Minimum strength boarding party

Setzer · Post by **Setzer** » 2002-12-30 02:05pm

How many people do you need to take over a Sovereign class vessel?
The boarding party must be capable of entering the ship from any location and still completing its mission. Each boarder is armed with a 20th century SMG or carbine, 5 frag grenades, a knife, a pistol, and IR/Night vision gear.

BTW, here's a qoute from MGS2 that is somewhat relevant:

SNAKE: Otacon, how many people do you need to take over a vessel of this size.
OTACON: The ship is run by a computer, so I'd say about 18 people.

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2002-12-30 02:27pm

50-100

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2002-12-30 02:33pm

Two Delta Force or SAS commandoes.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-12-30 02:39pm

A troop of Boy Scouts.

Warspite · Post by **Warspite** » 2002-12-30 02:50pm

The A-Team, but Mr. T is NOT going anywhere near engineering!

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2002-12-30 02:51pm

I think about a squad could do it. Feddies rely too heavily on their hi-tech solutions. Weapons supression won't work on a "primative firearm" and if the squad has full enviromental gear then the gas won't work. Add to this the standard incompetance of a gold/red shirt and you have an easy victory for the borading team.

SWPIGWANG · Post by **SWPIGWANG** » 2002-12-30 02:57pm

R2D2 + destroyer drone

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2002-12-30 03:47pm

Four 15 year olds with MP-7's.

paladin · Post by **paladin** » 2002-12-30 04:40pm

Master of Ossus wrote:A troop of Boy Scouts.

A troop of cub scouts could do it.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2002-12-30 04:47pm

Actually, while the responses have gotten silly, I'm serious; I think two Delta Force or SAS guys could very well have the ability to fight their way to the bridge of a Federation ship. What do you think?

Note to Trekkies: keep in mind that these facile "they would just beam them off" arguments could easily be applied to Remans or Klingons or anyone else, yet it usually isn't an option, so don't bother that avenue of attack. Could pajama-suited Feddies actually stop a pair of Delta Force or SAS commandoes who have knowledge of the layout of the ship and intend to fight their way to the bridge?

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-12-30 04:49pm

Darth Wong wrote: I'm serious; I think two Delta Force or SAS guys could very well have the ability to fight their way to the bridge of a Federation ship. What do you think?

Usually it takes between four and eight commandoes to storm a room. Even though the marksmanship demonstrated by "Nemesis" was atrocious by any definition of the word, I think that the Feddies would, through random chance, be able to kill two people in the small and confined corridors. I think that it would take between four and eight men with modern SMG's or assault rifles to seize control of a Sovereign class ship.

Oberleutnant · Post by **Oberleutnant** » 2002-12-30 04:58pm

While less than ten well trained and equipped soldiers might be enough of seizing control of most vital parts of a Sovereign-class vessel, I doubt they would be able to hold it for long. Send in about fifty SAS operators and you'll get the entire ship and keep it under your command as well.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2002-12-30 05:04pm

Well yes, seizing and holding the ship are more difficult than simply fighting your way to the bridge.

Warspite · Post by **Warspite** » 2002-12-30 05:09pm

Would seizing the bridge be enough? I mean, we've seen so many ways to get around a ship, and remotely access other locations (Jefferies tubes and those damn access panels), that the boarding team, would spent a lot of time "cleaning the house".

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2002-12-30 05:16pm

ST ships are ultra-centralized, and their crews don't carry any kind of NBC protection. Seizing control of the bridge normally means seizing control of the whole ship. A handful of Ferengi did it in "Rascals". The only problem is holding onto it, and two guys is a bit light for that.

Warspite · Post by **Warspite** » 2002-12-30 05:31pm

Now, that I remember... In ST III, the Klingons took command of the Enterprise, and they were only... 6 or 8, nevermind, more than 4, at least. Of course, the ship was deserted, but they didn't know that, and went heavily armed (these where back in the good old days...

), directly for the bridge, after being beamed aboard. Fortunately, they didn't stay there for long... BUM!

Anyway, a normal platoon of 12-15 would be able to secure the ship.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-12-30 06:24pm

Warspite wrote:Now, that I remember... In ST III, the Klingons took command of the Enterprise, and they were only... 6 or 8, nevermind, more than 4, at least. Of course, the ship was deserted, but they didn't know that, and went heavily armed (these where back in the good old days... ), directly for the bridge, after being beamed aboard. Fortunately, they didn't stay there for long... BUM!

Anyway, a normal platoon of 12-15 would be able to secure the ship.

Also remember that the Klingons are far weaker in terms of combat ability than modern commandoes--FAR weaker, and that this boarding party is consistent with the numbers we have seen from DS9 and NEM.

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2002-12-30 06:34pm

Also bear in mind that a Sovereign is a godawfully large area to control compared to modern-day ships and such, and is many many times larger than the original Enterprise.

Warspite · Post by **Warspite** » 2002-12-30 06:42pm

Mind you, I wasn't supporting the Klingon action... I was just adding to the debate that the Klingons were considering taking the Enterprise with such a small force. --- "Victory, My Lord." --- Said the leader of the boarding party. (sadly, can't remenber what Cristopher Loyd (the Klingon captain) said before.)

Due to the centralization, the size of the Sovereign is only a problem for delaying/guerrilla actions. If our boardees (what?) are able to seize the bridge fast, it shouldn't be much trouble.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2002-12-30 10:05pm

Someone suggested to me setting a dozen or so ewoks loose might do the trick....if nothing else they'd likely trash they warp core and blow the thing up....something to do with animal fur in the 'quantum-phase-inhibiting-manifold-sticky-back-plastic-frequency-tachyon-deflector'.....

Personally with the degree of skill routinely demonstrated by ST security teams I'd be content with three squads of 4 to control the ship. Send one team to the bridge, another to take control of the engineering section and then have the last team go cleaning up....
I'd prefer a slightly larger inventory of equipment....I think flamethrowers might be an amusing way of dealing with them....we might even get to find out if the standard pj's comply with fire saftey standards.....

Keevan Colton
- Former Prince of the Underempire, SWC.
"Saltan valoramosa n teval mord..."

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2002-12-30 10:11pm

Warspite wrote:Now, that I remember... In ST III, the Klingons took command of the Enterprise, and they were only... 6 or 8, nevermind, more than 4, at least. Of course, the ship was deserted, but they didn't know that, and went heavily armed (these where back in the good old days... ), directly for the bridge, after being beamed aboard. Fortunately, they didn't stay there for long... BUM!

Anyway, a normal platoon of 12-15 would be able to secure the ship.

A platoon is generally 30-50 men. 12-13 is a couple fire teams, a big squad.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2002-12-30 10:23pm

Warspite wrote:Now, that I remember... In ST III, the Klingons took command of the Enterprise, and they were only... 6 or 8, nevermind, more than 4, at least. Of course, the ship was deserted, but they didn't know that, and went heavily armed (these where back in the good old days... ), directly for the bridge, after being beamed aboard. Fortunately, they didn't stay there for long... BUM!

The Klingons were heavily armed? As I recall, they carried nothing but handguns and knives.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2002-12-30 10:29pm

Darth Wong wrote:
Warspite wrote:Now, that I remember... In ST III, the Klingons took command of the Enterprise, and they were only... 6 or 8, nevermind, more than 4, at least. Of course, the ship was deserted, but they didn't know that, and went heavily armed (these where back in the good old days... ), directly for the bridge, after being beamed aboard. Fortunately, they didn't stay there for long... BUM!
The Klingons were heavily armed? As I recall, they carried nothing but handguns and knives.

That *is* very heavily armed for a klingon.....as time has went on I think they've forgotten where to get guns.....

Keevan Colton
- Former Prince of the Underempire, SWC.

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2002-12-30 10:52pm

If they were in a situation were they were immediatly confronted with a SF security squad, I think a teargas grenade could handle them nicely, assuming these commandoes bring with them gas masks. They however weren't specifyed in the begginign, so I guess not. Still SF security has shown us three things:

1.) They will be in few numbers,
2.) Their accuracy will be poor, and most importantly
3.) They will send high-ranking officers to do battle wil the invaders.

If a couple of these high-ranking officers were slew, it may sow confusion amongst the ship.

SF pajamas won't protect them froma well placed shot to the chest. If the Trek team were to get too deeply entrenched (maybe behind some convienietly placed crates

) a grenade would knock them out. If it were faced-paced movement by the commandoes, their rapid fire machine guns would easily drop a dozen SF security guards.

Naturally if these guys are to seize the ship they must know its workings, thus they would easily be able to slip into one of the tubes and cut the power. Although the emergency lights will activate, the view they provide is mediocre at best. The darkness would most certaintly help cover a squads movements. Taking the bridge would be pittifully easy, they wouldn't go through the turbolift I'd think (and not if the power is cut) but there must be some other way to acsess the bridge. The shootout in the bridge would prove ot be painfully short.

Then they woudl either reactivaste the power and set up some force-fielda around the bridge, and if that wasn't possible, they would just hold defensive positions on the brige and kill any intruders.

But any attacking commando squads with proper intel would bring gas bombs, after all those SF idiots don't have NBC suits.

Kamakazie Sith · Post by **Kamakazie Sith** » 2002-12-30 11:04pm

Warspite wrote:Now, that I remember... In ST III, the Klingons took command of the Enterprise, and they were only... 6 or 8, nevermind, more than 4, at least. Of course, the ship was deserted, but they didn't know that, and went heavily armed (these where back in the good old days... ), directly for the bridge, after being beamed aboard. Fortunately, they didn't stay there for long... BUM!

Anyway, a normal platoon of 12-15 would be able to secure the ship.

Remember that the Klingons also underestimated them. They expected light resistance because it is a ship full of weak humans who would be cowering at the very presense of Klingons.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Minimum strength boarding party

Minimum strength boarding party

Hmm.....Ewok Sabotage Team......