lot of Section 31 wanking, but an intelligence agency does not have magical abilities to instantly divine information about the enemy. After a few weeks or months of war, Section 31's sum total of knowledge about the Empire (or, for that matter, any totally unfamiliar new enemy) would be "wha?"

As for the technology at your disposal, even if you had Genesis or star-destroying technology (by no means a given), how would they help you capture an ISD rather than just wrecking one of your own star systems?

If you want to pull it off, I think you would need an ISD whose circumstances are highly unusual. For example, a damaged ISD which is undergoing repairs and is not entirely functional or crewed. This means you have less resistance to worry about, and the ship isn't going anywhere for a while. It would still be a bitch; you could theoretically try to transport people through the bridge windows when the shields are down and try to take the bridge, but there are tens of thousands of crewers in the rest of the ship that you'd have to deal with.

Entering an ISD via transporters would force you through various defensive chokepoints because of the limitations of trying to transport through its dense hull (even subspace sensor pings don't get through sufficiently dense material), and "Way of the Warrior" showed us the other limitation of this tactic, which is speed of insertion. You could enter through the bridge and the docking area, but that means you're going to have to get through some truly horrible casualties trying to make headway. You could try to enter in small groups through windows all over the ship, but that would still leave you at the relatively unimportant outer areas, with a lot of ground to cover before you get to the guts of the vessel.

Another big concern would be the likelihood that the crew has orders to destroy critical technology (or the whole ship) to prevent capture. How do you stop them?

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-01-25 03:24pm

Alyeska wrote:This is where the WMDs come into play IMO. You use them to destroy or severly damage the conquered worlds to catch the Imperials attention and then setup a specific trap to catch and hold an ISD from escape.

You would wipe out billions of your own citizens in order to lure an ISD into a trap? Why exactly would the Federation's citizens prefer you to the new Imperial overlords, then? The populations of captured worlds are your former people, aren't they?

Techno_Union · Post by **Techno_Union** » 2004-01-25 03:49pm

IMO if you are able to get on board an ISD while it is being repaired like Mike said) and you can get control of the bridge, you would still have to deal with the thousands of war droids that would be stationed on board. Then you would need to figure out a way to get the ISD moving and out of the system (assuming the Feds could operate a Hyperdirve, doubt it). And ISD computers are not one single huge computer, the crew should be able to override your controls with the proper command codes. Also, what is stopping the Imperials from sending aid to the ISD?
This reminds me of the Trek scenerio on this site about the Feds attempting to capture an ISD.

Robert Walper · Post by **Robert Walper** » 2004-01-25 03:56pm

Use whatever means to attract an ISD to a specific location. Perhaps fake a distress signal and lure the nearest one into the trap, or make some type of display using those WMD's that would attract a single vessel, but not major attention.

Use a cloaked vessel to sneak up to the ISD, and beam one of those wonder viruses Trek has(assuming the fleet can get or has one).

Failing that, get a large group of ships to install cloaking devices. Sneak up to said ship, and instead of beaming people onto the ISD, beam them off...into space. Beam explosives throughout the ship where they'd have to most effect, like communications and FTL drive system. Preferably these explosives would only do temporary damage, but enough to disable the ISD from fleeing and calling for help quickly.

The best plan I think would be extremely fast acting bio attack against the crew, which would leave the ISD in prime condition and ready for takeover.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-01-25 04:00pm

Robert Walper wrote:The best plan I think would be extremely fast acting bio attack against the crew, which would leave the ISD in prime condition and ready for takeover.

Doesn't work. If it acts too fast, it won't spread very far. If it acts slowly enough to infiltrate the whole ship, then they'll have more than enough time to realize something is happening and jump out of there or call for backup. Plus, all on-duty stormtroopers in the ship are immune to bio-agents since they wear the full sealed uniform. One of them can call for help.

The cheesiest ideas always have the word "bio" in them.

Robert Walper · Post by **Robert Walper** » 2004-01-25 04:22pm

Darth Wong wrote:
Robert Walper wrote:The best plan I think would be extremely fast acting bio attack against the crew, which would leave the ISD in prime condition and ready for takeover.
Doesn't work. If it acts too fast, it won't spread very far.

I was thinking along the lines of some type of agent that would work using the ISD's ventilation systems. Can't say how those work though...a shot in the dark on my part.

If it acts slowly enough to infiltrate the whole ship, then they'll have more than enough time to realize something is happening and jump out of there or call for backup.

I'd probably want to use a combination of the ideas I mentioned. Disabling their communications and drive with those beamed in explosives, assuming it could be done without said systems being irreparable.

Plus, all on-duty stormtroopers in the ship are immune to bio-agents since they wear the full sealed uniform. One of them can call for help.

If the ISD's communication equipment is disabled or jammed, I don't think the Stormtroopers could do too much.

The cheesiest ideas always have the word "bio" in them.

You're always hurting my feelings.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2004-01-25 04:24pm

Robert Walper wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:
Robert Walper wrote:The best plan I think would be extremely fast acting bio attack against the crew, which would leave the ISD in prime condition and ready for takeover.
Doesn't work. If it acts too fast, it won't spread very far.
I was thinking along the lines of some type of agent that would work using the ISD's ventilation systems. Can't say how those work though...a shot in the dark on my part.

A combat warship on the ISD's scale is not going to have unfiltered, unscrubbed universal ventilation systems, particularly when certain areas can be flooded with nerve gas.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-01-25 04:26pm

Alyeska wrote:This is where the WMDs come into play IMO. You use them to destroy or severly damage the conquered worlds to catch the Imperials attention and then setup a specific trap to catch and hold an ISD from escape.

If you simply destroy a captured world with a bio-weapon ... why would the Empire go over there? The world has already been lost, by that point, and you can look forward to other captured worlds being more heavily protected.

FTeik · Post by **FTeik** » 2004-01-25 04:53pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote:
Robert Walper wrote:
Darth Wong wrote: Doesn't work. If it acts too fast, it won't spread very far.
I was thinking along the lines of some type of agent that would work using the ISD's ventilation systems. Can't say how those work though...a shot in the dark on my part.
A combat warship on the ISD's scale is not going to have unfiltered, unscrubbed universal ventilation systems, particularly when certain areas can be flooded with nerve gas.

Which is confirmed by BFC, where sections of an ISD can get another atmosphere to prevent fires aboard during combat.

Trogdor · Post by **Trogdor** » 2004-01-25 05:07pm

I doubt it could be done. The only real edge I see Starfleet having is greater knowledge of the territory and the various anomalies. Perhaps they could somehow lure the ISD into a anomaly that will cause a temporal loop, which would allow them to try every possible idea until something worked.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-01-25 05:14pm

If you can capture and seal off the bridge, you might be able to do it. What was that episode (TNG, and I really need to start remembering episode names) where the Enterprise D was in starbase for cleaning/bioscrubbing or some such and they had that big ass energy field go through the ship that killed all living organisms aboard? There was an alien group trying to hijack the ship and Picard almost bought it in 10 Forward. Get the bridge, seal it off, go to your support base, run the field over the destroyer, and you're done.

Tribun · Post by **Tribun** » 2004-01-25 05:22pm

Rogue 9 wrote:If you can capture and seal off the bridge, you might be able to do it. What was that episode (TNG, and I really need to start remembering episode names) where the Enterprise D was in starbase for cleaning/bioscrubbing or some such and they had that big ass energy field go through the ship that killed all living organisms aboard? There was an alien group trying to hijack the ship and Picard almost bought it in 10 Forward. Get the bridge, seal it off, go to your support base, run the field over the destroyer, and you're done.

Problem No.1: Bridge control can be disabled, with rerouting control to auxallerry bridge or local controls. That is no problem in imperial ships, unlike Fed ships, where the bridge is very important, and loosing it means loosing the ship.

Problem No.2: Even if the crew isn't able to get control of the ship again, they could still self-destruct by overloading thier ionization reactor or iniziationg the self-destruction sequence.

Problem No.3: Who sais that these beam can even penetrate the hull of an ISD.

Problem No.4: Shuttung off the bridge isn't possible. Stormtroopers would simply use thier heavy weapons to destroy the blast doors. (remember the sandcrawler...?)

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-01-25 05:25pm

I was thinking more along the lines of a Trade Federation battleship. I think the Empire can afford better blast doors than Jawas.

Tribun · Post by **Tribun** » 2004-01-25 05:29pm

Rogue 9 wrote:I was thinking more along the lines of a Trade Federation battleship. I think the Empire can afford better blast doors than Jawas.

PLEASE! In the ANH novellization, the Stormtroopers simply demolished a thick wall to enter the cell block. I don't think that recapturing the bridge should be a problem for them.

Solauren · Post by **Solauren** » 2004-01-25 05:57pm

I can't really think of a way gauranteed to work, but I can think of a few that might

Find an unshielded Star Destroyer (i.e in orbit on vacation, who knows)
Move a shit load of Phase Cloaked ships around it
have shitloads of 'redshits', and I mean shitloads. (Like 40,000 of them if possible) armed with tons of weapons, including concussive explosives ready to beam over
Decloak
Beam everyone over

Hope to hell it works

Techno_Union · Post by **Techno_Union** » 2004-01-25 06:17pm

Rogue 9 wrote:I was thinking more along the lines of a Trade Federation battleship. I think the Empire can afford better blast doors than Jawas.

Ya, but the blastdoors could be overrided localy is neccessary. Capturing the bridge would not be able to happen.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-01-25 06:26pm

Techno_Union wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:I was thinking more along the lines of a Trade Federation battleship. I think the Empire can afford better blast doors than Jawas.
Ya, but the blastdoors could be overrided localy is neccessary. Capturing the bridge would not be able to happen.

Why couldn't the Feds capture the bridge by beaming in? I'll grant that they likely couldn't blast their way through the blast doors if they came through the ship, but if the bridge was their insertion point then I don't see why they couldn't close the damn doors. I never noticed all that many guards on the bridge. They'd be fighting mostly officers and techs.

Techno_Union · Post by **Techno_Union** » 2004-01-25 06:29pm

The bridge crew also carried their own blasters.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-01-25 06:30pm

Who cares if they capture the bridge? How are they going to stop the people in the engine room from bringing the ship to a dead stop and then planting explosives around the main reactor to prevent intact capture?

Luzifer's right hand · Post by **Luzifer's right hand** » 2004-01-25 06:45pm

In the case of working transporters:
Beam the crew of the ISD out(I would beam them into vacuum of space, although I think the Federation would prefer holding cells) . I always thought it was funny when they beamed their own men in and not the crew of the hostile ships out.

YT300000 · Post by **YT300000** » 2004-01-25 06:52pm

Why am I suddenly reminded of this?