Gun Ammo Rant (Split from Guntoting WingNut thread)

[Count Chocula]

You can get them from a Smith & Wesson dealer or from Alexander Arms. Probably steel-cased non-reloadable rounds, though, if it's Wolf ammunition you're pondering.

[Knife]

I hadn't heard of .22 LR of all calibers becoming a rarity suddenly

Believe it. Fucking Walmart was out today. Not 'out' like waiting for the truck, 'out' like they have a list and when they get in a shipment, they go down the list in order. Fucking .22 LR. Luckily my father in law as a stockpile (not Obama related, actually kind of old ammo so...) so my kid can shoot this weekend. Even my 12 gauge shells are getting expensive, though still plenty around.

[Tsyroc]

How much longer before these shortages start impacting hunting seasons?

I know my dad has had problems finding shotgun shell primers in the past. I'll have to ask him if he still has enough shells around to get through dove and quail seasons.

As for the .22LR shortage. I'm assuming people are buying that just so they have something to target shoot with. .22 LR has usually been really cheap to buy so it's sad that there are now shortages of it. How much longer before the "shortages" bleed over into the pellet and bb markets as people look for cheaper alternatives to target shoot with.

[His Divine Shadow]

.22lr is the ultimate survivors round. So all those survivalists will want .22lr.

It's cheap and weighs little and can kill most smaller animals so with a .22lr rifle and a few hundreds worth of ammo you could hunt for decades after socialism causes the fall of society

[Edward Yee]

As for the .22LR shortage. I'm assuming people are buying that just so they have something to target shoot with. .22 LR has usually been really cheap to buy so it's sad that there are now shortages of it. How much longer before the "shortages" bleed over into the pellet and bb markets as people look for cheaper alternatives to target shoot with.

Wouldn't be surprised if "people buy up because they assume that it's cheap/plentiful because it's always been that way and then wonder why it becomes less so." Not accusing any of you, of course. The reasons that HDS mentioned also make sense, although the recommended number I've read is 1000 rounds for .22 LR.

Oh, and re: the 5.45x39 AR upper: S&W M&P15R, complete or as the upper with 16-inch barrel (1:8 twist). I have no idea whether the SCAR or ACR will ever accomodate 7.62x39 (as the SCAR was supposed to at one point) or 5.45x39.

[loomer]

One thousand rounds seem a bit low for a proper survivalist enclave. Is that per person? Ragnar says 2,500 of the primary firearm's ammunition and 1,000 for the sidearm a person.

[His Divine Shadow]

For 175 euros you can get 2500 rounds of ammo here, not counting in bulk discount.

[[R_H]]

For 175 euros you can get 2500 rounds of ammo here, not counting in bulk discount.

2500 rounds of .22LR, or what caliber?

[His Divine Shadow]

Sorry yeah I meant .22lr, prices have gone up steeply lately. Everything gunwise is costing more nowadays, things are getting worse on all fronts really.

[[R_H]]

The price is similar here (a bit less though). Magazines are especially expensive though. When I get around to buying a rifle, it'll definitely be something that isn't mag-fed.

[His Divine Shadow]

You haven't considered your service rifle? A swiss guy I know says you get to keep it for the equivalent of 100 euros or so after you're done, if you want to. The 100 euros is just to get a gunsmith to remove the auto function.

I'd love a Sig 550 for 100 euros.

[[R_H]]

You haven't considered your service rifle? A swiss guy I know says you get to keep it for the equivalent of 100 euros or so after you're done, if you want to. The 100 euros is just to get a gunsmith to remove the auto function.

I'd love a Sig 550 for 100 euros.

I haven't done my military service yet (haven't even started it yet). It's only about 70 euros to buy it after you're done, but yeah you're right. There's still the problem of magazines, they're about 40 euros each. AR-15 magazines are around 25 euros a piece. Accessories are expensive (probably the same in Finland).

In the near future, I can only imagine owning a Tula 22LR (cheapest rifle with diopter sights) and a surplus K31.

[TheFeniX]

4 years ago I could get Winchester white box 9mm for $4.86 a box. Trying to dig up some ammo to go shooting the other week, the rifle range had aluminum for $23.95 a box. "Luckily," Academy had aluminum as well for about $13 a box. I'm just glad I don't shoot competitively anymore. I really couldn't afford it.

.223s for my girlfriends Ruger Mini-14 aren't hard to find and the prices aren't terrible like 9mm (comparatively). I couldn't find a box of range brass for .45 to save my life.

[Sephirius]

Man, I'm so glad my friend stocked up on 7.62x39 for his SKS.
10 000 rounds for like 850 bucks, a few years ago.

I'm SOL on .303 though.

[Azazal]

Man, I'm so glad my friend stocked up on 7.62x39 for his SKS.
10 000 rounds for like 850 bucks, a few years ago.

I'm SOL on .303 though.

See that's the kind of thing that causes the problem. Really now, how many average civilians need 10,000 rounds at one time. If you compete in shooting contests I could see it, but for the vast majority of people, you're grand kids are going to wind up throwing out all that ammo when they clean out the basement because grandpa had to move to a retirement home.

[His Divine Shadow]

That's not the sort of thing that causes problems in regular circumstances though, because most people don't think ahead and understand things like "bulk discounts" or have the discipline to save up for it. Now when EVERYONE starts hoarding ammo at once, then you get supply issues like now, but under regular circumstances it's not a problem. And I can eaily see 1000-2000 rounds per year going just from some weekly shooting, nevermind competing in 3-gun or IPSC or such.

[loomer]

Someone buying in bulk is actually a relief on the strained supply at this point, because that person now has ten thousand rounds, and are far less likely to buy more now that the prices are high, meaning what little is still available can potentially have a higher chance of going to someone who has a use for it instead of some conspiracy nut.

If you buy before the crunch begins (and not like a month before), then the munitions plants will easily replace what you bought within a week or two. It's bulk-buys and hoarding now, when they're overstressed to match supply and don't have much incentive (seeing as they're making great profits) that are the problem.

[Glocksman]

That's not the sort of thing that causes problems in regular circumstances though, because most people don't think ahead and understand things like "bulk discounts" or have the discipline to save up for it. Now when EVERYONE starts hoarding ammo at once, then you get supply issues like now, but under regular circumstances it's not a problem. And I can eaily see 1000-2000 rounds per year going just from some weekly shooting, nevermind competing in 3-gun or IPSC or such.

Believe me, when I saw 500 round cases of Barnaul 7.62x39mm going for $45 each a few years ago at gun shows, the advantage of bulk discounts immediately came to mind because local dealers were charging $4 for 20 round boxes of the same ammo.

My only regret is that I didn't buy 2000 rounds instead of 1000.

[Glocksman]

You haven't considered your service rifle? A swiss guy I know says you get to keep it for the equivalent of 100 euros or so after you're done, if you want to. The 100 euros is just to get a gunsmith to remove the auto function.

I'd love a Sig 550 for 100 euros.

I haven't done my military service yet (haven't even started it yet). It's only about 70 euros to buy it after you're done, but yeah you're right. There's still the problem of magazines, they're about 40 euros each. AR-15 magazines are around 25 euros a piece. Accessories are expensive (probably the same in Finland).

In the near future, I can only imagine owning a Tula 22LR (cheapest rifle with diopter sights) and a surplus K31.

Shit, I'd love to own a SIG 550 full auto for only 1000 euros.
That said, surplus K31 rifles used to go for $80 here in the US.
Though over the last year or so they've shot up to the $200 mark.

Is the surplus drying up, or is the increase because of the USD losing value?

Maybe I could ship over a bunch of milsurp US M16 magazines valued at US$15-20 each and you could send me a nice SIG rifle in a box labeled 'agricultural implements'.

[His Divine Shadow]

Serious violation of new export regs (like 10 years if you get caught), any magazine over 10+ is not allowed to be exported anymore. Nor are firearms with 5.56 NATO or 7.62 NATO chamberings exportable anymore even with export papers, .223 and .308 are allowed though. Nor can you export flash hiders (nevermind these are the simplest things on earth to make) or firearms with a threaded barrel (nevermind any gunsmith on earth can do that). Infact if you export an AR the lower cannot even say 5.56 on it.

All because osama bin laden blahblahblah.

[[R_H]]

Shit, I'd love to own a SIG 550 full auto for only 1000 euros.
That said, surplus K31 rifles used to go for $80 here in the US.
Though over the last year or so they've shot up to the $200 mark.

Is the surplus drying up, or is the increase because of the USD losing value?

Maybe I could ship over a bunch of milsurp US M16 magazines valued at US$15-20 each and you could send me a nice SIG rifle in a box labeled 'agricultural implements'.

I honestly have no idea. Maybe less of them are being released onto the surplus market. Part of it is probably demand too, they're really accurate for surplus rifles and because of that their popularity has increased.

One problem here though is that the Post no longer ships firearms accessories, which is a problem for spare parts. Dunno if this affects the sale of the actual rifles. Then again, I doubt the packages get checked, so there's always "machined parts" or some quasi-truthful label.

Are there any Stgw57s (the Stgw90/SIG-550's predecesor) for sale in the US? Maybe they're next in line to be sold overseas, once the K31s are gone.

I was actually thinking of buying a bunch of surplus 550s when my service is over, but I have no idea if it's possible to buy more than one.

[Sephirius]

Shit, I'd love to own a SIG 550 full auto for only 1000 euros.
That said, surplus K31 rifles used to go for $80 here in the US.
Though over the last year or so they've shot up to the $200 mark.

Is the surplus drying up, or is the increase because of the USD losing value?

Maybe I could ship over a bunch of milsurp US M16 magazines valued at US$15-20 each and you could send me a nice SIG rifle in a box labeled 'agricultural implements'.

I honestly have no idea. Maybe less of them are being released onto the surplus market. Part of it is probably demand too, they're really accurate for surplus rifles and because of that their popularity has increased.

One problem here though is that the Post no longer ships firearms accessories, which is a problem for spare parts. Dunno if this affects the sale of the actual rifles. Then again, I doubt the packages get checked, so there's always "machined parts" or some quasi-truthful label.

Are there any Stgw57s (the Stgw90/SIG-550's predecesor) for sale in the US? Maybe they're next in line to be sold overseas, once the K31s are gone.

I was actually thinking of buying a bunch of surplus 550s when my service is over, but I have no idea if it's possible to buy more than one.

No, it's actually cause people have caught on to how awesome the Schmidt-Rubin IS, and are willing to pay higher prices to get ahold of one.

Also because all of them that have ben sold over here are usually in ludicrously good condition as well.