Ron Paul Supporters Cause County Convention Chaos

[SirNitram]

I urge all Americans though... there's one guy in Congress who has always had our back. One guy who has consistently been right, even when everyone told him he was wrong.

You're forgetting about Bernie Sanders. :v

Also, I've asked every Paulite why I shouldn't vote for the Greens instead of Washington Politician for Longer than I've Been Alive Paul, and it's basically boiled down to "RON GOOD! FIRE BAD!"

You can't argue with cultists and conspiracy theorists. Anything against their core belief is proof you are both supporting evil, and complicit in the GRAND COVER UP.

[SirNitram]

I urge all Americans though... there's one guy in Congress who has always had our back. One guy who has consistently been right, even when everyone told him he was wrong.

One guy who is he Klingon candidate.

From THE CANON OF THE SISKO

WORF
Kahless said, "Great men do not
seek power, they have power
thrust upon them."

Dennis J. Kucinich isn't running for president in 2012, but he is the best man for the job.... and it is our duty to America and to the world to thrust that power upon him.


Write in Dennis Kucinich. He represents us, not big business. He's the real peace candidate.

Are you honestly making an argument here?

[Aaron MkII]

Gotta give Adam a little leeway, he's recently had a political awakening but doesn't appear to have thought it all the way through yet.

That said, what do you do if everyone writes in Kunich but he tells you to go fuck yourself, he doesn't want the job?

[Aaron MkII]

Fair enough.

[SirNitram]

Are you honestly making an argument here?

Are you honestly trying to say something constructive here?

Kucinich is right on almost every issue that comes up.

Name a better potential candidate.

Someone not voting in line with the so-called 'pro-lifers'. SOmeone not acting in solidarity with Hugo Chavez, a boil on South America's ass. Someone who didn't give Dubya broad war powers. A full out ban on genetically modified crops(You know, things we could use to ward off disease, increase crop yields..), ending H1-B? Yea, let's all go for those things. Only not.

And someone who can at least run feasibly. He lost his primary back in March. President runs are expensive and require massive infrastructure. Kucinich does not have these things

But hey, if he wanted to run, if he wanted to try, he could have signed up, same as Randall Terry, Vermin Supreme, Jim Rogers.. At least two of them bothered to sign up, campaign, get some damn delegates assigned.

[SirNitram]

Do you even know who Dennis Kucinich is?

Yes. I confirmed all of these things via a little browsing.

Someone not voting in line with the so-called 'pro-lifers'.

http://www.ontheissues.org/2004/Dennis_ ... ortion.htm
Rated 100% by NARAL, indicating a pro-choice voting record.

So, you start with something 180 degrees away from reality. (Though, he did vote differently prior to 2003; turns out sometimes things can change even a politican's mind.)

Crazy idea: I might not trust his change.

SOmeone not acting in solidarity with Hugo Chavez, a boil on South America's ass.

What do you have against Venezuela's democracy and development?

You're hilarious. I don't like Chavez, so I'm against democracy? So you HATE democracy and representative republics, because you hate Obama. This is a farce.

Someone who didn't give Dubya broad war powers.

While he did make the mistake of voting for the AUMF (as did everyone except Barbara Lee in the House - I could probably get behind her too), Kucinich led the fight against war in Iraq (from day one), against the Patriot act (from day one), for de-funding the war in Afghanistan.

Defunding a war without a drawndown plan is not sensible. Not that you're going to admit it.

A full out ban on genetically modified crops(You know, things we could use to ward off disease, increase crop yields..)

First off, not true. He did propose a ban, but it was selective, meant to prevent cross-contamination of drug and food crops - not stop either, just change how it's done.

Secondly, ask Alyrium about Monsanto some day.

I'm aware of Monsanto's crimes, doofus. ALso, your statement here shows you didn't read any of his bills. I can get behind the Genetically Engineered Food Right To Know act, his Farmer Protection Act has an interesting thing where it'd effectively ban most bananas. Sterile genetically modified plant.

ending H1-B?

Do you know why he did that? The reason is that it makes conditions worse for workers, as it aims to solve a problem that doesn't actually exist, thus depressing wages and putting people at the mercy of their employers to stay in the country.

He sought to end it, not reform it. And I wouldn't call 'Skilled people wanting a better life' a non-existant problem.

And someone who can at least run feasibly. He lost his primary back in March. President runs are expensive and require massive infrastructure. Kucinich does not have these things

He's run twice before and had significant grassroots support for the primary campaign - more than his competitor.

And yet he decided to not run now.

Question: WHy did you snip the listing of the other Democratic candidates for POTUS?

This comes down to two things. The one thing is.. I, and probably quite a few others.. don't agree with you. The thing I called you out for, however, was your idiotic use of a Star Trek quip as some kind of measuring stick.

[Simon_Jester]

ALso, your statement here shows you didn't read any of his bills. I can get behind the Genetically Engineered Food Right To Know act, his Farmer Protection Act has an interesting thing where it'd effectively ban most bananas. Sterile genetically modified plant.

Prove it, liar. If you actually read it, why don't you have a quotation?

I figure you're probably talking about this:

SEC. 109. PROHIBITION ON CERTAIN NON-FERTILE PLANT SEEDS.
Notwithstanding any other provision of law, effective 45 days after the date of the enactment of this title, a person may not manufacture, distribute, sell, plant, or otherwise use any seed that is genetically engineered to produce a plant whose seeds are not fertile or are rendered infertile by the application of an external chemical inducer.

The goal here, of course, to break the back of companies like Monsanto (which is what the whole bill is about), who use various methods to force farmers to continue buying from them in perpetuity.

If it applies to bananas at all, it is a complete perversion or a simple accident. Unlike your dishonest claim, it isn't any GM plant that is infertile, but rather seeds that create infertile plants by design.

Hm. There's a problem there.

Suppose I sell you fertile GM wheat. The wheat goes to seed. Seeds spread, by evolutionary design. Some of those seeds end up blowing into your neighbor's wheat field.

Am I entitled to sue him for growing my GM wheat?

[MKSheppard]

The goal here, of course, to break the back of companies like Monsanto (which is what the whole bill is about), who use various methods to force farmers to continue buying from them in perpetuity.

Umm, how would you then handle GM crops which have better drought resistance, more resistance to insects, lessening use of pesticides or water making them more environmentally efficient; but we don't want them to spread widely on their own?

[SirNitram]

Yes. I confirmed all of these things via a little browsing.

Liar.

If you actually confirmed it, you wouldn't have made a claim that is 100% wrong, like you did on the abortion issue.

If you actually confirmed it, you might have even included some links. Perhaps even some links here, or some quotations, rather than merely repeating your assertions.

Crazy idea: I might not trust his change.

Crazy idea: you're a liar who didn't bother doing the research and got called on it.

He has a 100% record over several years. If you're not lying, you're dangerously irrational.

I don't like Chavez, so I'm against democracy?

No, you idiot, I'm asking what you have against him.

You'll notice that when I question the actions of King Obama... I question the actions of his administration, such as escalating wars, extrajudicial assassinations, erosion of civil liberties, prosecution of whistleblowers, and so on.

Defunding a war without a drawndown plan is not sensible. Not that you're going to admit it.

OK, so Congress shouldn't exercise their power of the purse until the President decides to draw up a plan.... that's not separation of powers. That's not fighting to end an unjust war.

ALso, your statement here shows you didn't read any of his bills. I can get behind the Genetically Engineered Food Right To Know act, his Farmer Protection Act has an interesting thing where it'd effectively ban most bananas. Sterile genetically modified plant.

Prove it, liar. If you actually read it, why don't you have a quotation?

I figure you're probably talking about this:

SEC. 109. PROHIBITION ON CERTAIN NON-FERTILE PLANT SEEDS.
Notwithstanding any other provision of law, effective 45 days after the date of the enactment of this title, a person may not manufacture, distribute, sell, plant, or otherwise use any seed that is genetically engineered to produce a plant whose seeds are not fertile or are rendered infertile by the application of an external chemical inducer.

The goal here, of course, to break the back of companies like Monsanto (which is what the whole bill is about), who use various methods to force farmers to continue buying from them in perpetuity.

If it applies to bananas at all, it is a complete perversion or a simple accident. Unlike your dishonest claim, it isn't any GM plant that is infertile, but rather seeds that create infertile plants by design.

He sought to end it, not reform it. And I wouldn't call 'Skilled people wanting a better life' a non-existant problem.

Wow, nice political spin. The companies who ask for it though don't cite "better life" as the reason, but rather worker shortages, which is not actually the case.

The main thrust behind Kucinich's opposition though is that it doesn't give a better life to skilled people. Instead, it does the opposite.

It puts the immigrant workers at the mercy of their employers to keep the visa and oversaturates the worker pool, which leads to a reduction of wages and benefits for those skilled people.

Dennis Kucinich is against the exploitation of workers, here and abroad.

Question: WHy did you snip the listing of the other Democratic candidates for POTUS?

I don't know any of them. Unlike you, I don't lie about doing research and then spew ignorant garbage as if it is truth.

The thing I called you out for, however, was your idiotic use of a Star Trek quip as some kind of measuring stick.

This might surprise you, but while I use selected quotes from Star Trek as if it is from the Bible, I don't actually worship it.

BTW the "style over substance fallacy" applies to more things than when someone dismisses you for being too rude.

Wow. Your rampant insults to my intelligence are pretty desperate. Whatever, I don't give a shit. I called it idiotic, which it was. Your claims that I'm a liar for not believing a 180 turnaround during his run-up to a candidacy run is hilarious, but I no longer give a shit. You want to write in Dennis? Go ahead. I stepped into your madness simply to mock your idea that someone who doesn't want something is the good idea(Ever considered they might know they lack the skills), and applying this to a two-time candidacy loser is flatly contradictary. But whatever. You're a purist, go for it.

[SirNitram]

ALso, your statement here shows you didn't read any of his bills. I can get behind the Genetically Engineered Food Right To Know act, his Farmer Protection Act has an interesting thing where it'd effectively ban most bananas. Sterile genetically modified plant.

Prove it, liar. If you actually read it, why don't you have a quotation?

I figure you're probably talking about this:

SEC. 109. PROHIBITION ON CERTAIN NON-FERTILE PLANT SEEDS.
Notwithstanding any other provision of law, effective 45 days after the date of the enactment of this title, a person may not manufacture, distribute, sell, plant, or otherwise use any seed that is genetically engineered to produce a plant whose seeds are not fertile or are rendered infertile by the application of an external chemical inducer.

The goal here, of course, to break the back of companies like Monsanto (which is what the whole bill is about), who use various methods to force farmers to continue buying from them in perpetuity.

If it applies to bananas at all, it is a complete perversion or a simple accident. Unlike your dishonest claim, it isn't any GM plant that is infertile, but rather seeds that create infertile plants by design.

Hm. There's a problem there.

Suppose I sell you fertile GM wheat. The wheat goes to seed. Seeds spread, by evolutionary design. Some of those seeds end up blowing into your neighbor's wheat field.

Am I entitled to sue him for growing my GM wheat?

Judging from Monsanto's 145 lawsuits, I would say 'Yes'. One lawsuit was particularly high profile, Monsanto Canada v. Schmeiser, cleared the Canadian SCOTUS. Monsanto is a dangerous company with crazy-ass patent law backing them.

[bobalot]

DX13 trolls another Ron Paul thread with bullshit tangentially related to Ron Paul. What a surprise.

[Simon_Jester]

Am I entitled to sue him for growing my GM wheat?

Well, you can now, but it seems silly to allow it.

GM plants are kinda like copyright. You have something that is naturally pretty easy to copy, and arguably beneficial to the whole to allow free copying, but you have to also consider the incentive on the creator.

Copyright lets content creators secure some market for their goods, giving a market incentive to create them.

Basically, putting the seed production exclusively in the hands of big business doesn't significantly help the research situation, and can hurt farmers throughout the world, so it is on the balance, a bad thing.

If I can sue you because your neighbor's GM crops cross-pollinated your field, how is that better than me selling sterile seeds that won't pollinate anyone's field? Also, copying seeds is not that hard if they're fertile- think about how easily casual gardeners do it.

IP rights as we know them are meant to prevent unauthorized copying. They break down when applied to things that naturally copy themselves. If you're going to outlaw the production of GM crops that won't copy themselves, you have to rework the copyright laws so that the company can't claim ownership of the natural offspring of a GM product if it escapes into the wild.

[Bakustra]

DX13 trolls another Ron Paul thread with bullshit tangentially related to Ron Paul. What a surprise.

Wait, what? You're seriously saying that you'd rather have pages and pages of Two-Minute Hate than any sort of thoughtful discussion? Because that's the absolute most charitable interpretation of your post. Look, let me give you what you want:

lol ronpaul

Repeat for pages and pages until your brain completely stagnates.

[madd0ct0r]

Regardless of anything else, D13 seems to have got Nitram pinned on not doing his research or backing up his claims.

Stll, if we're going to do a thread on Kuchnich, could it be a new thread? this guy sounds vaguely interesting.

[Simon_Jester]

Any Ron Paul voter should write in Dennis Kucinich instead.

[bobalot]

DX13 trolls another Ron Paul thread with bullshit tangentially related to Ron Paul. What a surprise.

Wait, what? You're seriously saying that you'd rather have pages and pages of Two-Minute Hate than any sort of thoughtful discussion? Because that's the absolute most charitable interpretation of your post. Look, let me give you what you want:

lol ronpaul

Repeat for pages and pages until your brain completely stagnates.

Two minutes of hate? That's rich.

I have actually posted material relevant to this thread. Like the anti-abortion bill Ron Paul co-sponsored with Michelle Bachman which directly undermines his claims of supporting "state's rights", which which is apparently less important than Dennis Kucinich and GM food in a thread about Ron Paul and his supporters.

[Aaron MkII]

Threads wander, that's the nature of them. If you have concerns, you should PM a mod, their all listed up top.

[D.Turtle]

Before anyone bothers: I'm fine with this derail.

As for D13 trolling, etc: It's your own damned fault if you leave gaping holes in your arguments and D13 comes in and rips them apart.

And of course, as new stuff about Ron Paul comes out, please continue posting it in this thread.

[UnderAGreySky]

Ron Paul to end active campaigning

An announcement from Rep. Ron Paul indicates that the Republican presidential candidate will no longer actively campaign for the GOP nomination, but will continue to work to secure delegates at upcoming Republican state conventions.

"Moving forward, however, we will no longer spend resources campaigning in primaries in states that have not yet voted," said Paul, in a statement released Monday afternoon. "Doing so with any hope of success would take many tens of millions of dollars we simply do not have."

As of April 1, Paul's campaign had $1.8 million cash on hand.

But the longtime congressman from Texas, who's making his third bid for the White House, says he'll continue to try and secure delegates to the Republican convention in Tampa, Florida in late August.

"Our campaign will continue to work in the state convention process. We will continue to take leadership positions, win delegates, and carry a strong message to the Republican National Convention that Liberty is the way of the future," adds Paul, in his statement.

As of April 1, Paul's campaign had $1.8 million cash on hand.

I look forward to the chaos at the conventions.

[bobalot]

You think there will be chaos? He wont have enough delegates to do anything of note.

[Crossroads Inc.]

And thus Ron Paul exits, not with a bang, but a whimper.
Already the Paulities are shouting "Next time!" in traditional fashion.

[bobalot]

UPDATE: Ron Paul loses in his own district.

Mitt Romney is the Republican candidate.

[BrooklynRedLeg]

UPDATE: Ron Paul loses in his own district.

So what? Romney lost almost every fucking delegate in Massachusetts.

Mitt Romney is the Republican candidate.

Uh, try again. Its not over:



The fact you fucking idiots cannot understand how this process works, even when its clearly explained to you, is astounding.

[Napoleon the Clown]

Dude, Romey has a 900 point lead in the hard count and a 939 point lead in the soft count. There are less than seven hundred delegates left. It may not be officially over but the results are pretty much obvious by this point. Your guy lost. By a lot. It happens. Just move on and hope that next election season people will awaken to Liberty and get Ron Paul 2.0 (whoever that ends up being) into the White House. As it is you're hoping the guy in the guillotine will survive even though the blade is already falling toward his neck.

The nomination is as good as secure, seeing as his closest competitor can't even secure the nomination at this point, no matter what happens.

[Mr Bean]

The nomination is as good as secure, seeing as his closest competitor can't even secure the nomination at this point, no matter what happens.

Romney could drop dead of a heart attack or get raptured away or have to quit the race because he really does have six wives in Mexico or some other mega-scandal. You might scoff at that but need I remind you that John Edwards ran for President and had an excellent chance of winning in any other year except the one he ran in and had as much support as Romney did until the media decided it was Hillary VS Obama not Edwards & Obama VS Hillary.

In that situation Paul is by delegate count close to being the backup pick.