Iran fined $2.65 billion for terrorism

[Wanderer]

And How Are They Going To Collect

By MATT APUZZO, Associated Press Writer 1 hour, 22 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - Iran must pay $2.65 billion to the families of the 241 U.S. service members killed in the 1983 bombing of the U.S. Marine barracks in Beirut, a federal judge declared Friday in a ruling that left survivors and families shedding tears of joy.

U.S. District Judge Royce C. Lamberth described his ruling as the largest-ever such judgment by an American court against another country. "These individuals, whose hearts and souls were forever broken, waited patiently for nearly a quarter century for justice to be done," he said.

Iran has been blamed for supporting the militant group Hezbollah, which carried out the suicide bombing in Beirut. It was the worst terrorist act against U.S. targets until the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks.

Hundreds of people crowded into a federal courtroom to hear Friday's ruling. Parents have grown old since their children were killed. Siblings have grown into middle-age. Children have married and started families of their own.

Weeping spectators stood and erupted in applause and hugs as Lamberth left the bench.

The ruling allows nearly 1,000 family members and a handful of survivors to try to collect Iranian assets from various sources around the world. Finding and seizing that money will be difficult, however, and the families are backing a law in Congress that would make it easier for terrorism victims and their families to do so.

Families were encouraged by Libya's decision to ultimately accept responsibility for the 1988 bombing of a Pan Am flight over Scotland. The country, once a pariah by Washington's view, agreed to compensate the families of the 270 victims. Part of the $2.7 billion has been paid. A final $2 million installment to each family is outstanding.

"This is a sense of victory, of winning a battle," said Paul Rivers, who was a 20-year-old enlisted Marine on the second floor of the barracks when it exploded. "When we win the war is when we collect, when we make them pay for what they did."

Iran has denied responsibility for the attack. The nation did not respond to the 6-year-old lawsuit and was represented only by an empty table.

Family members said they hoped Friday's ruling would pressure foreign governments not to sponsor terrorism. Lynn Smith Derbyshire, whose brother, Vincent Smith, was killed in the attack, said countries won't stop until "it begins to actually cost them money to kill Americans."

Some disagreed about whether that will happen. Roxanne Garcia-Bates, who was 16 when her brother, Randy Garcia, was killed, said she was surprised to find a sense of comfort being with the other families in court. She said she was pleased that Lamberth had made such a strong statement, but doubted that Iran would change anytime soon.

"You can't take enough money away to get them to stop what they're doing," she said.

All agreed that emotions remain raw to this day.

Rivers described being one of the second floor's five survivors. All but him lost arms or legs, he said. He was buried in the rubble for two hours, he said. Debris had punctured his eardrum and "I literally had rocks inside my head."

Shirley Murry of Baltimore, who was 16 years old at the time, described the tense days of waiting around the television for word of her brother, Ulysses Parker. Today, every time the news carries a story about a fallen soldier or an explosion overseas, she said it's like that first day all over again.

Lamberth said the law "offers a meager attempt to make the surviving members whole." He said he hoped the judgment would alert Iran that terrorism has consequences and help in the families' healing process. Pausing, he added:

"That's all I can do."

[NecronLord]

The United States of America and its NATO allies are hereby fined $5.5 billion for the estimated minimum of 500 civillians¹ killed in its attacks on Serbia. Monies to be recouped from seizure of assets immediately.

I'll grant that it's not entirely analogous, but the same point could be made about CIA inspired coups and dictatorships in Latin America or attacks by, say, the KLA. The United States is hardly innocent compared to the bad and scary Iran. Needless to say, the Iranians (and Lebanese) responsible deserve punishment, but they're hardly the only ones.

¹Source: Human Rights Watch.

[Starglider]

What's next, Iran suing the US for its support of Iraq in the Iran-Iraq war? The UN did declare Iraq to be fully responsible for it in 1991, and the presence of large scale US support to Iraq throughout the 80s is pretty well proven (and seemingly conveniently forgotten by Republicans these days, to an even greater extent than CIA funding of the Taliban).

[CJvR]

Uh?

Why are a national civilian court swiming around in international and military waters? You would neet to take this to Haag or the UN and even then you would have to face the fact that international justice is still determined by who has the guns and the will to use them.

[Vympel]

Idiocy. In Australian courts, and I assume most other courts of developed nations, this would've been thrown out for pretty blatant lack of jurisdiction.

The ruling allows nearly 1,000 family members and a handful of survivors to try to collect Iranian assets from various sources around the world.

It'd be a very short try. Every country they'd try it in would tell them to go stuff it on principle, as they won't really understand what some District Judge in the USA has to do with them.

[Chris OFarrell]

Yeah I have a feeling even strong US supporters court systems will throw any claims made against offshore Iranian assets out the window VERY fast. What a fucking stupid ruling.

[Starglider]

Yeah I have a feeling even strong US supporters court systems will throw any claims made against offshore Iranian assets out the window VERY fast. What a fucking stupid ruling.

Ah, but this is a great ruling for Faux News, in furthering their portrayal of Iran as a 'rouge state that believes itself above the law'. The fact that the law in question is a unilateral US ruling rather than any sort of international judgement and the fact that the US is quite willing to ignore similar rulings it doesn't agree with will be quietly ignored.

Congratulations US conservatives, you've actually succeeded in making me argue the side of the genocidal nutcase islamofascists.

[MKSheppard]

Yeah I have a feeling even strong US supporters court systems will throw any claims made against offshore Iranian assets out the window VERY fast. What a fucking stupid ruling.

IIRC, there are still some Iranian assets in the US which can be seized to pay for this.

[CJvR]

a 'rouge state that believes itself above the law'.

All nations are above the law, that is sort of implied in national soverignty.

[Starglider]

a 'rouge state that believes itself above the law'

Damn those rouge states. Monopolising global supplies of valuable pigments.

All nations are above the law, that is sort of implied in national soverignty.

You'll never be an anchor on Fox News with such a slavish devotion to so-called 'facts'. Reality has a well-known liberal bias, remember?

The US heading a multinational alliance of industrialised powers to jointly to invade a middle eastern country is exactly equivalent to an old west sherrif rounding up a posse to take down a dangerous outlaw. Don't let those blathering so-called experts confuse you with their claims that it's more complex than that. They're just trying to pull the wool over your eyes so they can execute their evil liberal agenda

[MKSheppard]

You'll never be an anchor on Fox News with such a slavish devotion to so-called 'facts'. Reality has a well-known liberal bias, remember?

If I was an anchor on fox news, it would read like something out of Dr Strangelove; with heavy emphasis towards massive retalitation as the solution for most of our problems.

[brianeyci]

As long as judges are doing this, they might as well throw out the excuse that the CPA isn't the same as the United States and give all those tortured whistleblowers justice.

No? Guess it only matters when it's not Americans footing the bill.

[Wanderer]

You'll never be an anchor on Fox News with such a slavish devotion to so-called 'facts'. Reality has a well-known liberal bias, remember?

If I was an anchor on fox news, it would read like something out of Dr Strangelove; with heavy emphasis towards massive retalitation as the solution for most of our problems.

Hate to disappoint you Shep, but riding a Bomb like a Cowboy would be censored as too sexual for Fox viewers.

[Admiral Valdemar]

You're talking about a nation that passed a law making it illegal for OPEC to not pump as much oil as they need in the future.

The sheer idiocy boggles the mind. US law now applies across borders, it seems.

[NecronLord]

Isn't it the job of the military to pay recompense to the families of people killed in uniform? When did it become the enemy's job, anyway?

[Vympel]

You're talking about a nation that passed a law making it illegal for OPEC to not pump as much oil as they need in the future.

Say what?

Elaborate, please!

[The Grim Squeaker]

Isn't it the job of the military to pay recompense to the families of people killed in uniform? When did it become the enemy's job, anyway?

Officially or unofficially?
Unoficially around the time conquering and looting became popular.
Officially, about a day after the unofficial version, with it being dandy'd up after Napoleon to it's climax in WW1 (Versailles)

[Admiral Valdemar]

You're talking about a nation that passed a law making it illegal for OPEC to not pump as much oil as they need in the future.

Say what?

Elaborate, please!

You can't spell "NOPEC" without OPEC.

Apparently the laws of geology and the well-being of the oil producing nations' people are not enough of a barrier to the water cooler tyrants in Washington.

[Beowulf]

US law applies on US military installations. Host nation laws also usually apply on US military installations. Thus, it's not a stretch for a US court to apply this ruling. In any case, some nations have claimed they can prosecute certain crimes regardless of where they occur (universal jurisdiction).

[Admiral Valdemar]

US law applies on US military installations. Host nation laws also usually apply on US military installations. Thus, it's not a stretch for a US court to apply this ruling. In any case, some nations have claimed they can prosecute certain crimes regardless of where they occur (universal jurisdiction).

Just as it does with embassies, because it is sovereign soil. This is nothing like the same, whereby the US Govt. is essentially telling the oil producers they can be dealt with if they feel there is price gouging (we'll leave aside the little fact that this is not why prices shot from $12 a barrel to nearly $80 in a decade). In short, the US believes it can impose its law on independent bodies that have no link to the American people whatsoever, other than they use a product OPEC sells.

It's like threatening to sue a supermarket if you feel you're not getting a deal you like, only here the only course of action is the US using force. Let me know how Saudi and Kuwait go after you've finished with Iraq.

[Xisiqomelir]

Okay Royce C. Lamberth, whatever you say.

[Durandal]

God damn activist judges.

[Beowulf]

US law applies on US military installations. Host nation laws also usually apply on US military installations. Thus, it's not a stretch for a US court to apply this ruling. In any case, some nations have claimed they can prosecute certain crimes regardless of where they occur (universal jurisdiction).

Just as it does with embassies, because it is sovereign soil. This is nothing like the same, whereby the US Govt. is essentially telling the oil producers they can be dealt with if they feel there is price gouging (we'll leave aside the little fact that this is not why prices shot from $12 a barrel to nearly $80 in a decade). In short, the US believes it can impose its law on independent bodies that have no link to the American people whatsoever, other than they use a product OPEC sells.

It's like threatening to sue a supermarket if you feel you're not getting a deal you like, only here the only course of action is the US using force. Let me know how Saudi and Kuwait go after you've finished with Iraq.

And here I was thinking I was addressing the original topic of the thread.

[Pelranius]

Honestly, how much does it cost to try cases like this?

[Admiral Valdemar]

And here I was thinking I was addressing the original topic of the thread.

Which is the same topic as the one related to fining OPEC: The US' delusion of total power.