Dubya and Dracula

[Einhander Sn0m4n]

The Creepy Similarities Between George W. Bush and Vlad the Impaler

By MARC MCDONALD

They were both petulant, arrogant, and convinced that they were doing God's work. They were both out-of-control, power-mad leaders. As youngsters, they both enjoyed torturing small animals. Both spent their ruling years engaged in horrific wars against Islamic nations. And despite their cruel, bloodthirsty and savage ways, both have fanatical supporters who defend their actions to this day.

Who am I talking about?

George W. Bush and Vlad The Impaler.

Vlad, who is believed to have served as the inspiration for Bram Stoker's Dracula novel was, in real life, a 15th century prince of the East European state of Wallachia (now part of Romania).

Like Bush, Vlad was born into a background of wealth, power and privilege. Like Bush's dad, Vlad's father, Vlad II Dracul, was a head of state, as well. Both father and son spent their reigns engaged in bloody wars against Muslim nations (the Ottoman Empire, in the case of Vlad).

Even as youngsters, George W. Bush and Vlad The Impaler had creepy similarities in their lives. Both shared an enthusiasm for torturing small animals.

The 1990 book, Dracula, Prince of Many Faces: His Life and His Times points out that as a youngster, Vlad amused himself by torturing and mutilating small animals:

"...he could not cure himself of the evil habit of catching mice and having birds bought at the marketplace, so that he could punish them by impalement."

As The New York Times reported, in a May 21, 2000 article, George W. Bush also enjoyed torturing small animals as a youngster. "We were terrible to animals," Bush childhood friend Terry Throckmorton was quoted as saying. Throckmorton described how Bush and his friends treated frogs they found on the Bush family estate.

"Everybody would get BB guns and shoot them," Throckmorton said. "Or we'd put firecrackers in the frogs and throw them and blow them up."

The life stories of George W. Bush and Vlad The Impaler share other similarities. Taking a look at their time in power, one can't help but notice the eerie similarities in both rulers' bloody, savage wars against Muslim nations.

The atrocities that occurred in Vlad The Impaler's military campaigns against the Muslim nations are well documented. Reading about these atrocities, one can't help but be reminded of the various horrors of Bush's war in Iraq, including the Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse case, as well as the use of flesh-melting white phosphorous chemical weapons against the population of Fallujah.

Both Bush and Vlad, of course, were advocates of torture during their time in power. Bush enthusiastically embraced waterboarding. And Vlad, of course, was a big fan of the torture technique that gave him his nickname ("The Impaler").

Another similarity is that Bush and Vlad were both famous as tough, law-and-order rulers (as long as those accused of breaking the law weren't wealthy cronies). In Vlad's time, the peasants were so frightened of breaking the law, that it is said that one could leave a bag of gold on the street and return to find it untouched the next day.

Of course, "law and order" has long been one of Bush's favorite campaign themes, dating back to his time as Texas governor. In Bush's five years as governor, Texas executed 152 prisoners, by far the highest total for any state and more than any other governor in modern American history.

One final notable similarity between George W. Bush and Vlad The Impaler is how both men have fanatical followers who continue to passionately defend their legacies to this day.

While Vlad is recognized in the West as a bloodthirsty monster and tyrant, many people in Romania regard Vlad as a national hero to this day. As Dracula, Prince of Many Faces points out, oral Romanian folklore made Vlad "a national hero, a kind of George Washington of Romanian history."

Compare that to today's worship of Bush by the nutcase right-wing fringe. From Fox News to hatewing radio to the right-wing blogosphere, Bush has a fanatical following that throws a temper tantrum any time someone dares to criticize their beloved hero.

[Mr. T]

IIRC John Kerry was also related to Vlad the Impaler. It's funny how the super-wealthy are often related to eachother. Class structures must be more rigid then most people think.

Although maybe this dude was just really good with "spreading his seed", kindof like how many people in Asia are related to Genghis Khan.

[Winston Blake]

The atrocities that occurred in Vlad The Impaler's military campaigns against the Muslim nations are well documented. Reading about these atrocities, one can't help but be reminded of the various horrors of Bush's war in Iraq, including the Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse case, as well as the use of flesh-melting white phosphorous chemical weapons against the population of Fallujah.

This is a pretty weak comparison. Vlad the Impaler did truly horrendous stuff, and lots of it.

Impalement was Ţepeş's preferred method of torture and execution. His method of torture was a horse attached to each of the victim's legs as a sharpened stake was gradually forced into the body. The end of the stake was usually oiled, and care was taken that the stake not be too sharp; else the victim might die too rapidly from shock. Normally the stake was inserted into the body through the anus and was often forced through the body until it emerged from the mouth. However, there were many instances where victims were impaled through other bodily orifices or through the abdomen or chest. Infants were sometimes impaled on the stake forced through their mother's chests. The records indicate that victims were sometimes impaled so that they hung upside down on the stake.[6]

As expected, death by impalement was slow and painful. Victims sometimes endured for hours or days. Vlad often had the stakes arranged in various geometric patterns. The most common pattern was a ring of concentric circles in the outskirts of a city that constituted his target. The height of the spear indicated the rank of the victim. The corpses were often left decaying for months.

WP is a 'flesh-melting' chemical weapon? Give us a break.

[Patrick Degan]

C'mon, the comparisons of Chimpus Caesar to Vlad Tepes the Dracula are most unfair —to Vlad. For a start, Vlad was a competent bloodthirsty tyrant and actually won most of his wars.

I also think that, come twenty years from now, nobody is even going to remember who George W. Bush was.

[Johonebesus]

I also think that, come twenty years from now, nobody is even going to remember who George W. Bush was.

They damned well better. If Harding and Nixon went down in history, Shrubby has to.

[Patrick Degan]

I also think that, come twenty years from now, nobody is even going to remember who George W. Bush was.

They damned well better. If Harding and Nixon went down in history, Shrubby has to.

Please. Knowing the state of public education in this country, do you really imagine that if you mentioned either Nixon or Harding to your usual high-school age McDonald's minimum-wage flunky, you'd get any response other than "who"?

[Illuminatus Primus]

Yeah, your basis of comparison however was Vlad Tepes; many partially educated people are familiar with Nixon or even Harding, but not Harding.

[Patrick Degan]

Yeah, your basis of comparison however was Vlad Tepes; many partially educated people are familiar with Nixon or even Harding, but not Harding.

Most Americans of the last two generations don't even know what Watergate was or know who Nixon ever was, never mind Harding. Give it twenty years and the public memory of Bush will be in about the same state.

[FTeik]

The comparison is also flawed, because Vlad was actually defending his country against an expansionist Ottoman Empire. As for the horrible things he did I'm certain he was no different than any other warlord of his time, he just got bad PR.

Just like Nero, Attila the Hun and the Vikings.

[Sarevok]

Yeah, your basis of comparison however was Vlad Tepes; many partially educated people are familiar with Nixon or even Harding, but not Harding.

Most Americans of the last two generations don't even know what Watergate was or know who Nixon ever was, never mind Harding. Give it twenty years and the public memory of Bush will be in about the same state.

Really ? That's a huge surprise. Watergate is right there besides Nazi comparison on the evil-o-meter when used to exaggerate an event. Anyone who bothers to read a newspaper must have come across the term. At the very least is not Watergate on the school syllabus of things you must know to pass 9th grade ?

[wolveraptor]

Fucking nonsense. Watergate is so entrenched in the public mind that you add the suffix "-gate" on to the end of another noun when it's a vivid scandal. Degan doesn't know what he's talking about.

[Slacker]

The comparison is also flawed, because Vlad was actually defending his country against an expansionist Ottoman Empire. As for the horrible things he did I'm certain he was no different than any other warlord of his time, he just got bad PR.

Just like Nero, Attila the Hun and the Vikings.

Agreed. Not for nothing, most of the people impaled by Vlad were Ottoman troops captured while trying to invade Vlad's country...

[Patrick Degan]

Fucking nonsense. Watergate is so entrenched in the public mind that you add the suffix "-gate" on to the end of another noun when it's a vivid scandal. Degan doesn't know what he's talking about.

Don't I? OK, you try asking a lot of people on the streets just what Watergate actually was. The fact that the suffix "gate" is added onto every scandal now doesn't mean that people necessarily know where the usage originates from. We got people today who don't know where fucking Vietnam is or when the Civil War actually took place or who actually was president thirty years ago.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Yeah, your basis of comparison however was Vlad Tepes; many partially educated people are familiar with Nixon or even Harding, but not Harding.

Most Americans of the last two generations don't even know what Watergate was or know who Nixon ever was, never mind Harding. Give it twenty years and the public memory of Bush will be in about the same state.

I meant that even many who know of Harding and Nixon don't know who Vlad Tepes is; your basis of comparison. So how would Bush be any different?

[ArmorPierce]

I very much doubt that even a large minority of high school students knows what watergate is from personal experience of coming out of hs some years ago. It is never mention it in any hs lesson I've experienced and is probably part of the reason why Americans start yelling out "Conspiracy nut!" when anyone mentions the idea that the government may not be 100% good, pure, and true.

[Patrick Degan]

Yeah, your basis of comparison however was Vlad Tepes; many partially educated people are familiar with Nixon or even Harding, but not Harding.

Most Americans of the last two generations don't even know what Watergate was or know who Nixon ever was, never mind Harding. Give it twenty years and the public memory of Bush will be in about the same state.

I meant that even many who know of Harding and Nixon don't know who Vlad Tepes is; your basis of comparison. So how would Bush be any different?

You're being obtuse. The point of the original article was to compare Vlad to Bush and how both have fanatical followers who continue to passionately defend their legacies to this day. The point of my reply to this was to show how Vlad had a greater impact on the memories of Romanians (who, oddly enough, actually seem to get something of a history education in school) than Bush will on the memories of Americans many of whom don't learn shit in school, can't remember Richard Nixon and definitely don't have a clue as to who Warren Harding ever was, and how given this trend in American culture won't even remember the Talking Chimp a generation or two from now, never mind six centuries later. Do I really have to connect all the dots for you?

[wolveraptor]

Don't I? OK, you try asking a lot of people on the streets just what Watergate actually was. The fact that the suffix "gate" is added onto every scandal now doesn't mean that people necessarily know where the usage originates from. We got people today who don't know where fucking Vietnam is or when the Civil War actually took place or who actually was president thirty years ago.

Actually, I think you may be right about people not knowing the specifics of Watergate. In high school, it's usually just touched on as a vague sort of scandal that brought down Nixon, who was then pardoned by Ford.

But everyone with a high school education at least knows that much. I think you're being too condescending to John Q. Public.

[Illuminatus Primus]

You don't have any data that the Romanian public at large is better educated or more familiar with their history (especially ancient history vs. the last 50 years) by significant margins (vis-a-vis Nixon vs. Vlad Tepes). Furthermore, Vlad Tepes is not comparable to a particularly corrupt leader - but not disastrously so - of the last 50 years. He's more like their Abraham Lincoln or George Washington. And somehow I doubt the average Romanians' "apologetics" for Tepes goes much more beyond, "he was a tough, he killed Turks!" if even beyond "he was great!" Likewise with our Washington and Lincoln who were arguably controversial in their own right - with native genocide and slavery for the former, and overstepping constitutional bounds and total war against the rebellious South on the latter.

You're simply exaggerating the comparison in order to further your rhetorical gimmickry.

[Justforfun000]

Fuck, I can't get over that disgusting description of Vlad's impaling people. How can ANYONE be that sick? I can't fathom someone actually doing that to someone. Even ordering it done. I couldn't make myself hurt somebody like that for all the riches in the world.
Where does this psycho streak come from? You must have to be really fucked up in the head to cause such sadistic harm to another living thing.

Yuk. I feel like vomiting.

[Pelranius]

The comparison is also flawed, because Vlad was actually defending his country against an expansionist Ottoman Empire. As for the horrible things he did I'm certain he was no different than any other warlord of his time, he just got bad PR.

Just like Nero, Attila the Hun and the Vikings.

Agreed. Not for nothing, most of the people impaled by Vlad were Ottoman troops captured while trying to invade Vlad's country...

I believed he also impaled a great deal of Transylvanian Saxons, disgruntled peasants and nobles. Though the numbers are probably exaggerated.

[Gil Hamilton]

Yeah, he was pretty horrible (as was everyone around there, to pretty much everyone else), which is why the above article is just way to over the top. What was ironic was that he got the whole vampire thing starts about him not because of the horrible things he did to people, but because he converted to Roman Catholicism.

[The Yosemite Bear]

I mean after we're fighting off rapist, outlaw biker, nomad, raiders for our meager food supplies in a post peak oil, US infrastructure collapse, whose going to care about Iraq, or Katrina....

[Galvatron]

Fuck, I can't get over that disgusting description of Vlad's impaling people. How can ANYONE be that sick? I can't fathom someone actually doing that to someone. Even ordering it done. I couldn't make myself hurt somebody like that for all the riches in the world.
Where does this psycho streak come from? You must have to be really fucked up in the head to cause such sadistic harm to another living thing.

Yuk. I feel like vomiting.

You should see the movie Dark Prince: The True Story of Dracula. They actually show the impalement of his enemies. He even orders the immediate impalement of one of his guards for falling asleep at his post.

[PeZook]

Fuck, I can't get over that disgusting description of Vlad's impaling people. How can ANYONE be that sick? I can't fathom someone actually doing that to someone. Even ordering it done. I couldn't make myself hurt somebody like that for all the riches in the world.
Where does this psycho streak come from? You must have to be really fucked up in the head to cause such sadistic harm to another living thing.

Yuk. I feel like vomiting.

Sorry to break it to you, dude, but impalement wasn't exactly uncommon back then.

Everybody did it in Eastern Europe, Vladdy was just particularly fond of it. Poles, Russians, Hungarians, Turks, Tattars, you name it.

Human beings are that horrible to each other. Be thankful you live in the XXI century, even with bad shit looming on the horizon, we're still a gazillion times better off than the average Joe six hundred years ago.

A medieval king would not diss a proposal to stay in an average suburban home for the night. In fact, if you own a car, you already command more resources than many ancient warlords, in terms of energy and industry spent on it.

[Patrick Degan]

You don't have any data that the Romanian public at large is better educated or more familiar with their history (especially ancient history vs. the last 50 years) by significant margins (vis-a-vis Nixon vs. Vlad Tepes).

A recent survey of college students in this country showed that half couldn't even say when the American Revolution took place —an event a mere two centuries past for us. While Romanians are celebrating national heroes from four, five, and six centuries past and had been inculcated in their exploits as part of the programme of nationalistic identity imposed by the Ceaucescu regime.

Furthermore, Vlad Tepes is not comparable to a particularly corrupt leader - but not disastrously so - of the last 50 years. He's more like their Abraham Lincoln or George Washington. And somehow I doubt the average Romanians' "apologetics" for Tepes goes much more beyond, "he was a tough, he killed Turks!" if even beyond "he was great!" Likewise with our Washington and Lincoln who were arguably controversial in their own right - with native genocide and slavery for the former, and overstepping constitutional bounds and total war against the rebellious South on the latter.

Which was not what I was arguing against at all, if you even bothered to read this thread all the way through, which evidently you did not.

You're simply exaggerating the comparison in order to further your rhetorical gimmickry.

Translation: "I really don't have a cogent rebuttal to the point so I'll just accuse my opponent of playing games". I think that's what you actually meant to say here.