David Horowitz vs. Christian Conservatives

[Alex Moon]

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Re ... sp?ID=8037

In a previous column ("Pride Before A Fall"), I took several Christian conservative leaders to task for protesting RNC Chairman Marc Racicot’s appearance at a meeting of the Human Rights Campaign, which is the largest group of gay citizens. The Christian leaders complained about the very fact that Racicot, who is the head of one of America’s two largest political parties had even met with the group. In explaining their position, one of the conservatives invoked the Ku Klux Klan – a notorious hate group -- as an organization whom Racicot wouldn’t think of addressing; another implied that Christian conservatives might withhold their votes in the next presidential election, while a third demanded that the RNC chairman declare homosexuality "immoral" (a fact I failed to mention in my article). I called this behavior "intolerant," and politically self-destructive.

Comments anyone?

[Darth Wong]

He's one of those people I like to call "half-enlightened". He knows the "tolerance" mantra, but you can tell his only disagreement with the Christian Right is over their tactics, not their attitude.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Christian conservatives and Torah-believing Jews oppose homosexual activism for three basic reasons: 1) The Bible and God’s natural design say it is wrong; 2) homosexuality is extremely unhealthy and hurts individuals, families and communities; and 3) homosexual activism threatens our most cherished freedoms of religion, speech and association.

Our agenda on this issue is to dissuade people from becoming trapped in homosexuality and to offer a helping hand to those who seek to change and pursue a fuller life.

I don't know how anyone could respond to this without puking in revulsion, but Horowitz just says:

As I have said, as a conservative I have no political objection to those Christians and Jews who oppose homosexuality because they are following what they believe to be their religious faith. Nor do I have objection to conservative political activists who oppose the leftwing agendas of "gay rights" groups that are destructive, anymore than I would have objection to opposing women’s rights groups that are mere covers for leftwing agendas, or black "civil rights" groups whose agendas are racially divisive. In fact, I have been a prominent leader of the opposition to all these groups.

[Xenophobe3691]

Christian conservatives and Torah-believing Jews oppose homosexual activism for three basic reasons: 1) The Bible and God’s natural design say it is wrong; 2) homosexuality is extremely unhealthy and hurts individuals, families and communities; and 3) homosexual activism threatens our most cherished freedoms of religion, speech and association.

Interestingly enough, I very recently spent a few weeks getting pretty damned close to some Orthodox Jewish teens my age, and nowhere did they spout this kind of bullshit, especially that last one.

[Alex Moon]

He's one of those people I like to call "half-enlightened". He knows the "tolerance" mantra, but you can tell his only disagreement with the Christian Right is over their tactics, not their attitude.

The fact is that I have publicly defended Christians’ rights to their moral views, specifically on their views on homosexuality (although I do not share them).

In my view, Knight’s statement is a prejudice dressed up as a moral position....
That is my personal view, but it is irrelevant to the issue at hand. Even if Knight were correct in thinking that homosexuality is a moral choice, and that Christians and Jews have a moral obligation to oppose it, this would not alter the fact that it is inappropriate and self-defeating for philosophical conservatives to make this their political agenda.

[emphasis mine]

I sounds like he does disagree with them.

[Sriad]

Christian conservatives and Torah-believing Jews oppose homosexual activism for three basic reasons: 1) The Bible and God’s natural design say it is wrong; 2) homosexuality is extremely unhealthy and hurts individuals, families and communities; and 3) homosexual activism threatens our most cherished freedoms of religion, speech and association.

Interestingly enough, I very recently spent a few weeks getting pretty damned close to some Orthodox Jewish teens my age, and nowhere did they spout this kind of bullshit, especially that last one.

Well, I suppose that in the sense that legislation passed against them would destroy the civil rights of "normal people" I guess they do.

As to the article itself, it looks like infighting between people I would respectfully but forcefully disagree with and other people who wouldn't think their way out of a wet paper bag if you spotted them an exacto knife and a map. Note that I say "wouldn't." They could if they tried, but they're just too fucking obtuse to do so.

[h0rus]

"and that I have written the harshest critiques of the gay left’s promotion of organized promiscuity and subversion of the public health system, as the root cause of the AIDS epidemic, which I have called a "radical holocaust" (not a "gay holocaust," but a radical holocaust – the distinction as I will explain is crucial)."

LOL. Organized Promiscuity.

"I share its concerns about the left’s assault on American values and on the American family in particular."

Yeah because those values have to do with pointing your nose down at others who don't abide to your biblical notions. Why couldn't you fucking have your god damn nuclear family while letting people mind their fucking business?

"Through moral persuasion they have succeeded in dramatically reducing the number of abortions, helped to strengthen the American family, and been on the frontlines opposing the left’s malicious assault on America’s culture and institutions."

'assault'. Who is this? Ann Coulter?

""With all due respect, Mr. Horowitz owes Christians an apology for his crude distortion of Jesus’ teachings, and for his implied charge of bigotry.""

Heh. hatred of others for their sexual preferences is certainly bigotry.

"The fact is that I have publicly defended Christians’ rights to their moral views, specifically on their views on homosexuality (although I do not share them). I have publicly condemned spokesmen for the gay left for their attacks on Christians who voice their views. I have criticized these gay leaders as "anti-Christian" and "intolerant.""

Like Calling somebody an anti-American, or a terrorist supporter?

"The essence of tolerance in a political democracy is that individuals who hate, despise and condemn each other privately should live side by side in the same political community in relative tranquility and civility. Respect for difference is not the same as endorsing the different."

Big words. Let's see you own up to them.

"The Christian right was born as a reaction to the government assault by secular liberals on religious communities in the 1970s. We do not want government intruding on the voluntary associations we make as citizens or dictating to us our moral and spiritual choices."

Anyone care to comment on this quote?

"As I have said, as a conservative I have no political objection to those Christians and Jews who oppose homosexuality because they are following what they believe to be their religious faith."

Moral relativity is such a wonderful thing.

It's too bad homosexuality has nothing to do with morality. I wonder if any of these shitheads ever stop and think "How would I feel if people discriminated against me because of something I was?". Maybe these people need to learn the skill of seeing yourself in another persons position. I wish these religious types would mind their fucking business and stick to propping themselves to their ilk and not the rest of society.