Axis Kast wrote:I seriously doubt that all 70,000 Estonians mobilized as part of the "regular army" establishment did their service as part of SS units.
You are probably right a little digging came up with a figure of around 15,000 for the eventual strength of the Estonian SS that’s a lot of troops for your source not to mention.
According to
this source a link from Thinkmarble’s post it would seem that most Estonian war criminals belonged to “the Estonian Police”, the “Estonian Political Police” and "the self-defense forces” particularly the irregular "Omakaitse". There were concentration camps in Estonia but they weren’t guarded by the Estonian SS but by the Police (though some Police units were later merged with the SS).
According to this history at least the Estonian SS seems to have been mainly a front line unit though one, which took part in “Punitive raids” something it would seem most units in that part of the war did.
As for the creation of the Estonian national SS Unit, the initiative here belongs to H. Mдe, head of the "Estonian autonomy", who in his speech on August 26, 1942 called for the creation of the Estonian SS legion. In a few days K. Litzman, General Commissar of Estonia, publicized A. Hitler’s decree on the creation of the "Voluntary Estonian SS legion" belonging to the German SS troops, subordinate to SS Reichsfьhrer H.Himmler (РГВА. Ф 451, Оп.7 Д.123. Л.299).
However the formation of the Legion only started on February 8, 1943 and before that the German authorities and local collaborationists conducted the preparations. Meanwhile, a "Society of the Estonian SS Legion’s friends" was established to recruit and give primary training to the volunteers.
All arrangements, recruiting and supply were placed under the jurisdiction of a special created "General inspection of the SS Estonian legion" headed by Gruppenfьhrer J. Soodla. German occupational authorities suggested that the 15% base of the Legion should consist of manpower of the Estonian East Police battalions (Thomas N. Partisan Warfare 1941-1945. Osprey Publ. Ltd. London, 1983, p.19.)
According to the SS Statute, the Estonian SS legion was manned on a voluntary basis, and the volunteers had to meet the SS requirements for health and ideology. Enlisted personnel who already had their officer and petty officers ranks received the corresponding SS ranks after a probation period. The enlisted men were directed to the Debica training center (Poland), where after a 3-month training took an oath to the Nazi Germany. By March 31, 1943, the Legion had 37 officers, 175 noncoms and 62 privates of the "Ostland" special battalion.
The legionnaires trained at Debica formed 3 battalions, later merged into the first Estonian volunteer grenadier SS regiment. In March 1943 after the oath the 1st battalion of the regiment was sent to the front line near Kursk and incorporated into the 5th panzer-grenadier SS division "Viking" under the name of the Estonian volunteer battalion "Narva" (up to the summer 1944) (Панкратов И.А. Битые любимцы фюрера // Военно-исторический журнал. 2003. №4, с.34.)
Given that, following the Stalingrad defeat of fascists in the winter of 1942/1943, the inflow of volunteers to the Estonian SS legion drastically decreased, late March 1943 saw the mobilization of all the former Estonian officers, November 3-10, 1943 saw the mobilization of all those liable for military service born in 1925. As a result of the mobilization activities, by May 1943, the Estonian SS legion had been significantly reinforced, thus allowing to deploy a regiment to the 3rd Estonian volunteer brigade under the command of Standartenfьhrer F. Ausberger. Its formation completed by October 23, 1943, it first operated against partisans in the territory of the BSSR (Thomas N. Partisan Warfare 1941-1945. Osprey Publ. Ltd. London, 1983, p. 21-229), and was subsequently sent to the front, to the region of Nevel and Sebezh.
German command’s archive records of the period reveal that the 3rd Estonian volunteer SS brigade, along with other subunits of the German army, was conducting Heinrich and Fritz punitive operations to wipe out the Soviet partisans in the region of Polotsk-Nevel-Idriza-Sebezh in October-December 1943 (ЦГА Литовской ССР, ф. Р-1399, оп. 1, ед.х.61, личное дело №1950). According to the very same archive, police battalions 288, 286, 313 and other Estonian police battalions, which belonged to the Estonian SS brigade, also took part in the Fritz punitive expedition. They took part in the fight against partisans, shootings of civilians, looting, destruction of the whole villages in Belarus and mass deportation of civilians to Germany (Там же, ф.240, оп. 1 д.7, личное дело 52-55)1. Punitive raids of the 3rd Estonian SS brigade continued until late December 1943222 (ЦА ФСБ Ф.25 Оп. 1. Д. 152. Л.2582).
In early 1944, it was decided to strengthen the Estonian SS troops by incorporating the Wehrmacht battalions and most battle-worthy police units, which would have made it possible to set up a full-fledged division. Ultimately, the two regiments of the Estonian brigade (№№ 45 and 46 grenadier voluntary SS regiments) were joined by a third one (№47), formed on the basis of 658, 659 and 660 Estonian voluntary Wehrmacht battalions. On 24 January 1944, the newly-formed division was named the 20th Estonian voluntary SS division (since May 26, 1944, the 20th grenadier division of the SS troops is the Estonian № 1). In April, the Narva battalion, renamed 20th fusilier SS battalion, was incorporated into it. Additionally, the unit included an artillery regiment and a field engineer battalion, as well as an anti-aircraft company, an anti-tank company and a communications one. The aggregate strength of the division totaled 15 thousand soldiers and officers.
In August 1944, the 20th Estonian SS division was reinforced by the Estonians who previously fled from German mobilization to Finland and formed a separate 200th regiment in the Finish army (1.7 thousand men), which fought against the Soviet troops on the Mannerheim line. Following Finland’s withdrawal from the war against the USSR, the regiment was sent to Estonia and disbanded, its military personnel distributed among the units and sub-units of the division. Estonians also served in the 11th Nordland motorized SS division along with volunteers from the Scandinavian countries.
In September 1944, the 20th SS division took part in the fight against the Red Army units, including the Estonian rifle corps in the region of Rakvere, where it suffered heavy casualties. In September 1944, its remains were sent to the training camp in the German town of Neuhammer, where, in October 1944, the 20th Estonian SS division, consisting of three Estland grenadier SS regiments, was formed anew from the isolated units of the defeated brigade, members of the 13 Estonian police battalions and "Omakaitse" detachments. Until January 1945, units of the division took part in the fighting in the Eastern Prussia. On 13 January 1945, the whole of the division was sent to the front, to the region of the German town of Vittenberg, where, along with other fascist units, it was surrounded by the Red Army units. F. Augsberger, commander of the division, was killed in action, and it was headed by lieutenant colonel A. Rebane.
Fighting its way out, the division broke out from the encirclement and retreated to the territory of Czechoslovakia, where it stayed until the utter crushing defeat of the German fascist troops. On May 11, 1945, near the town of Melnik, not far away from Prague, the bulk of the military personnel was taken prisoner by the Red Army units (Ready J. Lee. The Forgotten Axis. Germany’s Partners and Foreign Volunteers in World War II. Jefferson, North Carolina and London, 1987. p. 491), though some of the Estonian soldiers and officers (including 3 thousand men from the training and reserve regiment of the division) retreated to the West and surrendered to the English-American troops.
You seem particularly concerned about the Estonian Jewish population according to the source I linked to earlier
Immediately after Germany occupied the Estonia's territory mass murders of civilians, especially Russians and Jews began. On October 25, 1941 W. Staheecker, SS-Brigadenfьhrer, reported to R. Heydrich, Head of the RMSO, as follows: "Owing to a comparatively small number of Jews in Estonia it seemed impossible to provoke pogroms... Many Jews of 4 500 ones, who had lived in Estonia in the beginning of the offensive in the East had ran away together with the receding units of the Red Army. About 2 000 of them remained. In Tallin alone about 1 000 Jews lived. Practically, all the male Jews over 16 years were arrested. All of them were executed by the self-defense units controlled by the "Einsatzgruppen 1A" (Мартинсон Э. Слуги свастики. Таллин, 1962., с.74.).
On September 26-29, 1941 the Estonian "self-defense forces" executed 440 detained Jews (474 - according to other data) Hilberg R. Tater, Opfer, Zuschauer. Die Vernichtung der Juden 1933-145. Frankfurt/Main. 1992. s. 115.. The Germans partially transferred the property of those executed to the "self-defense forces".
It would seem these atrocities took place before the formation of the Estonian SS
Something didn’t seem quite right about your posts in this thread Kast and I’ve just realised what it is you seem to have discovered morality.
Axis Kast wrote:CaptainChewbacca wrote: If this was the first celebration, I'd agree with you, but this has happened 11 times in the last 13 years, it seems to me that these guys are the closest the Estonians have to military heroes in recent memory, and they celebrate them.
And it was wrong all eleven of those years. The SS men, moreover, are far from the only Estonian veterans.
In this post for example you describe something as “wrong” by which I assume you mean morally wrong.
And here:
Axis Kast wrote:The way it is being made to sound, Estonians had two choices: join the SS, or succumb to the Soviets. That's ridiculous. The SS was far from the only formation out of Estonia to combat the Red Army.
You seem to be saying that Estonians who chose to join the SS made a choice which was morally wrong. I’m confused though because in the past you’ve repeatedly stated your belief that Real Politick was all that mattered and in matters of statecraft and war morality simply doesn’t enter into the equation.
That being the case why shouldn’t Estonians have joined the SS if they thought that they could to more for their country in that unit than in any other? And why shouldn’t their country then honour the veterans for their service?
