Penn State would rather football than justice for child rape

[Kanastrous]

My first thought upon hearing about the rioting was 'use live ammunition.' But I was admittedly in a pissy mood at the time.

~stop taking a detour into tough guy land. Thanas.

[Thanas]

I can understand why Paterno decided the way he did. It was wrong and he should not have done it but I can understand where he came from. Football players especially college players are conditioned from a young age to believe you listen to your coach first above all else. And division I football coaches are elevated to the status of minor deities. Remember this is the man who had control essentially over Joe's line, scholarships, and for all intents and purposes Paterno's future. The decision to go against him is not an easy one.

Did you even read the article? Paterno is the freaking head coach.

*snip*

STFU, fool.

[Kanastrous]

It's a nice creative variation on the old I was only following orders bit, though.

[Simon_Jester]

One thing's for sure, if I wasn't so adhere to the law I would had proposed executing every single one of them. I means those bastards protected a child rapist like a goddamn messiah just because he win games for them. What the hell happened to the state?

...Ahem.

The child rapist here was an assistant coach who controlled a local charity dedicated to... helping disadvantaged students. Sandusky (the pedophile) used this as a way to get access to little boys.

By the time the case at the linchpin of this occurred (the one in 2002 where a graduate assistant reported Sandusky's activities), Sandusky had already retired- but still had access to Penn State facilities, and was using them to carry out his sexual abuse.

Paterno (who has been head coach at Penn State for a long, long time) is responsible for not dropping the hammer on Sandusky. Not because he was winning games, because Sandusky was retired. Because Paterno didn't want a scandal (as far as I can tell).

Just so we're clear on the sequence of events, and who was responsible for what. Sandusky is the pedophile. Paterno is the head coach. So far, the only case where Sandusky's sexual abuse was reported to Paterno came after Sandusky had already left Penn State. According to the grand jury hearing, there is no specific evidence that Paterno knew about Sandusky's sexual abuse while Sandusky was a coach at Penn State who was contributing directly to Penn State's football program.

Then again, maybe he did- but that isn't mentioned in the grand jury hearing so far as I can tell.

[Thanas]

Joe Paterno had it coming to him. He needed to be humiliated in the end, fired on the same day he announced his retirement, all but excommunicated by the very institution he had elevated into a sanctuary from all those vile major college ills.

Don't cry for Joe, because Joe didn't cry for the alleged victims of Jerry Sandusky, the lost boys of Penn State, until it was at least nine years too late. The greatest of coaches, Paterno made possible the greatest scandal in the history of college sports.

He won't be returning to the Rose Bowl, but Paterno is going out with the granddaddy of them all regardless. No case of point-shaving, drugs, pay-for-play schemes, death-penalty NCAA violations, even the nightmarish story at Baylor -- nothing approaches the gross negligence at Penn State that allowed an accused sexual predator to continue to allegedly prey on children while the band played on.

And all of this for what? Protecting the university's standing as a moral compass? Protecting the Nittany Lions' money machine? Protecting Paterno's legacy as an educator and molder of fine young men?

How are all those things looking right about now?

Forget the record 409 victories, and the many contributions to charitable and academic causes. Even at 84, even after living an iconic American life, Paterno deserved to be terminated in a phone call with the same trustees he'd so arrogantly advised to leave him be and let him retire in peace. "The past several days have been absolutely terrible for the entire Penn State community," board vice chair John Surma said at the news conference to announce the removal of Paterno and university president Graham Spanier.

"But the outrage that we feel is nothing compared to the physical and psychological suffering that allegedly took place."

Paterno has admitted he should have done more to stop that physical and psychological suffering outlined in brutal detail in the grand jury's report. It wasn't much of a concession, given that in 2002, he received an eyewitness account of a naked Sandusky in the showers with a naked boy -- the witness, Mike McQueary, later would testify the former defensive coordinator was forcing anal intercourse on the child -- and yet Paterno chose to do next to nothing about it.

This is a tragedy out of even Shakespeare's ballpark. But the tragedy doesn't revolve around Paterno's legacy, which now looks like something you'd find pancaked underneath a fourth-and-1 cloud of Big Ten dust.

The kids are the tragedy. The boys who lost their childhood on Penn State property. The alleged victims who will have to deal with the trauma for the rest of their haunted lives.

If Paterno and university administrators cared even a little about these kids, they did a hell of a job disguising it. So Spanier, the CEO, had to go.

But that wasn't enough, not even close. If Spanier was the official leader of Penn State, Joe Paterno was Penn State. Not just Sandusky's longtime boss and not just the forever football coach and not just the John Wooden of his sport.

Paterno was the reason State College was on anyone's map and that the university was a globally recognized brand. To let the grand old man coach against Nebraska and finish out the season with a warped victory tour would have been tantamount to telling the world that Penn State still needed to do what Penn State had to do, the alleged victims be damned.

In the end, the trustees realized they had to sack Paterno and put up with the misguided students causing havoc in the streets. When Surma was done with the sidebar duties of kissing Spanier goodbye, he said, "In addition, Joe Paterno is no longer the head football coach effective immediately."

This one had to hurt. Paterno had released a statement earlier in the day announcing his retirement, effective at the end of the season, acknowledging that the sexual abuse case amounted to "one of the great sorrows of my life." But while expressing his concern for the alleged victims and his regret for not aiding them, Paterno offered a hint of why and how he could possibly take McQueary's 2002 account, pass it on to the athletic director, and then return without a second thought to his X's and O's.

The head coach decreed that the trustees "should not spend a single minute discussing my status." One more time, Paterno was putting a big offensive line in front of his legacy and arrogantly plowing ahead with his career, on his terms, with no regard for Sandusky's alleged victims.

So he deserved to take an embarrassing hit. After all the pain and suffering alleged to have been inflicted on his watch, Paterno couldn't be allowed to represent the university for one more game, one more senior day.

"A phone call put me out of it," he told students and reporters gathered outside his home, "but we'll go from there."

Paterno blew a kiss to the cheering students, waved, and gave a fist pump and a thumbs up. He thanked the students and asked them to pray for the victims.

They'll need it, and then some.

Paterno? No, he isn't the one to feel sorry for, even after decades of dignity and grace. If Paterno thinks getting fired on his retirement day stings, he doesn't know true pain.

He can reread the grand jury report to find out about that. Some of those lost boys of Penn State could have been saved, and Joe Paterno will go to his grave knowing that will forever be college sports' greatest shame.

ESPN.

[Kanastrous]

My first thought upon hearing about the rioting was 'use live ammunition.' But I was admittedly in a pissy mood at the time.

~stop taking a detour into tough guy land. Thanas.

*shrug* mentioning a momentary, impulsive idea concerning someone -else's- actions is hardly tough-guyish. Claiming that I was about to do it myself, maybe, as foolish as that would be. But mentioning a passing gut reaction to something is not a claim to tough-guy-ness. How would thinking that someone -else- might do something make -me- tough?

[Thanas]

If you want to openly voice momentary, impulsive and completely freaking stupid reactions be prepared to be slammed for it. Seriously, thinking about using bullets on protestors? Did you really think that, however impulsive?

[Kanastrous]

If you want to openly voice momentary, impulsive and completely freaking stupid reactions be prepared to be slammed for it. Seriously, thinking about using bullets on protestors? Did you really think that, however impulsive?

Okay, fair enough.

-edit- violent rioters, not 'protesters.' Just in the interest of accuracy.

[Terralthra]

Paterno has admitted he should have done more to stop that physical and psychological suffering outlined in brutal detail in the grand jury's report. It wasn't much of a concession, given that in 2002, he received an eyewitness account of a naked Sandusky in the showers with a naked boy -- the witness, Mike McQueary, later would testify the former defensive coordinator was forcing anal intercourse on the child -- and yet Paterno chose to do next to nothing about it.

Worth noting here that the graduate aide who reported it to Paterno did exactly the same "next to nothing" that Paterno did, and the athletic director who Paterno reported it to apparently did even less. Paterno certainly could have done more than report it to his direct superior and ban Sandusky from PSU athletic facilities, but calling him an accomplice to child rape (as many are) because he did not do everything possible? Where's the media and popular outrage towards Schultz and McQueary and the unnamed janitor?

[Simon_Jester]

The difference is that Paterno was in charge. That made him more responsible for deciding Penn State's response to the issue. It also means that he didn't need to fear any personal consequences for dropping the hammer on Sandusky. A janitor or a grad student might reasonably fear that crossing swords with Sandusky could imperil their career. Paterno had the opposite situation- he was more valued to the university and its athletics program than Sandusky had ever been or would ever be, so he had the power to punish Sandusky with little danger of hurting himself.

[Kanastrous]

Until someone with a better grasp of the law tells me otherwise, I'd say that the lot of them are accessories-after-the-fact.

[Thanas]

Until someone with a better grasp of the law tells me otherwise, I'd say that the lot of them are accessories-after-the-fact.

The attorney general does not think so, but said guy is also the one who did not feel charges were necessary several years ago. So I doubt he is the guy to trust on that (yet he still remaines in charge? WTF?).


EDIT: As for Paterno, said idiot still does not appear to think this being such a huge problem considering his behaviour in the video I linked to.

This still seems to be the same problem:

But Penn State president Graham Spanier, athletic director Tim Curley, vice president for business and finance Gary Schultz and coach Joe Paterno should be held to a higher standard. So should The Second Mile, a charity that was founded to help children. Whether or not Sandusky is convicted, each was faced with a critical choice with damning information and chose to protect the program. This is what power has become. More accurately, it is what power has always been, in existence to protect itself.

There is no defense for the number of people in positions of authority who had an opportunity to stop Sandusky and did not.

The university, responding to information provided by a graduate student in 2002 that he witnessed Sandusky performing anal sex in the shower on a boy about 10 years old, did nothing. The university did not call authorities and did not ever sever ties with Sandusky, allowing him to maintain an office on campus for years.

The entire edifice of the Penn State monument is crumbling, yet no one involved seems capable of producing the most obvious, and decent, response, to acknowledge that each of these men failed to uphold his responsibilities spectacularly. They failed their communities, and they failed the eight young boys the state is accusing Sandusky of sexually abusing.

The legendary Paterno failed. He was the first of the Penn State athletic inner circle to be told of the shower incident nine years ago, and all he did was tell his university superiors. Then, according to his son, the great character builder and shaper of young people essentially never gave it a second thought, going back to designing plays for third-and-short and trying to devise ways to beat Wisconsin. Four days after Sandusky's indictment, instead of taking true responsibility and making an immediate and public plan to put the alleged victims first, the coach is scurrying from the responsibilities of leadership he ostensibly has built a life around.

Screw Paterno. He deserves to be stripped of all records and accomplishments for this great moral cowardice.

[Chirios]

Until someone with a better grasp of the law tells me otherwise, I'd say that the lot of them are accessories-after-the-fact.

From what I've read, they weren't. Legally speaking everyone did what they were supposed to.

Of course, that might mean that the law needs to be changed.

[Kanastrous]

If there's no legal obligation to report having witnessed a rape/child rape to law enforcement, I agree that the law should probably be changed.

[Alferd Packer]

Screw Paterno. He deserves to be stripped of all records and accomplishments for this great moral cowardice.

And live to be 100, never getting Alzheimer's or any other form of dementia. Though I suspect that Paterno, forcibly separated from that which loves more than anything else and having no purpose, will grow ill and die sooner, rather than later.

[weemadando]

I can understand why Paterno decided the way he did. It was wrong and he should not have done it but I can understand where he came from. Football players especially college players are conditioned from a young age to believe you listen to your coach first above all else. And division I football coaches are elevated to the status of minor deities. Remember this is the man who had control essentially over Joe's line, scholarships, and for all intents and purposes Paterno's future. The decision to go against him is not an easy one.

Did you even read the article? Paterno is the freaking head coach.

And we know what that means in terms of his level of power and influence in the school...

[Tasoth]

If there's no legal obligation to report having witnessed a rape/child rape to law enforcement, I agree that the law should probably be changed.

State law in PA requires that any instance of pedophilia be reported both verbally and in written format to the police within 48 hours of witnessing it/being informed of it. Paterno passed it off, Curley and Schultz down played it and the President never did anything about it.

[Kanastrous]

Okay, so crime committed, crime committed, and crime committed. I'm a little bit puzzled regarding the public conversation over 'what should we do?' Prosecute, prosecute, and prosecute. How is there any question?

[ChaserGrey]

The attorney general does not think so, but said guy is also the one who did not feel charges were necessary several years ago. So I doubt he is the guy to trust on that (yet he still remaines in charge? WTF?).

He may not be for much longer, at least not exclusively. Latest breaking news is that the U.S. Department of Education is investigating to see if Penn State officials complied with mandatory crime reporting requirements (hint: they didn't) and violated laws requiring colleges receiving Federal aid money make accurate statistics about crime on campus public (hint: they did). Source: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/colle ... e-1.975498

It's the Department of Education, not Justice, so they can't bring criminal charges, but they can apply penalties up to and including withdrawal of all Federal funds from Penn State. Given that a lot of student aid and pure research funding in the U.S. is through the Federal government that would be a serious blow to the institution. Don't know if the Federal DOJ can get involved unless Sandusky did something like take one of the kids across state lines.

[weemadando]

http://www.businessinsider.com/jerry-sa ... rs-2011-11

That article is... rage inducing. Only the fact that it is still unconfirmed gives me any hope for humanity.

That said, if the allegations in it are true, I guess we might have a better idea of why they were trying to protect Sandusky.

[Thanas]

If it is true and Paterno covered up a child prostitution ring in exchange for Sandusky stepping down, he deserves to spend the rest of his life in jail.

If it turns out (as alleged) that this was pretty much an open secret among the college coaches (also explains why Sandusky never coached as head coach somewhere) then there are a lot more scumbags in NCAA than I previously thought.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

If I was fired for reporting a rape of a ten year old boy in a shower to the police, this would tell me I don't want to work for those people, even if the alternative is living as a crazy up in the woods in a cabin with no electricity. This is a pretty morally bankrupt workforce. This isn't at all like normal work-related things. Cheating on taxes? No child is getting raped. Skimping on reactor maintenance dangerously? Eh, well, it hasn't melted down yet! That's the sort of thing a normal person brushes off to keep their job. But literally seeing an old man sticking his dick into a ten year old boy ? Right in front of your eyes as it happens? And your first call is not to the cops? The level of pathology in this institute is literally terrifying. There was no line they wouldn't cross if they crossed that one. Right now I wouldn't be surprised to hear they arranged "car accidents" for people in scandals to maintain their reputation over the years.

[Thanas]

link to radio interview



***********
BTW: McQuery claims he told Paterno everything, Paterno said he only told vague details. I call BS on the last claim.

[Stark]

Severe punishment always leads to compliance, right?

Its sad, but people (especially the sort of people who buy in to the celebrity worship of western culture) just don't want to deal with anything negative. While rape is a pretty heinous thing, I can see how people would be so ill-equipped to deal with it that after telling 'someone' they'd just try to forget the whole thing. Our culture doesn't reward people for taking personal responsibility at the best of times; passing the buck and putting it behind you is easy. Shock jocks might roll out the BRUTAL PUNISHMENT angle, but it's much more likely to be effective simply shifting culture in these elements, so that people feel better about 'interfering' and engaging with difficult or traumatic situations rather than passing it off.

[Kanastrous]

Severe punishment always leads to compliance, right?

It's sufficient if the threat of severe punishment in this sort of matter leads to increased compliance. Particularly since 'always' would be a stupid expectation and impossible standard, to begin with. Although a cultural shift does seem a better way to address it, the punishment approach can be a patch until we get there.