The 2016 US Election (Part III)

[Flagg]

I would have thought that the success of Obamacare (relatively speaking) might have made further health care reform an easier sell- we passed health care reform and America didn't turn into a dictatorship with death panels, health care costs didn't skyrocket, and it wasn't an abject failure. You'd think that would ease the fears of any fence sitters on the subject of single-payer.

But if not, well, it comes down to turn out. Can we motivate high progressive turnout, and will they also vote for Clinton while they're voting for single-payer?

True, but they're also content with what they have. If the Median voter doesn't feel like there's an issue with their social safety net, they don't like people fucking around with it. This is why any attempts to change social security probably won't get off the ground, at least not without serious political consequences. It's when people start hurting that they push for change. That's why Obama pushed for Obamacare when he did - the healthcare system was in crisis and people were feeling desperate. Now that it's over, the public at large doesn't seem too terribly interested in programs that could be better.

And it seems so. Even without SPH on the ballot, Clinton apparently feels comfortable enough to cancel her ad buys out there for the moment.

So, Donald Trump received his first classified briefing this week, and then this happened:

So either Trump was talking about a nonexistent military base, or he just disseminated classified information about a secret military base. Interesting.

It's fine dude, he's a great candidate with lots of hidden strengths that we can't see and he's going to win the election because hillary sucks.

As long as the trains run on time. Ish.

[Flagg]

Did he ever have any other viable methods to advance his agenda ?

This is kind of the key point, Flagg hates fake Democrats (DINO's) but to run for POTUS, you really have to be part of one of the big two.

I too despise fake democrats, but generally only because they are the ones who are too bloody right wing. Bernie a leftist fake democrat, and thus I dont hate him. I might accuse him of an attempted hostile takeover of the democratic party, but only because that is the actual term for what he was trying to do. I expect the institution to take a negative view of that (which is why the DNC emails dont bother me), but at same time, what he was trying to do was not necessarily wrong. My disputes with him extend to his douchebag hard core of supporters, and some policy differences were I wont budge (I like GMOs and Nuclear Power. These things are non-negotiable because I view them as being indispensable for a long term positive future for humanity). Hillary is mostly similar on other matters (and is more likely to be politically effective in office), thus I chose her.

A lot of this and the utter and blatant hostility and smugness I feel he showed to the leadership and platform of the party he was pretending to want to represent as the nominee. I mean I doubt there is that much daylight between Sanders and Warren on most issues, even ones I disagree with, but she hasn't had a big issue running as and representing the Democrats in Massachusetts.

Sanders (and by that I mean the loudest of his supporters) had this "have my cake and eat it too" attitude. The only thing Sanders has done is caucusing with the Democrats giving them a single seat and vote, but he never got down in the trenches and campaigned with Democrats seeking lower or higher office. But he knew a third party run was impossible so cloaked himself as a Democrat and once he (finally) conceded defeat he goes back to the Senate as what he really is: An Independent. Which is fine, because that's what he's always been. I just despise dishonesty and found what he was doing dishonest.

And that's all I have to say about Bernie Sanders so please don't throw a shit fit.

[Crossroads Inc.]

So I wonder if trump is starting to loose it..
Well, loose it more...
Recently he went off on the aggravating fact that his daughter is friends with Chelsea...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... iends.html

Donald Trump said while his daughter Ivanka is friends with rival Hillary Clinton's daughter, Chelsea, he wishes the pair did not like each other 'because it would be a lot easier.'

During a rally in Colorado on Friday, the Republican nominee was saying how he thought Chelsea did very well during the Democratic convention when he jokingly made the remark.

'I thought Chelsea did a nice job,' he said.

'You know, Chelsea likes Ivanka and Ivanka likes Chelsea. I wish they didn't like each other but they do.

'It's easier if they don't like each other. You would think that relationship would be strained, but they like each other!

'And I thought Chelsea did a nice job last night. I really did. Okay. But Hillary – that's another subject!'

I recommed trying to listen to him saying this if possible, you can almost feel the RAGE dripping from his voice as he almost spits the words "you would THINK that relationship would be strained!"

Since the DNC Trump has been "riled up" several times at what has been said up about him... Yesterday he was quoted as saying "the gloves are now coming off!"
Which should give one pause to what that implies...

[Flagg]

He had gloves on? What is he going to start telling dead baby jokes?

[maraxus2]

So I wonder if trump is starting to loose it..
Well, loose it more...
Recently he went off on the aggravating fact that his daughter is friends with Chelsea...

I recommed trying to listen to him saying this if possible, you can almost feel the RAGE dripping from his voice as he almost spits the words "you would THINK that relationship would be strained!"

Since the DNC Trump has been "riled up" several times at what has been said up about him... Yesterday he was quoted as saying "the gloves are now coming off!"
Which should give one pause to what that implies...

This is not the first time that a DudeBro GOPer stepped on his own dick as far as phrasing goes.

I feel like the campaign hides his phone every three or four days, and he just goes apeshit whenever he finds it again. Shit like the lines above are not the mark of a stable man or a quality campaign.

[General Zod]

Snopes covered the claim that Trump leaked classified info. It's false.

[Flagg]

What was it Clinton said, "You don't want a guy riled up by Twitter posts to be put in charge of the nuclear arsenal!"? They'd be safer with me, which should send a chill down your spine as Texas and Florida would become glowing rubble.

[Flagg]

This is not the first time that a DudeBro GOPer stepped on his own dick as far as phrasing goes.

Good old Governor Pumpkin Head. That's what we called him in FL, anyway. Public passes light rail amendment twice and the dumbass gets caught on tape saying he has "a scheme" (his exact words ) to override it by putting forth an amendment written so awkwardly in legalese that voting "yes" seemed like it was for light rail but was actually a vote to repeal it. It worked, too. But you know, Floriduh.

[Dominus Atheos]

Another fun conspiracy theory: Did Melania Trump commit immigration fraud by lying about her college degree in order to get approval from INS?

For those who haven't heard, Melania Trump probably lied on her own website that she had a college degree:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /87665500/

Melania Trump's website deleted after questions raised about her degree

Snopes also has a page where it says her having or not having a college degree is "UNPROVEN", but they still shit all over the claim that she has one:

http://www.snopes.com/melania-trump-arc ... re-degree/

CBS News, which previously had published the claim that Melania Trump had received her degree, looked deeper into into it after her appearance at the Republican National Convention:

Melania Trump didn't receive a college degree in design and architecture at the university in Ljubljana, Slovenia, which her biography in the Republican National Convention program claims she had obtained.

CBS News has checked the official public records of the university, and Melania Trump is not listed as having graduated from there with a degree.

We also checked the Ljubljana University archives for any records of Melania Knauss, Melanija Knavs, and every other combination and alternate spellings of those names that we could find, and were unable to locate a record of her at that university, nor at any other university in the country.

Which raises the question "Why the fuck would anyone lie about having a degree in architecture from Ljubljana University?

One possible answer is that doing so helped her gain admittance to the US when otherwise her application would have been denied.

I don't really care about Melania Trump and I doubt that anyone else on SDN does either, but I like irony and and the idea that Trumps wife is/was an illegal immigrant makes me lol.

[Flagg]

Another fun conspiracy theory: Did Melania Trump commit immigration fraud by lying about her college degree in order to get approval from INS?

For those who haven't heard, Melania Trump probably lied on her own website that she had a college degree:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... /87665500/

Melania Trump's website deleted after questions raised about her degree

Snopes also has a page where it says her having or not having a college degree is "UNPROVEN", but they still shit all over the claim that she has one:

http://www.snopes.com/melania-trump-arc ... re-degree/

CBS News, which previously had published the claim that Melania Trump had received her degree, looked deeper into into it after her appearance at the Republican National Convention:

Melania Trump didn't receive a college degree in design and architecture at the university in Ljubljana, Slovenia, which her biography in the Republican National Convention program claims she had obtained.

CBS News has checked the official public records of the university, and Melania Trump is not listed as having graduated from there with a degree.

We also checked the Ljubljana University archives for any records of Melania Knauss, Melanija Knavs, and every other combination and alternate spellings of those names that we could find, and were unable to locate a record of her at that university, nor at any other university in the country.

Which raises the question "Why the fuck would anyone lie about having a degree in architecture from Ljubljana University?

One possible answer is that doing so helped her gain admittance to the US when otherwise her application would have been denied.

I don't really care about Melania Trump and I doubt that anyone else on SDN does either, but I like irony and and the idea that Trumps wife is/was an illegal immigrant makes me lol.

Yeah, but she had coitous with that walking mound of Mussoliniesque Play-Doh and that's enough for me to relegate this matter to sideshow status and not question her citizenship.

[maraxus2]

This is not the first time that a DudeBro GOPer stepped on his own dick as far as phrasing goes.

Good old Governor Pumpkin Head. That's what we called him in FL, anyway. Public passes light rail amendment twice and the dumbass gets caught on tape saying he has "a scheme" (his exact words ) to override it by putting forth an amendment written so awkwardly in legalese that voting "yes" seemed like it was for light rail but was actually a vote to repeal it. It worked, too. But you know, Floriduh.

I miss GOB Bush. Part of me wishes that he'd won the primary purely to keep Trumpism from being a thing. Then another part of me thinks it's great that he didn't, because he'd probably be tougher to beat than Trump. Then a third part of me thinks the second part is dumb since Jeb(!) could fuck up a cup of coffee much less a national campaign.

[Flagg]

This is not the first time that a DudeBro GOPer stepped on his own dick as far as phrasing goes.

Good old Governor Pumpkin Head. That's what we called him in FL, anyway. Public passes light rail amendment twice and the dumbass gets caught on tape saying he has "a scheme" (his exact words ) to override it by putting forth an amendment written so awkwardly in legalese that voting "yes" seemed like it was for light rail but was actually a vote to repeal it. It worked, too. But you know, Floriduh.

I miss GOB Bush. Part of me wishes that he'd won the primary purely to keep Trumpism from being a thing. Then another part of me thinks it's great that he didn't, because he'd probably be tougher to beat than Trump. Then a third part of me thinks the second part is dumb since Jeb(!) could fuck up a cup of coffee much less a national campaign.

They say Jeb is the smart one, though. Then again he doesn't have any brothers as governors of swing states to help him steal an election.

[Terralthra]

Mea culpa regarding the Trump/Saudi Arabia base thing. According to Snopes, he hasn't even gotten his first briefing, so it can't possibly be a classified information thing. My bad.

[maraxus2]

They say Jeb is the smart one, though. Then again he doesn't have any brothers as governors of swing states to help him steal an election.

Yeah, that didn't help. Worse, he had Rick Scott in Florida, probably the only significant statewide politician to really embrace Trump.

I understand that Dubya was always a lot sharper than people gave him credit for, especially when it comes to the non-intellectual parts of governing. He's always been a good campaigner; certainly much better than Gob. Fortunately, being Governor of Texas doesn't require much in the way of intellectual sharpness since the Lt. Gov and Speaker carry a lot of the weight. Unfortunately, that doesn't really translate well when you're running the Feds.

[Adam Reynolds]

Yeah, that didn't help. Worse, he had Rick Scott in Florida, probably the only significant statewide politician to really embrace Trump.

I understand that Dubya was always a lot sharper than people gave him credit for, especially when it comes to the non-intellectual parts of governing. He's always been a good campaigner; certainly much better than Gob. Fortunately, being Governor of Texas doesn't require much in the way of intellectual sharpness since the Lt. Gov and Speaker carry a lot of the weight. Unfortunately, that doesn't really translate well when you're running the Feds.

It did when that VP was Dick Cheney. As well as the fact that a President can delegate, which is something Bush definitely did, getting people like Colin Powell to work for him.

[Flagg]

Yeah, that didn't help. Worse, he had Rick Scott in Florida, probably the only significant statewide politician to really embrace Trump.

I understand that Dubya was always a lot sharper than people gave him credit for, especially when it comes to the non-intellectual parts of governing. He's always been a good campaigner; certainly much better than Gob. Fortunately, being Governor of Texas doesn't require much in the way of intellectual sharpness since the Lt. Gov and Speaker carry a lot of the weight. Unfortunately, that doesn't really translate well when you're running the Feds.

It did when that VP was Dick Cheney. As well as the fact that a President can delegate, which is something Bush definitely did, getting people like Colin Powell to lie for him.

Fixed.

[cosmicalstorm]

Is it just anti-HRC propaganda or would she seriously consider bombing Assad in Syria? I don't see that ending well. But then again, maybe this is propaganda or some kind of pro-war wishful thinking.

Bolding is mine, this is a quote and not the full article.

Shaping the Debate

It is highly unusual, if not unprecedented, for figures known to be close to a presidential candidate to make public recommendations for new and broader war abroad. The fact that such explicit plans for military strikes against the Assad regime were aired so openly soon after Clinton had clinched the Democratic nomination suggests that Clinton had encouraged Flournoy and Panetta to do so.
Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton. (Photo by Lorie Shaull, Wikipedia)

Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton. (Photo by Lorie Shaull, Wikipedia)

The rationale for doing so is evidently not to strengthen her public support at home but to shape the policy decisions made by the Obama administration and the coalition of external supporters of the armed opposition to Assad.

Obama’s refusal to threaten to use military force on behalf of the anti-Assad forces or to step up military assistance to them has provoked a series of leaks to the news media by unnamed officials – primarily from the Defense Department – criticizing Obama’s willingness to cooperate with Russia in seeking a Syrian ceasefire and political settlement as “naïve.”

The news of Clinton’s advisers calling openly for military measures signals to those critics in the administration to continue to push for a more aggressive policy on the premise that she will do just that as president.

Even more important to Clinton and close associates, however, is the hope of encouraging Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar, which have been supporting the armed opposition to Assad, to persist in and even intensify their efforts in the face of the prospect of U.S.-Russian cooperation in Syria.

Even before the recommendations were revealed, specialists on Syria in Washington think tanks were already observing signs that Saudi and Qatari policymakers were waiting for the Obama administration to end in the hope that Clinton would be elected and take a more activist role in the war against Assad.

The new Prime Minister of Turkey, Binali Yildirim, however, made a statement on July 13 suggesting that Turkish President Recep Yayyip Erdogan may be considering a deal with Russia and the Assad regime at the expense of both Syrian Kurds and the anti-Assad opposition.

That certainly would have alarmed Clinton’s advisers, and four days later, Panetta made his comments on network television about what “the next president” would have to do in Syria.

https://consortiumnews.com/2016/07/29/h ... her-hawks/

[Crossroads Inc.]

I'm guessing Propaganda, mostly because Cannot see how being "tough" at this point is going to help her at all.
After all 'The Donald' has already said HE will 'get tough' with Syria. Of course he hasn't lead out any actual plans...

Speaking of Da Don...
Apparently the DNC is uncharge of the Presidential elections and is TOTALLY rigging the schedule to RUIN! Trump.

Just last night I posted a diary which included a poll asking what how people thought the Debates between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump will play out. I included 7 different options.

The very last option I included...which ended up receiving a whopping 58% of the votes...was this:

Trump chickens out of showing up at all, blaming the media/the moderator/the host network for "not treating him fairly"
Well, less than 24 hours later, guess what?


TWITTER POST:
As usual, Hillary & the Dems are trying to rig the debates so 2 are up against major NFL games. Same as last time w/ Bernie. Unacceptable!
BOOM.

Wow...I figured there was a good chance of him weaseling out of the debates, but I didn’t think he would start the process the very first day of the general election!

In fact, I actually figured he’d go ahead and willingly participate in the first one (September 26th), and would only squirm out of the second and third ones after getting his ass thoroughly handed to him in Round 1.

From the looks of it, he has no intention of even showing that much backbone.

Stay tuned...

So yeah... maybe THIS is what he mean by "The gloves are coming off"
He's just reaching for a whole new level of crazy.

[Ace Pace]

Remember at no point does he need the debates. No one in the internet "you" run with is his target audience. The people who read policy proposals are not his audience, etc. etc.

[Mr Bean]

Remember at no point does he need the debates. No one in the internet "you" run with is his target audience. The people who read policy proposals are not his audience, etc. etc.

I would say he needs the debates because he semi-immunity from scandal and need for the headlines demands that Trump and Hillary in the same place at the same time in front of a national audience can only benefit Trump given his ability to ignore the things that come out of his mouth and still maintain poll numbers. Every gain in the polls seems to be more Hillary's loss than his gain.

[The Romulan Republic]

Remember at no point does he need the debates. No one in the internet "you" run with is his target audience. The people who read policy proposals are not his audience, etc. etc.

I would say he needs the debates because he semi-immunity from scandal and need for the headlines demands that Trump and Hillary in the same place at the same time in front of a national audience can only benefit Trump given his ability to ignore the things that come out of his mouth and still maintain poll numbers. Every gain in the polls seems to be more Hillary's loss than his gain.

I don't know about that. His devoted followers won't care how badly he handles the debates, or weather he does them at all for that matter, but there are really only two possible outcomes to the debates-

1. He tries to actually debate Clinton on policy and gets utterly thrashed.

2. He spends the whole time just yelling insults at Clinton, in which case we get another example, in front of a major audience, of what an asshole he is.

His supporters won't care, but it might help cement turnout from any opponents who have misgivings about voting for Clinton, and maybe sway a few more moderate Republicans who find Trump hard to stomach in the name of party loyalty. The debates get a fairly large audience, and unlike most of the major events he's had thus far, it won't necessarily be composed primarily of Republicans.

[Mr Bean]

His supporters won't care, but it might help cement turnout from any opponents who have misgivings about voting for Clinton,

Do you honestly believe there are there are any such people left who seeing Trump insult Clinton on national TV will be the thing that finally convenience them that THIS is the thing that gives Clinton a chance and not vote for Trump?

If it's one of Trump's strengths is crafting memorable insults that stick with his opponent. His goal in the debate is to deflect everything Clinton says with empty words while bringing up every flaw that he can find to magnify Clinton's negatives beyond his. He can't make people like him beyond his hard core adhernents but he can make them despise Clinton more than him.

But if this early posturing is anything to indicate he does not believe he'd do well on the same stage as Clinton OR alternatively he's just doing the same tricks from the GOP primary in an attend to move the debates into something even more prime time.

[Flagg]

I'm guessing Propaganda, mostly because Cannot see how being "tough" at this point is going to help her at all.
After all 'The Donald' has already said HE will 'get tough' with Syria. Of course he hasn't lead out any actual plans...

Speaking of Da Don...
Apparently the DNC is uncharge of the Presidential elections and is TOTALLY rigging the schedule to RUIN! Trump.

Just last night I posted a diary which included a poll asking what how people thought the Debates between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump will play out. I included 7 different options.

The very last option I included...which ended up receiving a whopping 58% of the votes...was this:

Trump chickens out of showing up at all, blaming the media/the moderator/the host network for "not treating him fairly"
Well, less than 24 hours later, guess what?


TWITTER POST:
As usual, Hillary & the Dems are trying to rig the debates so 2 are up against major NFL games. Same as last time w/ Bernie. Unacceptable!
BOOM.

Wow...I figured there was a good chance of him weaseling out of the debates, but I didn’t think he would start the process the very first day of the general election!

In fact, I actually figured he’d go ahead and willingly participate in the first one (September 26th), and would only squirm out of the second and third ones after getting his ass thoroughly handed to him in Round 1.

From the looks of it, he has no intention of even showing that much backbone.

Stay tuned...

So yeah... maybe THIS is what he mean by "The gloves are coming off"
He's just reaching for a whole new level of crazy.

I stopped giving that article credibility at the enlarged, underlined, and bolded portion. Good theory though. Except Mini-Mussolini won't chicken out to a woman. What will da fella's think?

[maraxus2]

Remember at no point does he need the debates. No one in the internet "you" run with is his target audience. The people who read policy proposals are not his audience, etc. etc.

I hear this sort of thing a lot. Trump cannot win with just his supporters and general Republican votes. He needs to peel voters off of the Obama coalition in order to win. He isn't likely to do that by doing things like skipping the debates.

Do you honestly believe there are there are any such people left who seeing Trump insult Clinton on national TV will be the thing that finally convenience them that THIS is the thing that gives Clinton a chance and not vote for Trump?

If it's one of Trump's strengths is crafting memorable insults that stick with his opponent. His goal in the debate is to deflect everything Clinton says with empty words while bringing up every flaw that he can find to magnify Clinton's negatives beyond his. He can't make people like him beyond his hard core adhernents but he can make them despise Clinton more than him.

But if this early posturing is anything to indicate he does not believe he'd do well on the same stage as Clinton OR alternatively he's just doing the same tricks from the GOP primary in an attend to move the debates into something even more prime time.

Or he could look like an imbecile on stage. Especially since this is the general electorate, not the dumbass Republican primary voters.

I'd argue Clinton's the one who doesn't really need these debates, and I think Trump knows it. She's extremely well-known among the electorate and is already well-defined, for good or for ill. If Trump backs out, they can use his toxic masculinity against him. If Trump takes the bait, there is an extremely high likelihood that he says something that makes him look profoundly stupid, especially since this sort of thing is right in Clinton's wheelhouse.

[The Romulan Republic]

Oh yeah, Clinton can handle debates just fine. Even as a Sanders supporter, I always felt that she was the stronger campaigner in the debate format.