India nuclear submarine INS Arihant is now operational

[Sarevok]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/8169360.stm

India launches nuclear submarine
Manmohan Singh speaks during the launch ceremony of India"s first nuclear-powered submarine, INS Arihant at Vishakhapatnam in India, Sunday, July 26, 2009.
Mr Singh said 'we do not seek to threaten anyone'

India has launched its first nuclear-powered submarine, becoming only the sixth country in the world to do so.

The 6,000 tonne Arihant was launched by India's Prime Minister Manmohan Singh at a ceremony on the south-east coast.

It was built entirely in India with Russian assistance and a second one is due to be constructed shortly.

It will undergo trials over the next few years before being deployed and will be able to launch missiles at targets 700km (437 miles) away.

Until now, only the US, Russia, France, Britain and China had the capability to build nuclear submarines.

'China threat'

Launching the INS Arihant, Mr Singh said India had no aggressive designs on anyone.

Indian workers (L) paint the conning tower of the INS Kursura, on display as a part of the INS Kurusura Submarine Museum, at Rama Krishna Beach in Visakhapatnam, some 800 kilometers from Hyderabad, on July 25, 2009.
India has relied mainly on Russian-built submarines until now

But the sea was becoming increasingly relevant to India's security concerns, he added.

"It is incumbent upon us to take all measures necessary to safeguard our country and to keep pace with technological advancements worldwide," he told the ceremony in the port city of Visakhapatnam.

The BBC's Sanjoy Majumder in Delhi says until now India has been able to launch ballistic missiles only from the air and from land.

Nuclear submarines will add a third dimension to its defence capability.

When it is eventually deployed, the top-secret Arihant will be able to carry 100 sailors on board.

It will be able to stay under water for long periods and thereby increase its chances of remaining undetected.

By contrast, India's ageing conventional diesel-powered submarines need to constantly surface to recharge their batteries.

Our correspondent says the launching of the Arihant is a clear sign that India is looking to blunt the threat from China which has a major naval presence in the region.

Conspiracy nuts in south asia have long proclaimed India as the lite version of evil american empire (tm). Now with nuclear subs and future aircraft carriers the coming decades are going to get very interesting.

[Stuart]

A few points.

She isn't operational and won't be for at least two years. She has to run trials first and getting a ship like this into service is no easy matter.

She isn't being launched, that happened in December 2007. The BBC produced this report from an article in the Hindu Times that came out about ten days ago. In it, the newspaper used the term "launched" to mean "handed over for trials", a malapropism that's quite understandable for a non-first language newspaper.

She isn't a ballistic missile boat. She actually fires cruise missiles. There are a lot of reports of a ballistic missile capability for teh Indian Navy but this boat isn't it. This leads to speculation that there is a second Indian nuclear-powered submarine program that is a ballistic missile submarine. That would make sense, since this boat is in production, the design team has very little to do.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

How much Russian help was involved to prevent this sub from being a disaster?

[Patrick Degan]

She isn't a ballistic missile boat. She actually fires cruise missiles. There are a lot of reports of a ballistic missile capability for teh Indian Navy but this boat isn't it. This leads to speculation that there is a second Indian nuclear-powered submarine program that is a ballistic missile submarine. That would make sense, since this boat is in production, the design team has very little to do.

Yes, at 6000 tonnes, that would seem too small for a boomer, more an SSN. But would the Indian Navy go the boomer route or opt instead for SSGNs firing nuclear-tipped cruise missiles as a deterrent force against China (or Pakistan)?

[Starglider]

But would the Indian Navy go the boomer route or opt instead for SSGNs firing nuclear-tipped cruise missiles as a deterrent force against China (or Pakistan)?

If the 700km figure is correct (and given the other inaccuracies in this story I would not count on it), then the missiles are only able to hit the lower half of Pakistan even from relatively close to the shore. Most notably they do not have the range to hit Islamabad (and even if they would have to traverse pretty much the entirety of the country's air defence network), which is not really acceptable in a second-strike nuclear deterrent. Even to hit Bejing, the sub would have to sail right up to the mouth of the Yellow Sea, which might be feasible with the PRC's current detection capabilities but isn't something you'd want to rely on. Something equivalent to the UGM-109A (sub-launched long-range Tomahawk variant) would solve the range issue, but unstealthy subsonic missiles are still very vulnerable to air defences.

[Pelranius]

But would the Indian Navy go the boomer route or opt instead for SSGNs firing nuclear-tipped cruise missiles as a deterrent force against China (or Pakistan)?

If the 700km figure is correct (and given the other inaccuracies in this story I would not count on it), then the missiles are only able to hit the lower half of Pakistan even from relatively close to the shore. Most notably they do not have the range to hit Islamabad (and even if they would have to traverse pretty much the entirety of the country's air defence network), which is not really acceptable in a second-strike nuclear deterrent. Even to hit Bejing, the sub would have to sail right up to the mouth of the Yellow Sea, which might be feasible with the PRC's current detection capabilities but isn't something you'd want to rely on. Something equivalent to the UGM-109A (sub-launched long-range Tomahawk variant) would solve the range issue, but unstealthy subsonic missiles are still very vulnerable to air defences.

I doubt you would want to take something noisy as the Arihant anywhere close to the Chinese coast. Chinese ASW capabilities aren't stellar, but they monitor their coastal waters (a fair number of their ships actually have TAS and no sane Indian skipper is going to be absurdly optimistic enough to think that he can simultaneously sneak past the South, East and North Seas Fleets) enough that I won't want to take anything less than a modern submarine near their coast.

So is it a Golf style SSBN (meaning it only carries a few missile), a SSGN or a SSN?

[Stuart]

How much Russian help was involved to prevent this sub from being a disaster?

By all accounts, a lot. Like handing over the reactor design as a package and having their engineers supervise every step of the design work (read they told the designers which pencil to pick up). The sub herself is supposed to be based on the Russian Project 670M (Charlie II) class boats. If so, she has angled large-caliber tubes forward for cruiser missiles, probably the new Brahmos.

Yes, at 6000 tonnes, that would seem too small for a boomer, more an SSN. But would the Indian Navy go the boomer route or opt instead for SSGNs firing nuclear-tipped cruise missiles as a deterrent force against China (or Pakistan)?

Well, we know the Indians are developing a submarine-launched version of Agni so it does look as if they are going to a SSBN solution. There's a strong political thing here, possession of SSBNs is the mark of a Great Power and India wants to be considered one. It's an open question whether an SSGN attack is more "stoppable" than an SSBN attack. The range issue though runs strongly in favor of the SSBN. Cruise missiles have realistic ranges of hundreds of kilometers, ballistic missiles, thousands.

If the 700km figure is correct (and given the other inaccuracies in this story I would not count on it), then the missiles are only able to hit the lower half of Pakistan even from relatively close to the shore. Most notably they do not have the range to hit Islamabad (and even if they would have to traverse pretty much the entirety of the country's air defence network), which is not really acceptable in a second-strike nuclear deterrent. Even to hit Bejing, the sub would have to sail right up to the mouth of the Yellow Sea, which might be feasible with the PRC's current detection capabilities but isn't something you'd want to rely on. Something equivalent to the UGM-109A (sub-launched long-range Tomahawk variant) would solve the range issue, but unstealthy subsonic missiles are still very vulnerable to air defences.

Exactly; my bet would be that the SSGN function would be for use against ports and shore facilities, trying to clobber the Pakistan Navy while its still alongside. The Indians have tried that before by the way, not using nukes obviously.

I doubt you would want to take something noisy as the Arihant anywhere close to the Chinese coast. Chinese ASW capabilities aren't stellar, but they monitor their coastal waters (a fair number of their ships actually have TAS and no sane Indian skipper is going to be absurdly optimistic enough to think that he can simultaneously sneak past the South, East and North Seas Fleets) enough that I won't want to take anything less than a modern submarine near their coast. So is it a Golf style SSBN (meaning it only carries a few missile), a SSGN or a SSN?

This boat? She's an SSN that has the capability to shoot cruise missiles (these days most SSNs do). *****My guess**** is that there's an SSBN derivative of her being developed with a new missile section inserted amidships, probably with 8 - 12 tubes for an Agni-based SLBM. We won't see her for quite some time.

[Pelranius]

The SSBN derivative is the story I've also heard from Indians on other boards.

Though personally I must admit that using the Arihant to nuke Pakistani naval bases sounds like serious overkill to me.

[Simon_Jester]

A few points.

She isn't operational and won't be for at least two years. She has to run trials first and getting a ship like this into service is no easy matter.

She isn't being launched, that happened in December 2007. The BBC produced this report from an article in the Hindu Times that came out about ten days ago. In it, the newspaper used the term "launched" to mean "handed over for trials", a malapropism that's quite understandable for a non-first language newspaper.

She isn't a ballistic missile boat. She actually fires cruise missiles. There are a lot of reports of a ballistic missile capability for teh Indian Navy but this boat isn't it. This leads to speculation that there is a second Indian nuclear-powered submarine program that is a ballistic missile submarine. That would make sense, since this boat is in production, the design team has very little to do.

Yeah; nuclear submarine != nuclear missile armed submarine.

Of course, a nuclear-tipped submarine-launched cruise missile is nothing to sneeze at. Especially not if it has a 700 km range. It's not a weapon for obliterating the inland capitals or sneaking through the patrol fleets of major naval powers, but it's not something to be taken lightly, either.

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

How willing are the Russians to selling their Rk-55s? If the Indians want like a few thousand km range, that's the way to go in the short term.

[Vympel]

How willing are the Russians to selling their Rk-55s? If the Indians want like a few thousand km range, that's the way to go in the short term.

Not at all, because they're not permitted to do so under the MTCR (informal and voluntary, but taken very seriously by the Russians in all their export missile dealings).

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

How willing are the Russians to selling their Rk-55s? If the Indians want like a few thousand km range, that's the way to go in the short term.

Not at all, because they're not permitted to do so under the MTCR (informal and voluntary, but taken very seriously by the Russians in all their export missile dealings).

The Ukrainian option might come to mind however.

[Vympel]

The Ukrainian option might come to mind however.

I don't think Ukraine has any Kh-55 or Kh-55SMs left in inventory, they were given to Russia when they got back their flyable Tu-95MS and Tu-160 bombers. Further, they'd require modification to be launched from a submarine (the Granat SLCM is based off of the Kh-55, after all, they never launched them straight) and I don't think anyone in Ukraine would have the slightest clue how to do it (Ukraine never built SSNs).

[Thanas]

She isn't a ballistic missile boat. She actually fires cruise missiles. There are a lot of reports of a ballistic missile capability for teh Indian Navy but this boat isn't it. This leads to speculation that there is a second Indian nuclear-powered submarine program that is a ballistic missile submarine. That would make sense, since this boat is in production, the design team has very little to do.

Are you sure about that? Granted, I can only rely on wikipedia, but it says that the boat is going to be equipped with the Sagarika SLBM.

[Beowulf]

No one actually knows what a Sagarika actually looks like. There are two different descriptions of it: one says it's a solid fuel ballistic missile. The other says it's a cruise missile. Wikipedia also claims it's a 18 meter long missile that fits into a submarine with a beam of 14 meters (not necessarily a problem, but that'd indicate some sort of hunchback that's not know to exist on the Arihant).

I wouldn't trust wikipedia on this submarine. It's far to inconsistent to be trusted.