Zambia bans condom distribution to prevent 'immorality'

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2004-03-17 07:46pm

Colonel Olrik wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:A recent study showed that those who pledge abstinence before marriage are just as likely to get STDs as those who have recreational sex, because they are so uninformed about condoms and the like.
? I find that very hard to believe. Linky?

Really, no sex, no need for condoms. The probability the person you marry has AIDS is pratically null.

Note that it said 'pledged abstinence' and not 'were abstinent'. Human nature strikes again.

Post by **AdmiralKanos** » 2004-03-17 07:47pm

Colonel Olrik wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:A recent study showed that those who pledge abstinence before marriage are just as likely to get STDs as those who have recreational sex, because they are so uninformed about condoms and the like.
? I find that very hard to believe. Linky?

Really, no sex, no need for condoms. The probability the person you marry has AIDS is pratically null.

You're assuming that abstinence-pledgers actually live up to their word. They usually don't.

PS. Here's the link for you. DP wasn't making it up.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2004-03-17 07:56pm

Thanks for the link, Wong. I lost it.

Post by **Colonel Olrik** » 2004-03-17 07:57pm

AdmiralKanos wrote:[
You're assuming that abstinence-pledgers actually live up to their word. They usually don't.

PS. Here's the link for you. DP wasn't making it up.

OK, but then they're cheating.

If you actually stay virgin, date a girl for a long time before proposing, and insist to make an AIDS test before marrying.. It's safe no matter how much of a moron the person is, I think. Hell, if I lived in one of those African countries, I'd probably do that. I certainly don't trust condoms with my life in regard to aids.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2004-03-17 08:02pm

Colonel Olrik wrote: Hell, if I lived in one of those African countries, I'd probably do that.

Not if you were born and raised in said African country.

Post by **Colonel Olrik** » 2004-03-17 08:04pm

DPDarkPrimus wrote:
Colonel Olrik wrote: Hell, if I lived in one of those African countries, I'd probably do that.
Not if you were born and raised in said African country.

You never know, I might be one of those 0.1% who actually get an education. Point is, with aids infected numbers around you in the multiple percentual digits, it is not healthy to have one night relations, condom or no condom.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2004-03-17 08:58pm

Colonel Olrik wrote: You never know, I might be one of those 0.1% who actually get an education. Point is, with aids infected numbers around you in the multiple percentual digits, it is not healthy to have one night relations, condom or no condom.

But of course, they don't know that. You would be amazed at how little education most Africans have on the subject, especially considering it is perhaps the greatest health risk ever to them.

HIV is bordering on 50% in certain sub-Saharan African nations, yet a great deal of the people who live there do not have the fundemental knowledge required to reduce the risk of HIV infection.

My mother runs an organization that primarily deals in educating Africans about HIV, and one of the things she repeats over and over is that it is unbelievable how little most of these people know about the disease.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-03-17 09:09pm

It's unbelievable how little they know about any disease. Come on, how many of them know who Pasteur was? How many of them even understand different mechanisms of disease transmission at all? They're living the "simple life", free of the evils of godless science and in harmony with nature and spirituality.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2004-03-17 09:18pm

Darth Wong wrote:It's unbelievable how little they know about any disease. Come on, how many of them know who Pasteur was? How many of them even understand different mechanisms of disease transmission at all? They're living the "simple life", free of the evils of godless science and in harmony with nature and spirituality.

I know that you abhore ignorance Mike, but its not as if the average African is at fault here. The chances of an African in a nation that can barely afford to feed them getting even the most basic education are insignificant. People are trying to change this every day, but the political instability and corruption in the region is unbelievable.

Julhelm · Post by **Julhelm** » 2004-03-18 05:46pm

Actually they are at fault for staying ignorant. If there's the will to study and learn, you'll learn, but clearly they are not willing to learn since they're perfectly happy with living in the stoneage.

It really can't be any coincidence that the first thing they did once they became "free" nations was start civil wars between tribes.

And it must be said that the colonial powers are also at fault for this entire situation since all they did was basically keeping the indigenous population in a controlled state of ignorance so as not to threaten colonial economic interests.

Iceberg · Post by **Iceberg** » 2004-03-18 06:10pm

AdmiralKanos wrote:
Colonel Olrik wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:A recent study showed that those who pledge abstinence before marriage are just as likely to get STDs as those who have recreational sex, because they are so uninformed about condoms and the like.
? I find that very hard to believe. Linky?

Really, no sex, no need for condoms. The probability the person you marry has AIDS is pratically null.
You're assuming that abstinence-pledgers actually live up to their word. They usually don't.

PS. Here's the link for you. DP wasn't making it up.

I pledged abstinence when I was 16, because I was a dorky virgin with no visible chance of sex in the near future. No marriage license, but I'm certainly sexually active.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2004-03-18 06:17pm

The Kernel wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:It's unbelievable how little they know about any disease. Come on, how many of them know who Pasteur was? How many of them even understand different mechanisms of disease transmission at all? They're living the "simple life", free of the evils of godless science and in harmony with nature and spirituality.
I know that you abhore ignorance Mike, but its not as if the average African is at fault here. The chances of an African in a nation that can barely afford to feed them getting even the most basic education are insignificant. People are trying to change this every day, but the political instability and corruption in the region is unbelievable.

Bundle that with a few tinpot dictators, civil wars and the virus from Hell and you have a continent ready to go extinct.

Mayabird · Post by **Mayabird** » 2004-03-18 06:26pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Bundle that with a few tinpot dictators, civil wars and the virus from Hell and you have a continent ready to go extinct.

I dunno. Although several southern African countries are expected to have a population decline between 20-30% in the next couple decades, the overall population of Africa is expected to rise dramatically, from approximately 800 million now to 1.8 billion by 2050 because the birthrate is so high.

The Albino Raven · Post by **The Albino Raven** » 2004-03-18 07:07pm

Actually they are at fault for staying ignorant. If there's the will to study and learn, you'll learn, but clearly they are not willing to learn since they're perfectly happy with living in the stoneage.

Yeah. Cause if I had to choose between working or begging to get food money, or getting an education, I would sure as shit pick an education, food is for suckers.

It really can't be any coincidence that the first thing they did once they became "free" nations was start civil wars between tribes.

Especially considering the fact that ethnic tensions even existed in Europe, the lands that conquered them.

And it must be said that the colonial powers are also at fault for this entire situation since all they did was basically keeping the indigenous population in a controlled state of ignorance so as not to threaten colonial economic interests.

One for three isn't bad. Yes, the colonial powers did this indeed.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2004-03-18 07:26pm

Mayabird wrote:
Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Bundle that with a few tinpot dictators, civil wars and the virus from Hell and you have a continent ready to go extinct.
I dunno. Although several southern African countries are expected to have a population decline between 20-30% in the next couple decades, the overall population of Africa is expected to rise dramatically, from approximately 800 million now to 1.8 billion by 2050 because the birthrate is so high.

Is that taking into account the fact that HIV infection rates are increasing in Africa still and have no signs of slowing down? I'll find the notes I have somewhere, but they show a distinct trend in continental Africa with the number of diagnosed AIDS sufferers going up even with new education and drug support.

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2004-03-18 07:31pm

Mayabird wrote:
Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Bundle that with a few tinpot dictators, civil wars and the virus from Hell and you have a continent ready to go extinct.
I dunno. Although several southern African countries are expected to have a population decline between 20-30% in the next couple decades, the overall population of Africa is expected to rise dramatically, from approximately 800 million now to 1.8 billion by 2050 because the birthrate is so high.

The birtthrate is high, but they're being born with AIDS. The children won't live to breeding age and their mothers will be dead in ten years.

And those that are born healthy are going to starve to death or get killed in a civil war as AIDS decapitates African society--the educated class is badly infected and not that large to begin with.

Mayabird · Post by **Mayabird** » 2004-03-18 07:44pm

It's hard to tell with these statistics whether or not AIDS was factored in, but even in ones I read where it was, Africa's population was still expected to explode. Much of this growth is in countries that don't have a small percentage of the population infected with HIV/AIDS, less than 1% in a few countries and single digits in many. The population of Chad, for instance, is expected to grow by almost 300% by 2050 and it has a low percentage of people infected with AIDS. As I said before, the countries in southern Africa where 25-40% of the population is infected will see massive population declines, but the birthrate in the rest of the continent will keep the total population rising.

Let me do some googling and see what I can find.

Mayabird · Post by **Mayabird** » 2004-03-18 11:18pm

Alright, so I looked up the UN 2002 Population estimates. From their report (These aren't exact quotes since they're rather long and I can't copy them, so I'm paraphrasing):

The total world population in 2050 was previously estimated at around 9.3 billion, but has been lowered to 8.9 billion because of the mortality caused by AIDS.

from pg. eight: Most of the countries heavily effected by AIDS are expected still to increase their populations due to their high fertility levels. However, the seven most effected countries in Africa will have only a tiny combined population increase, and four of them (South Africa, Lethoso, Botswana, and Swaziland) are expected to have a population decrease.

PDF file I got the info from here

Other listings where AIDS was factored in predicts the population of Africa increasing from 800 million now to 1.8 billion by 2050 like I said before. Previous estimates have been higher, 2.1 billion I think.