Iraqi arseholes set new low for human behaviour.

[Shroom Man 777]

That reminds me of something I read in the Black Hawk Down novel that was based on actual factual accounts and interviews of the Rangers and Delta operators who survived the Battle of Mogadishu.

Like, in one incident drug-addled Somalis totting all sorts of firearms were riding a cow into battle and shooting at the Americans. The Rangers and Delta guys opened fire and killed all the Somalis, leaving the cow unhurt. And then a Black Hawk flew by and fired its minigun, causing the cow to explode.

[FSTargetDrone]

Dammit, I want my donkey-cart MLRS!!

Well, here is a donkey cart WITH what appears to be the donkey!



Looks like at least 6 tubes in there. Good enough?

[Darth Wong]

That is so cool.

[FSTargetDrone]

I wonder if the writing on the side says something like, "Light fuse and get away," or "Aim away from face."

[eyl]

Don't forget the donkey-bombs. I guess they were out of cars that day.

Or was that Afghanistan...?

Could be. In fact, I may be confusing my recollection of the story I heard above with the story of Hussam Abdo that Kanastrous talked about.

The Palestinians have used suicide donkeys on several occasions. After one of those incidents, PETA sent a complaint to Arafat

[Aaron]

The amazing thing about the donkey MLRS is that the donkey is not injured.

[Shroom Man 777]

Really? I thought they'd be having it for...dinner.

[Aaron]

Really? I thought they'd be having it for...dinner.

They set it up, fired it off and the operators buggered off. It's really not healthy for them to stick around long enough to take the donkey with them. And though camels get eaten alot in Afghanistan, I'm not sure if donkeys get used for food.

[[R_H]]

The Palestinians have used suicide donkeys on several occasions. After one of those incidents, PETA sent a complaint to Arafat

That's just hilarious. As if old Arafat would have given a shit about PETA's whining about suicide donkeys. Like the PLO would have cared about a donkey, let alone using human suicide bombers.

[Shroom Man 777]

PETA would've preferred it if the PLO stuck with human suicide bombers.

[Ryan Thunder]

I thought the Iraqis wanted US forces OUT of Iraq? With something like this, the Surge is likely to be extended, meaning the Iraqis will have to put up with the presence of US soldiers, marines, and mercs for several more months.

I've been thinking that about the whole insurgency since it started.

Wouldn't they get rid of us faster by helping us help them set up a stable infrastructure?

Works for both of us that way, I'd think.

[The Spartan]

I've been thinking that about the whole insurgency since it started.

Wouldn't they get rid of us faster by helping us help them set up a stable infrastructure?

Works for both of us that way, I'd think.

There's lots of reasons it doesn't work that way. For one, many, I won't hazard a guess as to what the percentages break down to, don't think we want to leave. They may think we're there to conquer them, take their oil and then leave.

Others think that we're there to force Western values that they don't want upon them, not without justification. But they don't want those Western values.

Still others are fighting because they want to have the biggest piece of the pie when we eventually leave.

Others are fighting simply because they don't like other people, especially *gasp* foreigners, telling them what to do.

Others are any combination of the above and more that I haven't thought of.

[Lord of the Abyss]

I thought the Iraqis wanted US forces OUT of Iraq? With something like this, the Surge is likely to be extended, meaning the Iraqis will have to put up with the presence of US soldiers, marines, and mercs for several more months.

I've been thinking that about the whole insurgency since it started.

Wouldn't they get rid of us faster by helping us help them set up a stable infrastructure?

No. We are there to use them and their resources, not to help them.

More importantly, what makes you think that THEY believe that we have any intention of leaving, or that we have any intention of setting up a stable infrastructure ?

We are their mortal enemies; the people who invaded them, devastated their country, tortured them, slaughtered them and in general made their lives hell. However politically unacceptable it is in America for us to regard ourselves as anything other than noble heroic liberators, the people whose countries we lay waste are not magically required to agree with us, or to consider us well meaning. Nor are they required to believe that we will give up our conquest of them without the shedding of American blood.

[Kanastrous]

We are their mortal enemies;

I think the salient fact, is that we are foreigners. After all, Saddam Hussein

devastated their country,

check!

tortured them,

check!

slaughtered them

check!

and in general made their lives hell.

and, check!

It's all about who's doing it. A homegrown Arab tyrant is perfectly acceptable (and a tradition reaching into antiquity). For kaffir aliens to pull the same shit, or anything approaching it, is simply intolerable.

[Lord of the Abyss]

We are their mortal enemies;

I think the salient fact, is that we are foreigners. After all, Saddam Hussein

You mean good old Saddam, the guy we supported for years ? We share the blame for the things he did. We helped him, after all.

devastated their country,

check!

tortured them,

check!

slaughtered them

check!

and in general made their lives hell.

and, check!

But not nearly to the degree we have. And his crimes are added to our own, anyway. We've suceeded in making Saddam look good by comparison.

[Kanastrous]

Well, we've succeeded in making him look competent, by comparison.

I'm not sure that's the same thing.

[Lord of the Abyss]

Well, we've succeeded in making him look competent, by comparison.

I'm not sure that's the same thing.

When it comes running a country, past a certain point it might as well be. The fact is, we've thoroughly ruined Iraq. From the Iraqi viewpoint, it doesn't really matter whether they are impoverished, in the dark without electricity, drinking contaminated water ( if lucky ) and little if any food due to American malice or American incompetence. We've certainly done the kind of damage one would expect from someone motivated by malice.

[Broomstick]

We are their mortal enemies; the people who invaded them, devastated their country, tortured them, slaughtered them and in general made their lives hell. However politically unacceptable it is in America for us to regard ourselves as anything other than noble heroic liberators, the people whose countries we lay waste are not magically required to agree with us, or to consider us well meaning. Nor are they required to believe that we will give up our conquest of them without the shedding of American blood.

If you consider that no other conquering power in the Middle East in something like 10,000 years has ever left voluntarily you might better understand their doubts that WE will leave.

[Lord of the Abyss]

We are their mortal enemies; the people who invaded them, devastated their country, tortured them, slaughtered them and in general made their lives hell. However politically unacceptable it is in America for us to regard ourselves as anything other than noble heroic liberators, the people whose countries we lay waste are not magically required to agree with us, or to consider us well meaning. Nor are they required to believe that we will give up our conquest of them without the shedding of American blood.

If you consider that no other conquering power in the Middle East in something like 10,000 years has ever left voluntarily you might better understand their doubts that WE will leave.

Hmmm ? I certainly understand why they don't believe we intend to leave voluntarily. * I * don't believe it. I was responding to the claim that they they would get rid of us faster by co-operating with us.

[Broomstick]

They don't believe we'll leave whether or not they cooperate.

[Sea Skimmer]

It's all about who's doing it. A homegrown Arab tyrant is perfectly acceptable (and a tradition reaching into antiquity). For kaffir aliens to pull the same shit, or anything approaching it, is simply intolerable.

That would be the same story anywhere in the world

[Lord of the Abyss]

They don't believe we'll leave whether or not they cooperate.

That's what I was saying. Apparently not too clearly.

[Kanastrous]

It's all about who's doing it. A homegrown Arab tyrant is perfectly acceptable (and a tradition reaching into antiquity). For kaffir aliens to pull the same shit, or anything approaching it, is simply intolerable.

That would be the same story anywhere in the world

I expect that's true.

[Spyder]

I thought the Iraqis wanted US forces OUT of Iraq? With something like this, the Surge is likely to be extended, meaning the Iraqis will have to put up with the presence of US soldiers, marines, and mercs for several more months.

I've been thinking that about the whole insurgency since it started.

Wouldn't they get rid of us faster by helping us help them set up a stable infrastructure?

Works for both of us that way, I'd think.

Well it might if the US actually had any interest in setting up stable infrastructure. Anyone recall those factories that they wouldn't restore and hand back over to the state because they felt it didn't comply with free market ideals?