In case any U.S. members have time for protesting

[Flagg]

The Tea Party didn't come here looking for recruits. The Left did.

What are you even talking about? Where is "here"? Who is being recruited? What does this even have to do with what we are talking about?

Read the title. SolarpunkFan started this thread because he wanted people on this forum to use the tactics in the link he posted, for the cause he supports. Do you dispute this?

So, again, I ask you: why are the actions you have no qualms about the Tea Party or the militias or other right-wing groups committing suddenly so horrible now that the Left is doing them?

There are many reasons why you shouldn't be trying to make an issue out of this, but if you won't accept that first one, here's some more:

- I'm not a member of the Tea Party and have no obligation to answer for their actions;
- The Tea Party was formed three years before I joined this forum, so any thread about them using these tactics would have been dead and buried by the time I was in a position to comment;
- Whataboutism is a cretin's excuse - I don't care if the Tea Party, or the Bundys, or Bush are shit, I want the Left to be better than they are.

Now stop being a fucking idiot.

The left is better and has been you sanctimonious cuntfaced bullshit artist. Did the Occupy pussies point assault rifles at the goon squads that went in shooting tear gas, rubber bullets, and throwing flash Bangs? Did they openly brag about how they were going to put their wives, sisters, and daughters (in the Bundy bunch case all 3 could describe one woman) between themselves and law enforcement while engaged in an armed standoff to not pay millions in taxes owed so that if said law enforcement tried to arrest the welfare queen it would be a bloodbath with most of the dead being woman and children? If they did, get back to me. If not, fuck off so far that you have to buy a plane ticket to get back.

[Col. Crackpot]

Optimize visibility. Unlike in town halls, you want your presence as a group to be recognizable and attention-getting at this event. It may make sense to stick together as a group, wear relatively similar clothing / message shirts, and carry signs in order to be sure that your presence is noticeable.

Be prepared to interrupt and insist on your right to be heard. Since you won’t get the mic at an event like this, you have to attract attention to yourself and your message. Agree beforehand with your group on a simple message focused on a current or upcoming issue. Coordinate with each other to chant this message during any public remarks that your MoC makes. This can be difficult and a bit uncomfortable. But it sends a powerful message to your MOC that they won’t be able to get press for other events until they address your concerns.
...
Hold organizational hosts accountable. Often events such as these will be hosted by local businesses or non-partisan organizations — groups that don’t want controversy or to alienate the community. Reach out to them directly to express your concern that they are giving a platform to pro-Trump authoritarianism, racism, and corruption. If they persist, use social media to express your disappointment. This will reduce the likelihood that these organizations will host the Trump-friendly MoC in the future. MoCs depend on invitations like these to build ties and raise their visibility — so this matters to them.

Taking this advice makes you a shitty demonstrator, a shitty American and a shitty human being. Shouting people down and deplatforming are tools to destroy free speech and useful discussion. The use of these tactics is illegitimate and everyone else knows it.

They have nothing worthwhile to say, and being shouted down and deplatforming someone DOES NOT VIOLATE FREE SPEECH. Period. Free Speech is protection from government censorship. Not your fellow citizens telling you to shut the fuck up--because that is free speech too.

If a Nazi gets shouted down with "NOPE! NO NO NO! Bad Nazi Bad! NO BISCUIT!" or someone like me singing music from Fiddler on the Roof, it humiliates them and makes them feel weak and powerless, which is exactly how they should feel. It is also effective. Ridicule and derision, especially if it is funny, turns people off of Fascism, because humans are social animals that tend to follow a dominance hierarchy and respond to ostracism. You laugh at the Nazi, and everyone else gets the signal that they are unacceptable in civil society. If you let them talk, they can Gish Gallop you (throw out crazy bullshit you have to ignore and look ignorant, or fall all over yourself trying to refute while they throw out more crazy bullshit, thus controlling the terms of debate). So you don't let them talk.

So silence the people you disagree with by spamming them with bullshit. Thanks for giving us permission to do that Mr. Moderator.

[Elfdart]

If a Nazi gets shouted down with "NOPE! NO NO NO! Bad Nazi Bad! NO BISCUIT!" or someone like me singing music from Fiddler on the Roof, it humiliates them and makes them feel weak and powerless, which is exactly how they should feel. It is also effective. Ridicule and derision, especially if it is funny, turns people off of Fascism, because humans are social animals that tend to follow a dominance hierarchy and respond to ostracism. You laugh at the Nazi, and everyone else gets the signal that they are unacceptable in civil society. If you let them talk, they can Gish Gallop you (throw out crazy bullshit you have to ignore and look ignorant, or fall all over yourself trying to refute while they throw out more crazy bullshit, thus controlling the terms of debate). So you don't let them talk.

Does this work because you're a bad singer, or is it the same effect Slim Whitman has on Martians?

I've found that very loud feigned laughter at the punchline (complete with exaggerated knee-slapping) deflates this kind of mountebank pretty quickly, especially since the cops won't throw you out right away on the grounds that you're one of those troublemakers trying to disrupt the show.

[Alyrium Denryle]

Taking this advice makes you a shitty demonstrator, a shitty American and a shitty human being. Shouting people down and deplatforming are tools to destroy free speech and useful discussion. The use of these tactics is illegitimate and everyone else knows it.

They have nothing worthwhile to say, and being shouted down and deplatforming someone DOES NOT VIOLATE FREE SPEECH. Period. Free Speech is protection from government censorship. Not your fellow citizens telling you to shut the fuck up--because that is free speech too.

If a Nazi gets shouted down with "NOPE! NO NO NO! Bad Nazi Bad! NO BISCUIT!" or someone like me singing music from Fiddler on the Roof, it humiliates them and makes them feel weak and powerless, which is exactly how they should feel. It is also effective. Ridicule and derision, especially if it is funny, turns people off of Fascism, because humans are social animals that tend to follow a dominance hierarchy and respond to ostracism. You laugh at the Nazi, and everyone else gets the signal that they are unacceptable in civil society. If you let them talk, they can Gish Gallop you (throw out crazy bullshit you have to ignore and look ignorant, or fall all over yourself trying to refute while they throw out more crazy bullshit, thus controlling the terms of debate). So you don't let them talk.

So silence the people you disagree with who want to kill you by spamming them with bullshit. Thanks for giving us permission to do that Mr. Moderator.

Fixed that for you.

It isn't necessary here. We just ban Nazis instantly. Do you have anything productive to contribute?

[Col. Crackpot]

They have nothing worthwhile to say, and being shouted down and deplatforming someone DOES NOT VIOLATE FREE SPEECH. Period. Free Speech is protection from government censorship. Not your fellow citizens telling you to shut the fuck up--because that is free speech too.

If a Nazi gets shouted down with "NOPE! NO NO NO! Bad Nazi Bad! NO BISCUIT!" or someone like me singing music from Fiddler on the Roof, it humiliates them and makes them feel weak and powerless, which is exactly how they should feel. It is also effective. Ridicule and derision, especially if it is funny, turns people off of Fascism, because humans are social animals that tend to follow a dominance hierarchy and respond to ostracism. You laugh at the Nazi, and everyone else gets the signal that they are unacceptable in civil society. If you let them talk, they can Gish Gallop you (throw out crazy bullshit you have to ignore and look ignorant, or fall all over yourself trying to refute while they throw out more crazy bullshit, thus controlling the terms of debate). So you don't let them talk.

So silence the people you disagree with who want to kill you by spamming them with bullshit. Thanks for giving us permission to do that Mr. Moderator.

Fixed that for you.

It isn't necessary here. We just ban Nazis instantly. Do you have anything productive to contribute?

That depends. Are you equating the current political state of the United States with 1930's Germany?

[Col. Crackpot]

And quite frankly in your quest to "ban Nazis" in ten years you've transformed this board from a vibrant center of debate, where literally thousands of members were online at once debating various topics, to the circle jerk echo chamber for half dozen or so people that are online at any given time that it is today. #goodjobgoodeffort

[Alyrium Denryle]

So silence the people you disagree with who want to kill you by spamming them with bullshit. Thanks for giving us permission to do that Mr. Moderator.

Fixed that for you.

It isn't necessary here. We just ban Nazis instantly. Do you have anything productive to contribute?

That depends. Are you equating the current political state of the United States with 1930's Germany?

Not yet. However, do I have to wait until Kristallnacht? The FADA is one step above Nuremberg for gays--we get to keep our citizenship at least, but lose basically all protections of that citizenship to someone with a religious objection.

Want to disagree on climate change? Fine. I will beat you with data. Monetary policy? That's cool. Same there. Want to strip me and others of civil rights and treat us like we are subhuman trash, possibly kill us? OK. Rhetoric gloves are off.

I fail to see what is unreasonable about that, given that they now have access to the power of the state to break up large scale protests and actively suppress dissent (to say nothing of republican control of state legislatures to strip voting rights from black people/suppress voter turnout, effectively criminalize being trans, and pass laws at the state level to permit bullying of gay teenagers. They've been doing that shit for years). I reject unilateral disarmament.

And quite frankly in your quest to "ban Nazis" in ten years you've transformed this board from a vibrant center of debate, where literally thousands of members were online at once debating various topics, to the circle jerk echo chamber for half dozen or so people that are online at any given time that it is today. #goodjobgoodeffort

Wow that's nice. Not, you know, actually what happened. We started banning Nazis really early in the board's history back when Stormfront invaded, and the threshold for it is coming out and saying one is a Nazi or using ethnic slurs. I mean, we have never even banned Shep for fuck's sake.

No. The board has slowed down because social media exists and the topic for which the board was founded is much less culturally relevant than it used to be, plus 15 years of accumulated forum drama.

But do persist in your ridiculousness. It amuses me.

[Col. Crackpot]

I remember Stomfront. And the pedos... Whatever their name was. Darkstar. I was here.

My point is that you must be careful when you are so keen to merely shout down offending opinion and ban those who piss you off, lest you become what you so despise.

[Alyrium Denryle]

I remember Stomfront. And the pedos... Whatever their name was. Darkstar. I was here.

My point is that you must be careful when you are so keen to merely shout down offending opinion and ban those who piss you off, lest you become what you so despise.

Here is the threshold:

"Does X want to use the power of the state to make [Group Y] illegal for existing despite [Group Y] causing no harm to others as a class? Do they want to use the power of the state to suppress dissent in order to harm [Group Y] with impunity or to ultimately destroy democracy itself?"

If the answer to one of these questions is Yes, then pull out the stops; because they certainly wont be holding back with the people they want to harm.

We're talking about Nazis. We're talking about the Klan. We're talking about wingnut religious fundamentalists ranting on street corners. The argument could be made for republicans but it is not universally applicable. Certainly their loony faction (Michelle Bachmann et al), and we will see how deep the rot goes in the next few years, won't we?

[Ziggy Stardust]

Read the title. SolarpunkFan started this thread because he wanted people on this forum to use the tactics in the link he posted, for the cause he supports. Do you dispute this?

So, one person posts a thread that Americans should be more politically active (which is somehow tantamount to a recruitment drive by "the Left"). Why are you so opposed to this? What is it about people being politically active and aware that so distresses you?

- I'm not a member of the Tea Party and have no obligation to answer for their actions;

Yet you feel an obligation to answer for the actions of "the Left"? Your hypocrisy is showing.

- The Tea Party was formed three years before I joined this forum, so any thread about them using these tactics would have been dead and buried by the time I was in a position to comment;

Not true, considering the Tea Party has remained active continuously. And conveniently side-steps answering whether you agree with the actions of the Bundys et al.

- Whataboutism is a cretin's excuse - I don't care if the Tea Party, or the Bundys, or Bush are shit, I want the Left to be better than they are.

In other words, you think you have the right to selectively criticize only the people you dislike without any logical coherency what-so-ever. Gotcha.

Remember, YOU were the one that danced into this thread to accuse leftist protesters of being "shitty Americans" and "shitty human beings", using "illegitimate" tactics that somehow destroy free speech (though you haven't clarified how that can possibly be the case). Despite multiple people, especially Alyrium, eloquently explaining why you are incorrect, you continue to shriek about the evil Left, and you don't have to answer for the actions of right-wing parties that use the same exact tactics. Either you think the Bundys and Tea Party as just as "illegitimate" as the left-wing demonstrators that are the subject of this thread, or you are just a hypocritical little shit.

Now stop being a fucking idiot.

You first, you miserable troll.

Your posting history does not earn you the right to any benefit of the doubt, given your very long-standing habit of sliding into threads for a couple of one-line "der liberals are stoopid" and then slipping back out without defending anything.

[Flagg]

Grumman calling anyone a fucking idiot is a compliment to that person. Frankly I find it hilarious that since President Pussygrabber took the oath he immediately broke once getting his silly putty ass to the Whitehouse (which I want to go over with a black light once he leaves for good) the feces felching rightwing monkeys suddenly raised their profile to defend the rights of the various hate groups that they secretly (or not so secretly coughshepcough) admire. The Nazi's! Oh, won't somebody think of the Nazi's!?!?

[SolarpunkFan]

And I've made another thread that causes problems. That figures.

Sorry about this.

[Simon_Jester]

Nah, this one wasn't really your fault.

[Flagg]

Yeah, you can't control the troll brigade. Wait, can you? Because if you can, what's your price for making them star in an off-Broadway production of 'Rent'?

[Col. Crackpot]

Yeah, you can't control the troll brigade. Wait, can you? Because if you can, what's your price for making them star in an off-Broadway production of 'Rent'?

Five hundred twenty five thousand six hundred dollars.

And I get to be Benny because he was the only one with his shit together.

[Flagg]

Yeah, you can't control the troll brigade. Wait, can you? Because if you can, what's your price for making them star in an off-Broadway production of 'Rent'?

Five hundred twenty five thousand six hundred dollars.

And I get to be Benny because he was the only one with his shit together.

Thread won, everyone go home.