Cosby Has Harsh Words for Black Community

[Crom]

Bill Cosby is a badass. Hell, now I'm inspired to go and make more out of my life and I'm not black.

[Vohu Manah]

This thread reminds me of something Chris Rock once said, but I can't find the quote or when he said it. I think it was during his 1997 HBO Special....

Anyway, I'm surprised Rev. Jackson agreed (or at least seemed to) with Mr. Cosby's statement.

[Einhander Sn0m4n]

I've ranted many times about the "black victim" mentality in America; it's a crippling, self-fulfillilng prophecy. And it's ultimately the ghost of segregation; why the fuck do blacks in America think they need to have a distinct culture?

When people talk about Asian culture, they mean the actual geographical region of Asia, not a Chinese immigrant living in New Jersey. But when people talk about black culture, they're referring to this ghetto gangsta ebonic moron dipshit culture that's been created by drug dealers and youth gangs in the burned-out inner cities of the continental US. It glorifies ignorance and crime, drips with contempt for education and civilized society, and makes really shitty music.

I've been saying that for the longest time here in New Orleans, but the fucktarded bastards lump me in with the fucking KKK and the Nazis. THEN the fuckers call themselves a 'Minority' when they make up at least 90% of the population of New Orleans proper and at least half the pop of the whole Metro Area! Then they leverage that undeserved 'minority' status to dick everyone over and make us pay for their food, drug habits, and sheer laziness by making shitloads of babies neither they nor the ecosystem can't support, then using these children to drain the welfare system dry.. In other words, they're getting it both ways and no one can do a thing about it for fear of being labeled 'racist jew-killing nazi piece of shit' and then getting the shit beat out of them or just summarily shot. Worse: The fuckers are as racist if not more than any damn KKK or NAAWP (David DuKKKe's little funhouse) I've ever had the displeasure of dealing with. And people wonder why taxes and anger here are so fucking outrageous!?

Racism is alive and quite well in New Orleans to the point it's integral with politics. For example: We had a recent and very messy fight in the N.O. School Board over corruption (the School Board fuckheads were lining their own pockets with tax money and FEDERAL AID MONEY MEANT FOR THIS CITY'S CHILDREN!!), and the new superintendent, an honorable fellow by the name of Anthony Amato, had the titanium balls to call them on it. What did they do? What do they always do when the enemy happens to be not black? Yup, they screamed "OMG RACISM!1 YU0=NAZI ASSHOLE!!!111 GET T3H FUCK OUT!!!1" and tried their damnedest to get him fired. His crime? Being white and thinking of this damn city's future instead of lubelessly assraping the taxpaying citizens of New Orleans and their children's education for a quick easy dollar. No education for the children means they only learn to count bullets in their AK47s and convert grams of crack to dollar amounts for sale on the streets...

Then we get to the New Orleans Police Department: 90% black, just as corrupt, and they regularly beat down on the city's gutterpunks (homeless white, hispanic, or anyone-else-who-isn't-black people) on a daily basis. Then they'll arrest you and handily get you convicted of some trumped-up bullshit charge that wouldn't fly anywhere else. Then you'll have a record you don't deserve, with all the bullshit that entails, like no voting rights (if they get a felony on you) and difficulty getting a job (like one needs more difficulty with the damn-near nonexistent economy!) and that's not mentioning the actual jail time! They're the ones whom I've railed against on here many times (search for 'NOPD'). I'm still convinced they don't do anywhere near enough to squash the crack cocaine and drunk-driving problems because they're too busy raising crazy hell over marijuana. The rumors the police are selling confiscated crack on the cheap for yet another quick easy dollar really don't help things...

[18-Till-I-Die]

You know Einhander, i find that somewhat offensive. I understand your point, but some of the discriptions were more than a little unjust. There were other ways to say it, less inflamitory ways, i mean. If that is how you talk about Blacks to their face there is a reason they think you're a racist, even if you're not. It's needlessly inflamitory.

I'm not trying to insult you and I'm not trying to call you a racist, just to be clear, i'm just saying that some of that was needlessly offensive and patronizing. Theer were more 'correct' ways of saying it. Cause it really does sound very offensive as is, even if you're right (which i'm not sure of, cause i have no knowledge of what New Orleans is like, so i wont comment either way in that respect).

[Einhander Sn0m4n]

You know Einhander, i find that somewhat offensive. I understand your point, but some of the discriptions were more than a little unjust. There were other ways to say it, less inflamitory ways, i mean. If that is how you talk about Blacks to their face there is a reason they think you're a racist, even if you're not. It's needlessly inflamitory.

I'm not trying to insult you and I'm not trying to call you a racist, just to be clear, i'm just saying that some of that was needlessly offensive and patronizing. Theer were more 'correct' ways of saying it. Cause it really does sound very offensive as is, even if you're right (which i'm not sure of, cause i have no knowledge of what New Orleans is like, so i wont comment either way in that respect).

Ah, don't think that's how I approach them directly. Hell, a lot of them make good friends on an individual basis. But their group mentality is absolute shit, plus I'm referring to the most visible and loudmouthed ones who have worked themselves into politics. I'm calling a duck a duck, but I'm referring to the visible (read: powerful) ones like the politicians and rap stars who fuck the Average Joes' children over in pursuit of personal gain and incite the kiddies to violence, respectively.

[18-Till-I-Die]

You know Einhander, i find that somewhat offensive. I understand your point, but some of the discriptions were more than a little unjust. There were other ways to say it, less inflamitory ways, i mean. If that is how you talk about Blacks to their face there is a reason they think you're a racist, even if you're not. It's needlessly inflamitory.

I'm not trying to insult you and I'm not trying to call you a racist, just to be clear, i'm just saying that some of that was needlessly offensive and patronizing. Theer were more 'correct' ways of saying it. Cause it really does sound very offensive as is, even if you're right (which i'm not sure of, cause i have no knowledge of what New Orleans is like, so i wont comment either way in that respect).

Ah, don't think that's how I approach them directly. Hell, a lot of them make good friends on an individual basis. But their group mentality is absolute shit, plus I'm referring to the most visible and loudmouthed ones who have worked themselves into politics. I'm calling a duck a duck, but I'm referring to the visible (read: powerful) ones like the politicians and rap stars who fuck the Average Joes' children over in pursuit of personal gain and incite the kiddies to violence, respectively.

Well i can understand the frustation. Where i live, people are getting gunned down in teh streets--there were at least two shootings within days of each other here--and our mayor is starting to look like he's guilty (to me anyway) of putting a hit out on a call girl who beat up his wife. So, it can be worse.

[Einhander Sn0m4n]

You know Einhander, i find that somewhat offensive. I understand your point, but some of the discriptions were more than a little unjust. There were other ways to say it, less inflamitory ways, i mean. If that is how you talk about Blacks to their face there is a reason they think you're a racist, even if you're not. It's needlessly inflamitory.

I'm not trying to insult you and I'm not trying to call you a racist, just to be clear, i'm just saying that some of that was needlessly offensive and patronizing. Theer were more 'correct' ways of saying it. Cause it really does sound very offensive as is, even if you're right (which i'm not sure of, cause i have no knowledge of what New Orleans is like, so i wont comment either way in that respect).

Ah, don't think that's how I approach them directly. Hell, a lot of them make good friends on an individual basis. But their group mentality is absolute shit, plus I'm referring to the most visible and loudmouthed ones who have worked themselves into politics. I'm calling a duck a duck, but I'm referring to the visible (read: powerful) ones like the politicians and rap stars who fuck the Average Joes' children over in pursuit of personal gain and incite the kiddies to violence, respectively.

Well i can understand the frustation. Where i live, people are getting gunned down in teh streets--there were at least two shootings within days of each other here--and our mayor is starting to look like he's guilty (to me anyway) of putting a hit out on a call girl who beat up his wife. So, it can be worse.

I'm glad we can agree on that. The victim mentality, the wanton crime, death, and destruction, and the future-sabotaging government corruption need to go. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening ever...

[Lonestar]

Cosby's right.

I see this in the Navy. The "Dumb" rates (Almost exclusively undesignated Deck Seamen) are crammed with fellows who enjoy blasting BET at all hours in berthing and busting out some spontaneous rapping.

However over, Blacks in smart rates (ETs, STG/Ss, FCs, and, *ahem*, CTs) tend to be smart, well articulate guys. A few of which became gamers when they got to the navy technical schools that were crammed with other geeks.

Even the BM3s tend to give off the air of knowing what the Hell they're doing, indicating (to me) that once giving the proper prodding they overcome the gangsta culture and work to improve themselves. One of my E-6s (E-6 is a fairly high enlisted rank) is a guy from Detroit who listens to classical music and bans rap music from his household. Draw your conclusions.

[Joe]

You know what really drives me crazy? Stores which play that shit on their sound systems. Loudly, and obtrusively. It used to be that store music was quiet, inobtrusive, wimpy backtround noise. Now you walk into a goddamned clothing store and fucking rap "music" is blaring out of the speaker. I've walked into stores and turned right around again because I couldn't stomach the thought of shopping in that environment.

There's some kind of theory behind that; my mom works in retail, and she told me that the idea is for you to go into the store, make your purchase, and leave quickly due to annoyance at the music, and apparently it somehow works.

In any case, you don't know what unbelievably loud rap music is until you've seen one of those $500 used cadillacs with $1000 speakers flying down the street. You can hear them coming from a half-mile away and you wonder how the cars can still be intact after so much rattling.

[Clone Sergeant]

I have to say I agree with Mr. Cosby. He has lived through the civil rights era so he knows how far off track the black community has gone. I personally lay the blame for the problem on street thug ideology purveyed by rap music. While all rap isn't bad, the stuff that generally gets air time on MTV or BET is. Back in the 80's rap was an acquired taste but was by and large harmless. Rappers generally talked about how great they were at rapping and little else.

The problems started in the 90's where Gansta rap began to be the most popular style. While the rappers were fairly talented at making their lyrics, the content consisted of hatred towards whites, cops, and anyone who would disrespect them. The reason I believe this style caught on was the bravado and the whole outlaw mystique. They were talking about all of the things that were obstacles for black youths at the time. The fact that guys were on MTV talking about it was a sort of validation. They could say: "You see, Ice Cube is street, but he's on TV, making money. Forget school which is a poorly funded mess, I'm gonna follow Cube".

But wait it gets worse. In the late 90's you get Puff Daddy, a guy whose style made rap seem less of a sort of legitimate musical art-form and more like the exploitative moronic business it is today. He added a crucial element: glitz. He made the same violent, misogynistic, anti-intellectual message and packaged it for the masses. Rap was now mainstream and would be around for long time. Suddenly street thugs could afford multi-million dollar watches and jewelry, fleets of exotic cars, and can support dozens of gorgeous scantily women who enjoy having five hundred dollar bottles of champagne poured over their breasts and down their asscrack. What made it worse is that everyone copied that style. To this day almost every rapper imitates Puff Daddy. This is exactly the kind of garbage that some kid in the ghetto does NOT need to see. All it says is that being an uneducated, crude moron is a-ok.

The denigration of women as sexual objects is a particular sore point for me. Young girls now have to deal with boys who expect them to live up to standards of the male created fantasy of the hip-hop chick that always seems to forget to wear pants to the video shoot.

I know personally guys who point to the popularity of rap with white America as proof that it is some sort of legitimate lifestyle. Unfortunately, they forget that historically this is par for the course. White America has always been fascinated with black culture. And besides, an idiot is an idiot regardless of what skin color he has or how much money has to waste. Unfortunately this more recent fascination will have far more dire consequences. The mainstream popularity will mean the music industry will continue to support the same sort of garbage that is corrupting the minds of black youths today.

[Darth Wong]

Very well put, Sergeant. Kudos. I hadn't noticed the connection between Puff Daddy and the onset of the "bling bling" glamour 'n glitz side of rap before.

[Plekhanov]

The denigration of women as sexual objects is a particular sore point for me. Young girls now have to deal with boys who expect them to live up to standards of the male created fantasy of the hip-hop chick that always seems to forget to wear pants to the video shoot.

In stark contrast to rock and pop where the lyrics invariably speak of female empowerment and where partially clothed women never appear in videos

[Clone Sergeant]

The denigration of women as sexual objects is a particular sore point for me. Young girls now have to deal with boys who expect them to live up to standards of the male created fantasy of the hip-hop chick that always seems to forget to wear pants to the video shoot.

In stark contrast to rock and pop where the lyrics invariably speak of female empowerment and where partially clothed women never appear in videos

Very true, but how many rock videos can you point to where there are literally dozens of scantily clad women on screen at the same time? This is one of the defining feature of a rap video. The men have to be vastly outnumbered by the women so that each guy has at the very least two women around him at all times.

[Galvatron]

Do pop songs as frequently refer to women as bitches and hos?

[Einhander Sn0m4n]

The denigration of women as sexual objects is a particular sore point for me. Young girls now have to deal with boys who expect them to live up to standards of the male created fantasy of the hip-hop chick that always seems to forget to wear pants to the video shoot.

In stark contrast to rock and pop where the lyrics invariably speak of female empowerment and where partially clothed women never appear in videos

Very true, but how many rock videos can you point to where there are literally dozens of scantily clad women on screen at the same time? This is one of the defining feature of a rap video. The men have to be vastly outnumbered by the women so that each guy has at the very least two women around him at all times.

I've noticed that if there's a semi-naked woman in a rock or pop video she's either A: the singer, or B: the singer's girlfriend. And in practically all cases the song is about love in some form or another, not exploitation of women.

[Darth Wong]

The denigration of women as sexual objects is a particular sore point for me. Young girls now have to deal with boys who expect them to live up to standards of the male created fantasy of the hip-hop chick that always seems to forget to wear pants to the video shoot.

In stark contrast to rock and pop where the lyrics invariably speak of female empowerment and where partially clothed women never appear in videos

There's a difference between a scantily clad woman walking across the screen in a typical pop music video and a rap "ho" shaking her booty a few inches from the camera in a typical rap video.

[18-Till-I-Die]

Well i like rap. Go figure. In all honesty i think some of this is just lashing out at a more successful branch of Black culture. All this hatred towards rap is senseless, IMO. It isnt Puff Daddy's fault that Blacks in America had to constuct our own culture after being dragged over here and having our native culture obliterated. I'm personally glad to see a seperate culture for Blacks, and i can see some serious flaws in it yes, but it's better than the alternitive, which is to mindlessly assimilate until we walk and talk and act like the drones our ancesstors were bred to become.

And Bill Cosby isnt the best 'avatar' for leading the new 'enlightened' Black people (the ones who shun rap and assimillate quietly and conveniently) since he couldnt find any less assholish way to adress his stance than to scream it out in front of a billion video cameras knowing how it would be seen by the general public. Brilliant.

Look, maybe you're right (probably), but to me, i find some of what he said obnoxiously self-righteous, and especially the very public way he said it extremely stupid. Yeah, people throw the term 'Uncle Tom' around, but it doenst exactly mean a 'house nigger', as some have said; it means a Black person embarised that he's Black who tries to critisize everything other Blacks do and act like he's not Black, which i think fits Cosby prety well, IMO. I might be wrong about him, but i doubt it.

That being said i agree that some changes need to be made, but to assume that sceaming some bullshit in front of a camera will make it happen is retarded, and a grown ass man (like Cosby) should know that. He's not trying to change anything or help anyone or even inspire anyone else to get the ball rolling, he's trying to get on television because everyone figured out he wasnt funny twenty years ago when Leonard Pt 6 came out. I assure you if there hadnt been fifrty million cameras pointing at him, he'd just do some of his schict and go home like always.

And of course he chose some very easy targets, some of which he was right to, others he's just being dense, and he knows it. Whatever is or isnt true or nessecary, his intenton was never to adress the issues in any meaningful way, just to spout his speil and go off stage, assured he'd make the national news, which he did.

Anyway, i'm sorry for the rant, and of course none of this is directed at anyone here, mostly at Cosby and some of the ideas and misconceptions about Black culture.

[18-Till-I-Die]

I'm exagerating the ammount of press coverage a little, of course, being sarcastic. But you get the picture.

[Darth Wong]

Well i like rap. Go figure. In all honesty i think some of this is just lashing out at a more successful branch of Black culture.

No, it's illiterate culture. People who rap about "bitches" and "hos" and prance around covered in jewellery while romanticizing the youth gang lifestyle are morons and assholes.

All this hatred towards rap is senseless, IMO. It isnt Puff Daddy's fault that Blacks in America had to constuct our own culture after being dragged over here and having our native culture obliterated.

Why the fuck does a race need to have a distinct culture? Here's an idea: why don't you just live your individual lives as individual human beings, instead of trying to create some kind of group identification? The whole idea of "black culture" is nothing more than people thinking of blacks as a giant gang, complete with "signs" and special lingo and a different subculture than mainstream society.

I'm personally glad to see a seperate culture for Blacks, and i can see some serious flaws in it yes, but it's better than the alternitive, which is to mindlessly assimilate until we walk and talk and act like the drones our ancesstors were bred to become.

So you figure that all non-blacks in American society are "drones"? All Asians are "drones"? All whites are "drones"? All Indians are "drones"? You don't get it, do you? The only "drones" here are the people who think that their race defines who they are as individual human beings, and "black culture" happens to be their banner.

[Galvatron]

Why the fuck does a race need to have a distinct culture? Here's an idea: why don't you just live your individual lives as individual human beings, instead of trying to create some kind of group identification? The whole idea of "black culture" is nothing more than people thinking of blacks as a giant gang, complete with "signs" and special lingo and a different subculture than mainstream society.

Which scares the shit out of mainstream society and is therefore a large component of the culture of fear in America.

[Darth Wong]

Martin Luther King, Revised and Updated for the 21st century:

I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal ... but blacks are separate and distinct, with their own culture.

I have a dream that one day on the red hills of Georgia the sons of former slaves and the sons of former slave owners will be able to sit down together at the table of brotherhood ... as long as the blacks don't start acting like the whites; brotherhood only goes so far, you know.

I have a dream, that my four little children will one day live in a nation where black women are called "bitches" and "hos", and black men wear "bling-bling" and try to act like pimps or drug dealers. I have a dream today!

[RogueIce]

Why the fuck does a race need to have a distinct culture? Here's an idea: why don't you just live your individual lives as individual human beings, instead of trying to create some kind of group identification? The whole idea of "black culture" is nothing more than people thinking of blacks as a giant gang, complete with "signs" and special lingo and a different subculture than mainstream society.

That's something I've never understood, when I hear someone I know (she happens to be black) being referred to as "really white on the inside" or some such.

What does it mean, exactly, to "be" white?

[Lonestar]

That's something I've never understood, when I hear someone I know (she happens to be black) being referred to as "really white on the inside" or some such.

What does it mean, exactly, to "be" white?

When I lived in SF I had several friends of Chinese descent.

One time a friend of mine made a good friend (later girlfriend) cry when he called her a "Twinkie."

Lonestar: "What the Hell does that mean?"

A: "It means Yellow on the outside, white on the inside."

Which only further confused me, because the guy who said it acted "white" and even anglo-ized his name amoungst his peers ot William (it was really wei-lang)

[Galvatron]

It's the opposite of "stay black, my brotha" or "I'm keepin' it real!" That segment of the black community has an us vs. them mentality. They view white people as the enemy of their "culture," however they define it.

[HemlockGrey]

In stark contrast to rock and pop where the lyrics invariably speak of female empowerment and where partially clothed women never appear in videos

Hey, at least Under My Thumb had a melody.