Egyptians protesting across the country

[Samuel]

The problem goes back to the difficulties of making sausage. People like to eat them, but not many want to know how they are made. The Western voting public likes to avoid being blown up in subways or being otherwise inconvenienced. That means they have to be protected from certain hard men.

To avoid the political risks inherent in interrogating terrorist suspects, much of the work was outsourced to foreign intelligence agencies, of which Egypt’s was one.

Translation- the US doesn't torture people into insanity. We do however send prisoners to places who do and we don't want people to learn about it. I for one will be glad when their "interrogation program" is reveal for the farce it is- a method of cracking down on people who oppose the regime.

[Broomstick]

Got mad at the US TV media today for two things:

Describing the citizens who are self-organizing for protection as "vigilantes". No, they are not. They are people abandoned by their government/police who have no other protection than they own teamwork. They aren't running through the streets hanging people or whatever, they're protecting their homes and businesses. I think some of it is from them stopping foreign journalists, but why the hell should they trust either foreigners or journalists right now? Last I heard none of the news people have been harmed, just stopped and asked what business they have in those neighborhoods.

And today some talking head was trying to back Hillary Clinton into a corner and make her either state the US is supporting the uprising, or supporting Mubarak. Hillary actually showed some spine and made it very clear the US (at least officially - what is thought in private may or may not be the same) supports the Egyptians dealing with this and is not taking sides.

Of course the US has an interest in one side or the other. So do a lot of other countries. But they shouldn't be talking about that right now. Coming down on one side or another will help no one and could make things worse. It's already dicey for the US as they've backed Mubarak for so long. The reporters were showing empty tear-gas shells picked up by the crowds, and they clearly said "made in USA" on them. Sure, the US makes and sells that sort of thing all over the world, this isn't news, but it's understandable that Egyptians who are having to deal with the contents of those canisters aren't feeling too good about the US right now. Best thing right now is for the US to STFU and, when the dust settles, try to establish good relations with whomever is left standing.

[Prannon]

I think some of it is from them stopping foreign journalists, but why the hell should they trust either foreigners or journalists right now? Last I heard none of the news people have been harmed, just stopped and asked what business they have in those neighborhoods.

Small nitpick, but...

When my dad was walking to the pharmacy, one very religious person with a big beard actually told him "Everything is OK! Your safety before our safety!" Dad kissed him on both cheeks and he gave him a big hug.

Egyptian anger isn't really directed to foreigners right now. At least, not the familiar faces they know. It's more directed at Mubarak, the police, the regime, and the oppression. What my dad described to me over the phone wouldn't have happened if the anger was directed, even in small part, at foreigners.

And yeah, that pretty much is what the neighborhood watches are doing. They're stopping everyone and anyone who is out and about, making sure that they're not looting and telling them to get lost if they don't have business in the neighborhood. If some journos are butthurt over that, then it's just a bunch of hurf blurf.

[Edward Yee]

Which in turn is the problem with letting anyone else do one's dirty work... which, oddly enough, the same blogpost actually mentioned.

Describing the citizens who are self-organizing for protection as "vigilantes". No, they are not. They are people abandoned by their government/police who have no other protection than they own teamwork. They aren't running through the streets hanging people or whatever, they're protecting their homes and businesses.

I think it's just a case of the definition of 'vigilante' changing over time... your definition actually reminds me of "vigilance committees."

I'm gonna agree with Prannon, apparently not even Israel is a major topic on the Egyptian consciousness right now, and I wouldn't be surprised if the protesters' opinions of foreign countries mainly revolve around said countries' take on Mubarak.

And today some talking head was trying to back Hillary Clinton into a corner and make her either state the US is supporting the uprising, or supporting Mubarak. Hillary actually showed some spine and made it very clear the US (at least officially - what is thought in private may or may not be the same) supports the Egyptians dealing with this and is not taking sides.

Yeah... this is one of those cases of "so you want us to stay out of it... well, only if you really mean it."

There is something darkly ironic (not in a funny way) about Pakistani Islamists appropriating Egypt/Tunisia to protest against reform of the blasphemy laws, as I heard several minutes on Al Jazeera English's live stream... (Incidentally, now AJE seems to view the flybys as being attempted coercion by Mubarak instead of "just" a military show-of-force.)

EDIT: Most recent AJE live stream report right now is of the military setting up barricades and road blocks now...
EDIT 2: Yes, the USG probably doesn't want revolutionary change and probably wants familiar, friendly faces to remain (as the AJE host and guest are discussing) even if Mubarak is to be written off... but is it me, or would the people be satisfied with Mubarak's departure? Also, apparently the barricades/road blocks are around Tahrir Square.

[Raj Ahten]

Interesting Article about the emerging leadership of the revolution
From the New York Times

Protest’s Old Guard Falls In Behind the Young
By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK and MONA EL-NAGGAR

CAIRO — Last Thursday, a small group of Internet-savvy young political organizers gathered in the Cairo home of an associate of Mohamed ElBaradei, the diplomat and Nobel laureate.

They had come to plot a day of street protests calling for the ouster of President Hosni Mubarak, but within days, their informal clique would become the effective leaders of a decades-old opposition movement previously dominated by figures more than twice their age.

“Most of us are under 30,” said Amr Ezz, a 27-year-old lawyer who was one of the group as part of the April 6 Youth Movement, which organized an earlier day of protests last week via Facebook. They were surprised and delighted to see that more than 90,000 people signed up online to participate, emboldening others to turn out and bringing tens of thousands of mostly young people into the streets.

Surprised by the turnout, older opposition leaders from across the spectrum — including the outlawed Muslim Brotherhood; the liberal protest group the Egyptian Movement for Change, known by its slogan, “Enough”; and the umbrella group organized by Dr. ElBaradei — joined in, vowing to turn out their supporters for another day of protest on Friday. But the same handful of young online organizers were still calling the shots.

They decided to follow a blueprint similar to their previous protest, urging demonstrators to converge on the central Liberation Square. So they drew up a list of selected mosques around Cairo where they asked people to gather at Friday Prayer before marching together toward the square. Then they distributed the list through e-mail and text messages, which spread virally. They even told Dr. ElBaradei which mosque he should attend, people involved said.

“What we were hoping for is to have the same turnout as the 25th, so we wouldn’t lose the numbers we had already managed to mobilize,” Mr. Ezz said.

Instead, more than 100,000 people poured into the streets of the capital, pushing back for hours against battalions of riot police, until the police all but abandoned the city. The demonstrations were echoed across the country.

The huge uprising has stirred speculation about whether Egypt’s previously fractious opposition could unite to capitalize on the new momentum, and about just who would lead the nascent political movement.

The major parties and players in the Egyptian opposition met throughout the day Sunday to address those questions. They ultimately selected a committee led by Dr. ElBaradei to negotiate directly with the Egyptian military. And they settled on a strategy that some in the movement are calling “hug a soldier” to try to win the army’s rank and file over to their side. But both newcomers and veterans of the opposition movement say it is the young Internet pioneers who remain at the vanguard behind the scenes.

“The young people are still leading this,” said Ibrahim Issa, a prominent opposition intellectual who attended some of the meetings. And the older figures, most notably Dr. ElBaradei, have so far readily accepted the younger generation’s lead, people involved said. “He has been very responsive,” Mr. Issa said. “He is very keen on being the symbol, and not being a leader.”

After signs that President Mubarak’s government might be toppling, leaders of Egypt’s opposition — old and new — met Sunday to prepare for the next steps. The first meeting was a gathering of the so-called shadow parliament, formed by older critics of the government after blatantly rigged parliamentary elections last fall. Those elections eliminated almost every one of the small minority of seats held by critics of Mr. Mubarak, including 88 occupied by Muslim Brotherhood members.

Among those present were many representatives of the Brotherhood, the former presidential candidate Ayman Nour and representatives of Dr. ElBaradei’s umbrella group, the National Association for Change, which has been working for nearly a year to unite the opposition around demands for free elections. At the end of the meeting, they had settled on a consensus list of 10 people they would delegate to manage a potential unity government if Mr. Mubarak resigned. And though the religiously conservative Brotherhood was the biggest force in the shadow parliament, the group nonetheless put Dr. ElBaradei at the top of its list. Officials of the Brotherhood said he would present an unthreatening face to the West.

A second meeting, at the headquarters of the Wafd Party, brought together four of the tiny but legally recognized opposition parties. Critics of Egypt’s authoritarian government often accuse the recognized parties of collaborating with Mr. Mubarak in sham elections that create a facade of democracy. In this case, people involved in the deliberations said, the parties could not agree on how hard to break with the president. One party, the Democratic Front, insisted they demand that Mr. Mubarak resign immediately, like protesters were doing in the streets. The other three wanted a less confrontational statement, people briefed on the outcome said.

The third meeting took place late in the afternoon outdoors, in Liberation Square, the center of the protests for the last several days, said Mr. Issa, who participated. It was brought together mainly by the younger members, organized as the April 6 Youth Movement, after the date a textile workers’ strike was crushed three years ago, and We Are All Khalid Said, after the name of a man whose death in a brutal police beating was captured in a photograph circulated over the Internet. But the meeting also brought together about 25 older figures, including opposition intellectuals like Mr. Issa. Also present were representatives of Dr. ElBaradei’s National Association for Change, which includes officials of the Muslim Brotherhood.

Mr. Issa and people briefed on that meeting said the older figures offered to help the young organizers who had started it all. Those organizers, Mr. Ezz and Mr. Issa said, knew that that the uprising had now acquired a life of its own beyond their direction, spread and coordinated by television coverage instead of the Internet. And they knew that the movement needed more seasoned leaders if Mr. Mubarak resigned, Mr. Ezz said. “Leadership has to come out of the people who are already out there, because most of us are under 30,” he said. “But now they recognize that we’re in the street, and they are taking us seriously.”

The group’s goal now, Mr. Ezz said, was to guide the protesters’ demands, chief among them the resignation of Mr. Mubarak, formation of an interim government, and amendments to the Constitution to allow for free elections. The group settled more firmly on Dr. ElBaradei, consulting with a group of other opposition figures, to speak for the movement, Mr. Issa said. Specifically, he said, the group expected Dr. ElBaradei to represent the protesters to the United States, a crucial Egyptian ally and benefactor, and in negotiations with the army, which the group expected to play the pivotal role in the coming days and weeks.

Mr. Ezz said the group also discussed future tactics, including strikes, civil disobedience and a vigil for dead protesters, as well as music performances and speakers in Liberation Square.

Others briefed on the meeting said that the group had also decided to encourage protesters to adopt the “hug a soldier” strategy. With signs that the military appeared divided between support for the president and the protesters, these people said, the group decided to encourage demonstrators to emphasize their faith and trust in the soldiers.

“We are dealing with the army in a peaceful manner until it proves otherwise, and we still have faith in the army,” Mr. Ezz said. “Until now, they are neutral, and at least if we can’t bring them to our side, we don’t want to lose them.”

Then, Mr. Issa said, it was the young organizers who directed Dr. ElBaradei to appear Sunday afternoon, after the curfew, in Liberation Square, to speak for the first time as the face of their movement.

The old guard are now contributing but it remains a popular movement. Honestly its sounding like they are getting better organized by the minute and doing it all with face to face meetings to boot. We'll see if they are able to keep up the pressure and all importantly see what the army does.

[Big Orange]

I'm gonna agree with Prannon, apparently not even Israel is a major topic on the Egyptian consciousness right now, and I wouldn't be surprised if the protesters' opinions of foreign countries mainly revolve around said countries' take on Mubarak.

99% of the time the bile of the Egyptian mob is directed at Mubarak and his band of thugs 'n thieves, but there have been anti-Jewish sentiments demonstrated by some of the, um, demonstrators when Stars of David have been daubed on the sides of some of the riot/SWAT vans smashed and burned in the rioting...

[Edward Yee]

I don't see how that really differs from what I said... I don't think I implied that somehow the protesters were all hunky-dory or even neutral on Israeli relations.

In a weird way, I'm frustrated by the lack of more recent English-language updates after this afternoon US Eastern Time, although Ben Wedeman had these:

Hearing TE Data, main Egyptian internet service provider, will maintain internet interruption for at least another week.

Also claiming that unspecified "foreigners" have joined in the neighborhood watches, at least in Maadi.

[Prannon]

Also claiming that unspecified "foreigners" have joined in the neighborhood watches, at least in Maadi.

My parents live in Maadi. That's pretty much a center for foreign living and activity for the entire city. It doesn't surprise me at all if there were some foreigners of standing participating in the neighborhood watches around there or at least contributing in some way, whether it be food or materials. My dad told me that he lent his Egyptian friends my old metal baseball bat to help protect their stuff. It's kinda cool that something of mine made it into that role.

[His Divine Shadow]

My parents live in Hurghada about 3 months of the year when the greenhouses are shut down anyway. They should be coming home now though, not sure if they're gonna try and charter a plane on their own, something about Finland organizing a plane to bring people home in the newspaper, people who aren't there on a chartered vacation that is.

Another guy whos father lives in Alexandria says 5 people where shot outside his apartment, including his neighbor. Oh and now there's milita there and a tank.

Alteast Hurghada is pretty calm.

[Prannon]

On the phone with dad again:

We're doing very well. We're having a bit of a time here. It's a bit of an adventure. Everything's fine.

Our friends are having to leave because their company is a bit of a wuss. We're gonna watch after their properties.

We went to the grocery stores and they had plenty of food. They're still receiving supplies. Fresh vegetables and fruit are available.

Last night was the quietest night since they started curfews. We still see tanks and APCs every now and then. We were able to walk home safely without any difficulty. The Egyptians are telling us 'We love you, we want you here. Everything's fine.' The past two nights I've slept better than I have in a really long time.

Professionally, I'm worried about my desert guys. I'm concerned about getting supplies to my people in the desert.

We heard what might have been one gun battle today. APCs were running over to take a look, but otherwise it's another day in paradise. We're with friends, having a good time.

I cannot stress enough that the reporting agencies are overhyping this crisis. They're taking small incidents and applying them to the whole country. On the whole, the country is calm and things are working. Everyone evacuating is overreacting.

Not one Egyptian that I know has said that they want Mubarak to stay. Everyone wants him to go.

I went out to stand guard, and I had my walking stick and my big Paul Bunyan knife. I wanted to show solidarity with the watches. But the boab boys and the watches wouldn't let me stay past 15 minutes, and they shooed me back inside before long for my own safety. They would have felt bad if there had even been 1% chance of something bad happening to me. And that's about what chance it was.

So yeah, the guy who reported foreigners standing guard in Maadi was telling the truth. My father was among them, and my mother took pictures. I'm hoping that when they finally get their internet back, I'll be able to post some pictures for everyone here. My father has also been keeping a journal that I intend to post when I can.

Mother's saying that their Egyptian friends, who live in a more village-y part of Maadi, had a lot of rough characters roaming around last night and they saw someone get killed. It's devastated them to see that. But my mother is also telling me that she went to the store and a really old Egyptian man came up to her and told her that "You are welcome in Egypt."

[wautd]

In lighter news, Fox news misplaces Egypt.



With Iraq of all places.

[Broomstick]

Regarding the whole "foreigners" thing....

There are, after all, several types of foreigners in Egypt. There are people like Prannon's parents who are known to the locals and seen as part of the community, regarded as welcome neighbors and friends. Back to the days of the Pharaohs Egypt has been known to welcome and treat well those who come to Egypt as friends, who live among them, and whose presence is seen as beneficial. It is part of what made (and still makes) Egypt a major crossroads of mankind.

Then there are potentially people who come in from outside to cause trouble, whether they're hired thugs or opportunistic criminals or whatever. These people aren't welcome anywhere, to be honest. The problem isn't that they're foreign, it's that they're bullies and trouble-makers.

Then there are the journalists Journalists are vultures. They want to see blood, death and destruction for the most part because reporting on that is what pays their bills. They may not be causing trouble but they are certainly looking for it. I can see where the same neighborhood folks protecting Prannon's parents could be either cold or somewhat hostile towards reporters. After all, those are the same people talking about those very same groups of citizens organizing to protect themselves in a negative light. That doesn't mean they're outright mean to the journalists, but the journalists could well be picking up on a somewhat cold to hostile body language even when these folks are speaking very politely to them. On top of that, journalists like to think themselves a privileged class. They aren't, really. And they aren't always welcome.

But does the media distinguish between these groups? Of course not... it couldn't be regurgitated in 20 second sound bites and might require actual thought.

[Siege]

Then there are the journalists Journalists are vultures. They want to see blood, death and destruction for the most part because reporting on that is what pays their bills.

That may be what American journalists are paid for - I wouldn't be entirely surprised if it is considering what passes for 'journalism' in the USA - but the news over here has been vastly more neutral and more or less free from bias. In fact barring reporting of the occasional shooting or riot most of what I've seen in newspapers and on TV matches Prannon's descriptions. That your homegrown reporters are a blight on the international press corps is truly unfortunate but I'll thank you for not painting the whole of the profession with one broad brush.

[LaCroix]

In lighter news, Fox news misplaces Egypt.
*snip*
With Iraq of all places.

Why don't they simply use the map as it was delivered? I can't imagine they have a fancy map, borderlines and all, and the Names of the states are missing... It's as if they do this kind of stunt deliberately...

[Zed]

Then there are the journalists Journalists are vultures. They want to see blood, death and destruction for the most part because reporting on that is what pays their bills. They may not be causing trouble but they are certainly looking for it. I can see where the same neighborhood folks protecting Prannon's parents could be either cold or somewhat hostile towards reporters. After all, those are the same people talking about those very same groups of citizens organizing to protect themselves in a negative light. That doesn't mean they're outright mean to the journalists, but the journalists could well be picking up on a somewhat cold to hostile body language even when these folks are speaking very politely to them. On top of that, journalists like to think themselves a privileged class. They aren't, really. And they aren't always welcome.

A Belgian state television journalist walked along in the protests. He seemed to be protected by the people around him. He was fair to the protesters, and they were friendly to him. I think you have a skewed view of journalists.

[Ziggy Stardust]

A Belgian state television journalist walked along in the protests. He seemed to be protected by the people around him. He was fair to the protesters, and they were friendly to him. I think you have a skewed view of journalists.

As someone who has worked with journalists from several countries, let me just say that Broomstick is right. It is not just an American phenomenon (although you can certainly argue it is WORSE with American journalists, just not EXCLUSIVE). Many journalists really do have an intense sense of entitlement and can be very rude and pushy with people in tense situations. It isn't entirely their fault, it is the culture of the newsroom. They work under tight deadlines, messing up often means getting fired or reassigned to "fluff" stories, and editors put a lot of pressure on reporters to get the truth, which results in many having a complex where they think they are ALWAYS getting lied to and need to badger/pester you to get the REAL story. In addition, many journalists are simply not that bright, and inadvertently antagonize locals based on misunderstandings of local customs. The most annoying journalist I've ever met was French, who remarked that he was disappointed the soil in Madagascar wasn't red enough (in case you don't know, the soil there is really fucking red, and the deepness of the color is an indicator of environmental destruction; so this journalist was disappointed that the soil in a rural African village wasn't infertile ENOUGH).

[Siege]

Whenever in the course of discussion after a wrongful shooting someone states that all cops are trigger-happy assholes, that person is rightfully told to shut the hell up 'cause painting all of law enforcement as such because of the actions of a handful of bad apples is idiotic to say the least. The same happens when it's "all Americans are right-wing nutjobs" and other such quaint stereotypes. And yet when journalists are branded as universally immoral know-nothings with attitude problems a whole bunch of people will just sagely nod their heads as if it's bloody Gospel.

The character assassination would be hilarious if it wasn't so pathetic.

I am a journalist; I've worked with dozens of colleagues over the years, and I regularly talk to journalists in countries all over the world. They are almost without exception highly motivated professionals dedicated to their work who - especially in case of foreign correspondents - frequently have to do their jobs under extremely difficult conditions: working with limited or nonexistent support, cut off from the rest of the world, left to find out what the hell is going on in a country whose language and culture isn't their own based on whatever information they can get their hands on, who often over the course of an interview have to overcome a few decades of mistrust and misunderstanding in order to get the story in time for the eight 'o clock news.

Are there assholes and amateurs among the press corps? Sure there are, just like there's dickwads and incompetents to be found in any profession. But people who make insane blanket statements like "journalists are vultures" to me are goddamn retards who don't know what the fuck they're talking about, and no fucking better than the people who claim all cops are killers.

[Broomstick]

Then why, if these hardworking professionals are so good, are they so often wrong? And I'm not talking about just American journalists. I follow the news in both English and French, and make it a point to look/listen to sources beyond the US. While I'm not an expert in everything in the areas I am journalists of ANY nation all too frequently get the facts wrong. Which is probably not a wonder, if they're working where they don't know the language or customs and the locals don't trust them. What I don't understand is how they can get things so fucking wrong when in their own countries reporting on things.

Are there some good journalists out there? Oh sure - but far too many are jackasses and yes, they DO give the entire profession a bad name. Just like I have to suck it up when someone points out what jackass nutjobs so many of my countrymen are, or gives me shit because those same asshats just elected insane people into public office, YOU might have to just deal with the fact your profession is not seen in a good light a lot of the time.

And yeah, real classy - your profession gets criticized and your kneejerk reaction is "America sucks". That makes you look good, uh-huh.

[Dave]

Now, I know you should never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by stupidity, but major US news organizations (including Fox News) have been covering that side of the world in detail for at least the last 8 years, to say nothing of all the other times Iraq got in the news before then. So I really can't believe stupidity at this rate.

So, in that image, why on Earth would they deliberately misplace Egypt in Iraq?

EDIT: http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/200907270040 lists this image as occurring July 27, 2009. Hmm.

[Broomstick]

Seriously. Stupidity. Faux News doesn't fact check and accuracy isn't as important to them as scoops and ratings. They've even been caught showing deliberately false information about people.

Which is why I avoid Faux News.

There are other US news sources that are better, but they aren't as well known abroad because they aren't as flamboyant. The bad boys get the most publicity.

But, really, at a base level news agencies the world over aren't sending people to Egypt in anticipation of people all joining hands, singing "Kum By Ya", and passing out daises. They're sending people to Egypt in anticipation of violence, either on the part of the people or on the part of the government. It's like vultures waiting for road kill to happen.

[Siege]

Then why, if these hardworking professionals are so good, are they so often wrong? And I'm not talking about just American journalists. I follow the news in both English and French, and make it a point to look/listen to sources beyond the US.

Well good for you! What do you want, a cookie? And more importantly, what the hell kind of news are you following where they get things wrong "so often", and why on Earth are you following that news if they do? Because the news I'm following sure doesn't get things wrong all that frequently.

Just like I have to suck it up when someone points out what jackass nutjobs so many of my countrymen are, or gives me shit because those same asshats just elected insane people into public office, YOU might have to just deal with the fact your profession is not seen in a good light a lot of the time.

I don't give a flying fuck if my profession "is not seen in a good light" by the likes of you. What I do care about is idiots - such as yourself - painting all the world's journalists as "vultures", as people who "want to see blood, death and destruction" or who "think themselves a privileged class". Real stand-up stuff, that.

And yeah, real classy - your profession gets criticized and your kneejerk reaction is "America sucks". That makes you look good, uh-huh.

Oh, the best defense is to attack, right? How's about you quote me saying that, dear? Or else, you know, fuck off?

[Broomstick]

Then why, if these hardworking professionals are so good, are they so often wrong? And I'm not talking about just American journalists. I follow the news in both English and French, and make it a point to look/listen to sources beyond the US.

Well good for you! What do you want, a cookie? And more importantly, what the hell kind of news are you following where they get things wrong "so often", and why on Earth are you following that news if they do?

Well, for starters, anything to do with aviation.

I don't give a flying fuck if my profession "is not seen in a good light" by the likes of you. What I do care about is idiots - such as yourself - painting all the world's journalists as "vultures", as people who "want to see blood, death and destruction" or who "think themselves a privileged class". Real stand-up stuff, that.

Clearly you DO care, otherwise you wouldn't be responding with such emotion.

And yeah, real classy - your profession gets criticized and your kneejerk reaction is "America sucks". That makes you look good, uh-huh.

Oh, the best defense is to attack, right? How's about you quote me saying that, dear? Or else, you know, fuck off?

Yes, that is my point - your response to criticism was to go on the attack.

[FSTargetDrone]

A point about reporters, I think it was an NBC or CNN corespondent on the scene who was speaking to the camera when some people came up behind him carrying an injured man who'd been gassed (I believe). The injured man stumbled, reached out and grasped the reporter's arm (who turned toward him) as he fell. The reporter stopped speaking to the camera and helped the man's companions lower him safely to the ground.

[FSTargetDrone]

The reporters were showing empty tear-gas shells picked up by the crowds, and they clearly said "made in USA" on them. Sure, the US makes and sells that sort of thing all over the world, this isn't news, but it's understandable that Egyptians who are having to deal with the contents of those canisters aren't feeling too good about the US right now. Best thing right now is for the US to STFU and, when the dust settles, try to establish good relations with whomever is left standing.

And some of those armored vehicles the army has been using are from the US. Saw lots of M113s on the news, some of which have civilians piled on top, going for a ride.

Incidentally, those tear-gas canisters come from the the good old Keystone State:

What's in all that tear gas we've been selling Egypt?

By Nate Anderson | Last updated January 28, 2011 5:39 PM

If you've been watching any coverage of the Egyptian protests, you've no doubt seen the tear gas plumes as canisters are shot at protestors—often to be picked up and hurled back moments later. Many of those tear gas containers falling on the bridges and streets of Cairo aren't local products, however; they come from Jamestown, Pennsylvania, home of Combined Tactical Systems.

Several reporters in Egypt have commented on that fact this week. ABC News ran a story on the gas today in which it quotes a protestor saying, "The way I see it, the US administration supports dictators."

It's no secret that Egypt is one of the largest recipients of US foreign military funding, much of which is designated to purchase US-made weapons; it's just that Americans don't often see Egyptians holding empty tear gas canisters stamped "Made in USA" up to a TV camera.

But what's in those canisters?



The US government requires most chemical compounds to have a Material Safety Data Sheet (MSDS) outlining the ingredients, the risks of contacting those ingredients, and cleanup procedures in case of an accident. Combined Tactical Systems helpfully makes puts these MSDS files on its website.

The tear gas grenades and canisters are largely filled with a fuel mixture that burns to disperse the tearing agent. The Model 5220 CN Smoke grenade (PDF), for instance, has a small starter mixture of potassium nitrate, silicon, and charcoal. This in turn in used to light the "CN smoke"—a form of tear gas.

The CN smoke is 71 percent fuel, made up of potassium chlorate, magnesium carbonate, nitrocellulose, and… sucrose. The other 29 percent of the smoke is the tearing agent, chloroacetophenone, which has been around for nearly a century and causes severe irritation of the mucous membranes. (Combined Tactical Systems also sells the commonly used "CS smoke" tear gas version, which is powered by chlorobenzalmalononitrile.)



Both kinds of tear gas have a "pungent odor," according to the MSDS. Those handling them should wear a "full face respirator with organic filter cartridge" and should "wash thoroughly after handling."

That's because, as the protestor went on to tell ABC, "Your eyes tear up a lot so you can't see, and you feel like you're suffocating. You can actually breathe but you feel like you are suffocating so you try to run, but when you run you inhale more."

As the MSDS puts it, rather more clinically, the gases cause "tearing of eyes, irritation of respiratory tract and mucous membranes," and asthma may be "aggravated by exposure."

[Broomstick]

I'm sure the F-16's (or whatever they were) flying overheard were made in the USA, too