US Depleted of Skilled Workers

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US Depleted of Skilled Workers

Post by Darth Fanboy »

"Help Wanted" highlights skills drain in U.S
Mon Jan 21, 2008 3:22am EST

By Joanne Morrison

TRAFFORD, Pennsylvania (Reuters) - Only half the machines are running at precision parts maker Hamill Manufacturing, nestled in the Allegheny Mountains just east of Pittsburgh, once the booming center of the U.S. steel industry.

But the factory's overcapacity is the result not of a shortage of business -- it has more orders than it can fill, despite a slowing U.S. economy -- but because of a shortage of skilled workers.

"I'd hire 10 machinists right now if I could," said John Dalrymple, president of the company, which makes high-end parts for military helicopters and nuclear submarines. "That's eight to 10 percent of our workforce."

While millions of jobs making everything from textiles to steel have moved to new powerhouses like China in recent years, precision manufacturing remains a crucial niche in the United States, one that is overworked and chronically understaffed.

And, in a bad sign for the United States and its declining economic might, that shortage of skilled workers is likely to get worse as Baby Boomers retire -- with no younger generation of manufacturing workers to take the baton.

"Our workforce is an aging workforce," said Chief Executive Jeff Kelly, whose father founded Hamill nearly 60 years ago. "There isn't a queue of people lining up to come into the industry."

Some 20 percent of small to medium-sized manufacturers -- those with up to 2,000 workers -- cited retaining or training employees as their No. 1 concern, according to a survey by the National Association of Manufacturers. The survey was carried out in 2007 but has not been published yet.

A separate study in 2005, the latest available, said 90 percent of manufacturers are suffering a moderate to severe shortage of qualified workers.

"The irony is we pay very well, we have good benefits, we have job security and most of the companies that have survived the manufacturing recession at the early part of this decade can't find enough skilled workers," Kelly said.

A typical manufacturing job pays about $60,000 a year, according to manufacturing industry figures, a premium of about 25 percent to the service industries.

At Hamill, a general machinist will start at $9 an hour, rising to $14.50 an hour after training, and going up to the mid to high twenties for senior machinists, who can earn nearly $70,000 a year.

But that is not enough to attract younger workers into manufacturing, a sector that has suffered a bad rap over the years with layoffs in well-known companies such as the big three U.S. automakers.

"Too few young people consider manufacturing careers and often are unaware of the skills needed in an advanced environment," the U.S. Labor department wrote in a study on the issue.

Edward Lazear, the chairman of President George W. Bush's Council of Economic Advisors, warns that as more and more baby boomers retire the skills shortage will eventually cut into the country's economic growth.

"You will start to see some decline in our growth rates as a result of these demographic factors," Lazear told Reuters in an interview. "As people start to retire, the labor market is going to not grow at the same rate that it did in the past and it's going to affect our growth," Lazear said.

This is clearly the problem in Pennsylvania, which has been suffering from the decline and collapse of its steel giants, like Bethlehem Steel, since the 1980s, but which has openings for skilled workers.

"I can tell you on my desk right now I have over 300 very high-quality job openings that I cannot fill," said Michael Smeltzer, executive director of the Manufactures Association of South-Central Pennsylvania, who coordinates job openings for that part of the state.

State officials concede that the less-skilled work will continue to move overseas where the pay is lower. The state has pledged $17 million to develop a skilled workforce and keep the high-precision sector here

"We're not going to compete on the price of our labor, we're going to compete on the skill of our labor, said Sandi Vito, deputy secretary for workforce development in Pennsylvania.

But for Smeltzer, that investment may not generate enough skilled workers to cover what he called a crisis of retirements. "Why do I think it's a crisis today?" he said. "In 2010, which is right around the corner, we have this avalanche of skilled labor needs."

Smaller businesses -- those with 200 employees or fewer -- make up the bulk of the U.S. manufacturing sector, and for them the skills shortage is a crucial issue.

Nationally, one in four businesses say they have a vacancy they cannot fill, according to a survey by the National Federation of Independent Business, which groups both manufacturing and non-manufacturing businesses.

"We could make more GDP if we could find some hands to do it," said Bill Dunkelberg, the group's chief economist.

At Hamill, demand for high-end, U.S.-made military parts is up, as war in Iraq continues and the value of the dollar has decreased, making these goods less expensive for overseas buyers. But Hamill has not been able to take full advantage of the weaker dollar, and orders have been lost.

The company has a staff of 110, up from 85 two years ago, but potential growth has been stifled by the inability to bring new people in, Kelly said.

Glenn Skena, who runs Hamill's apprenticeship programs, said it takes years to train workers. On average, the company will invest about $120,000 per apprentice, and often will send workers to college for training to use the computers that design the parts and direct the machines.

"We have a hard time hiring programmers from the outside so we have to train them from within," said Skena.

Because these highly trained workers are such a commodity, wages are high. "We're quickly ratcheting up our wage scale," said Kelly.

But still there are not enough workers.

"We have spindles sitting idle because we don't have machinists to run them," said Dalrymple. A "Help Wanted" sign has been a fixture outside the factory for months.

(Reporting by Joanne Morrison; Editing by Eddie Evans)

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Apparently nobody's willing to work anymore. In a lot of communites in PA (the state mentioned in the article), $70,000 a year would go a reallllly long way.
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Post by Dartzap »

Uh, welcome to Britain: The Last Decade?

You could always ask Poland nicely, I suppose.... :)
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Post by Darth Wong »

Unfortunately, while it may sound like I just love to bash Reagan for the fun of it, this rot started in the 1980s. A loss of pride in domestic manufacturing, ubiquitous economist rhetoric about "the new service economy", and an emphasis on business-suited "success" schools led millions of families to conclude that skilled tradesmen were losers. As a result, the country is utterly swamped with useless liberal-arts and "B-school" graduates whose idea of complex mechanical work is changing a tire.

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Post by Hotfoot »

My grandfather, who taught metal shop back in the day, has told me long and often about how it's a damn crime that schools have done away with shop classes, and stuff like this just goes to show how right he is. Not that this is the only thing missing in schools these days. Basic finance management classes are sorely needed too.

But hey, let's make sure our kids know how to take multiple choice tests. THAT'S a needed life skill.
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Post by Adrian Laguna »

Darth Wong wrote:As a result, the country is utterly swamped with useless liberal-arts and "B-school" graduates whose idea of complex mechanical work is changing a tire.
The biggest irony being that most of these people with useless degree are probably making considerably less money in the service sector than if they had become skilled labourers. On top of that, they also spent more time and money going to school to train for these service sector jobs that pay less.
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Post by Big Orange »

In Britain and America, the corporations have removed the majority of heavy industry and manufacturing, relocating it to the Second and Third World where the said corporations don't have to deal with humanitarian or enviromental considerations.

But even the service, administration, distribution, and R&D wings of corporations getting pointlessly messed about with, downsized, or shipped out as well in recent years as well. Should call centres operate more efficiently if they're done in the same country as the company's headquaters, let alone in-house?
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Post by Patrick Degan »

Adrian Laguna wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:As a result, the country is utterly swamped with useless liberal-arts and "B-school" graduates whose idea of complex mechanical work is changing a tire.
The biggest irony being that most of these people with useless degree are probably making considerably less money in the service sector than if they had become skilled labourers. On top of that, they also spent more time and money going to school to train for these service sector jobs that pay less.
Particularly for those who's four year stint in university to net them those worthless degrees found they spend all those thousands of dollars to qualify for a job wearing a paper hat and asking "would you like fries with that?"
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Post by NeoGoomba »

Darth Wong wrote:Unfortunately, while it may sound like I just love to bash Reagan for the fun of it, this rot started in the 1980s. A loss of pride in domestic manufacturing, ubiquitous economist rhetoric about "the new service economy", and an emphasis on business-suited "success" schools led millions of families to conclude that skilled tradesmen were losers. As a result, the country is utterly swamped with useless liberal-arts and "B-school" graduates whose idea of complex mechanical work is changing a tire.
I still remember from High School days that the kids who only did half days so that they could take vocational courses (mostly mechanic and electrical work) were heavily derided by the other kids who were aimed by their parents at Business Colleges. Now they are the ones getting layoffs and the ones with vocational backgrounds are relatively secure.
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Post by Cecelia5578 »

Well, I saw a survey of graduates done by the San Jose State career center in 2006, and business graduates, (both undergrad and graduate) had pretty good salaries compared to engineers.
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Post by White Haven »

It's the natural consequence of the message from school counselors and teachers changing from 'Study hard so you can learn and get a good job' to 'Study hard so you can get into a good college.' While I was in public school, students were more or less inundated with the 'thou shalt go to college' mindset, and that tends to take hold after a dozen years of repetition. My county even had a system where each school had a pre-college program focused in some area, and a separate vocational-education system that was centered around two schools and was poorly-funded and poorly-promoted.
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Post by Darth Wong »

Cecelia5578 wrote:Well, I saw a survey of graduates done by the San Jose State career center in 2006, and business graduates, (both undergrad and graduate) had pretty good salaries compared to engineers.
So? Engineering is not a particularly well-paid profession. We have the dubious pleasure of living in a society where one's value is measured not by what he contributes to society, but by what he extracts from it. Ubiquitous B-school graduates are a first-class example of this problem.
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Post by Broomstick »

Even if a worker wanted to change careers and get tradeskills it would be very difficult do so. I have looked into this recently. There are many training programs for people without a college degree, none for those with college degrees - I suppose the assumption is, or was when this was set up, that once you have a degree you need no further training, or else will be able to cough up training funds. The reality is that if the market is swamped with people of skill set A and we need more skill set B some people need to be retrained... but once the layoffs have occurred people don't have the money to be retrained in another field. It's also tied to the assumption that you train for one field and stay there forever, that entry level/trainees should only be young people, and so on. Corporate and business America screams about the lack of skilled labor but is no longer willing to hire entry-level people and is reluctant to train from within - they want to hire someone with 10 or more years experience and won't even consider training when they can't get that. And yes, this is also tied in with the mindset that EVERYONE should go to college.
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Post by Kristoff »

Dartzap wrote:You could always ask Poland nicely, I suppose.... :)
They don't have to ask at all - most of Polish politicians are brown nosing them for at least a decade or two. :)
All they have to do is to change their conditions of issuing visas for Poles.
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Post by Cecelia5578 »

Darth Wong wrote:
Cecelia5578 wrote:Well, I saw a survey of graduates done by the San Jose State career center in 2006, and business graduates, (both undergrad and graduate) had pretty good salaries compared to engineers.
So? Engineering is not a particularly well-paid profession. We have the dubious pleasure of living in a society where one's value is measured not by what he contributes to society, but by what he extracts from it. Ubiquitous B-school graduates are a first-class example of this problem.
I was responding to people in earlier posts lumping in business school grads with liberal arts majors in terms of salary. I didn't mean to imply anything about the intrinsic moral worth of a particular career field, though I suppose marketing and finance types aren't very high in my book-but what did accountants do to piss you off so much? We all have to do what we have to do in our wonderful capitalistic system. And, plenty of engineers work for industries that very few people like on this board-the oil and defense industries come to mind.
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Post by Uraniun235 »

This ridiculousness is partly inflicted by a public school system which severely over-prioritizes college-prep over vocational classes, to the point of some schools completely dismantling their vocational programs - programs which can prepare students for these very jobs.
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Post by andrewgpaul »

Adrian Laguna wrote:The biggest irony being that most of these people with useless degree are probably making considerably less money in the service sector than if they had become skilled labourers. On top of that, they also spent more time and money going to school to train for these service sector jobs that pay less.
Indeed; I've heard more than one story about a London lawyer or financial sector worker retraining as a plumber, because it pays better.

Also, plenty of jobs that used to be available to people via vocational or 1-year college courses are now only open to university graduates - nursing for one, along with other medical technical positions. Whether that's a cause or a symptom of the increasing push towards higher university attendance figures, I don't know.
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Post by Big Orange »

Kristoff wrote:
Dartzap wrote:You could always ask Poland nicely, I suppose.... :)
They don't have to ask at all - most of Polish politicians are brown nosing them for at least a decade or two. :)
All they have to do is to change their conditions of issuing visas for Poles.
Careful, they would be widely employed as builders, electricians, plumbers, and carpenters over many qualified locals, which has what recently happened in the UK ( "DEY TOOK URE JUBS!" :P ).
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Post by brianeyci »

Well look on the bright side; if the problem is parents who all want their children to be bosses and push their children in wrong directions, this could be a one-generation problem. The children who get shafted by business schools this way aren't likely to push their own children in the same direction.

You can see some of the backlash happening already. Vocational schools are popping up to train students to fill gaps, and television commercials bombard youth with the idea go to their college get a trade and come out six months later with a career.

The main problem like Broomstick mentioned is the squeeze, with every penny counting and no time to raise a family and do those six months. I believe that most Americans are two months away from destitution, nevermind six months or a year.
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Post by Darth Wong »

Cecelia5578 wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:
Cecelia5578 wrote:Well, I saw a survey of graduates done by the San Jose State career center in 2006, and business graduates, (both undergrad and graduate) had pretty good salaries compared to engineers.
So? Engineering is not a particularly well-paid profession. We have the dubious pleasure of living in a society where one's value is measured not by what he contributes to society, but by what he extracts from it. Ubiquitous B-school graduates are a first-class example of this problem.
I was responding to people in earlier posts lumping in business school grads with liberal arts majors in terms of salary. I didn't mean to imply anything about the intrinsic moral worth of a particular career field, though I suppose marketing and finance types aren't very high in my book-but what did accountants do to piss you off so much? We all have to do what we have to do in our wonderful capitalistic system.
How the fuck does that justify the middle-management bloat that characterizes far too many industries in decline, and which is largely driven by this "put everyone through liberal-arts or B-school" idiocy? How about all of these imbeciles who think that you don't need to know any particular industry's technical nature or inner workings, as long as you know "business"? I've personally seen several businesses driven into the ground by that B-school bullshit.
And, plenty of engineers work for industries that very few people like on this board-the oil and defense industries come to mind.
Funny how all of the actual immoral things that those industries do can be traced to upper management and their paid-for politicians, not the line workers.
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Post by Darksider »

Darth Wong wrote: How the fuck does that justify the middle-management bloat that characterizes far too many industries in decline, and which is largely driven by this "put everyone through liberal-arts or B-school" idiocy? How about all of these imbeciles who think that you don't need to know any particular industry's technical nature or inner workings, as long as you know "business"? I've personally seen several businesses driven into the ground by that B-school bullshit.
See, stuff like that is why I'm minoring in computer science while getting a buisness degree. There are too many people at the top of corporations these days that have no damn idea how the lower levels work, and thus cannot properly manage them. I plan to eventually get some sort of management job at an IT company, but I also damn well intend to have enough programming know-how to make it as a low-level employee just in case I can't, and (Zeus willing) if I get a management job, i'll have some idea as to what the programming process is like, so I won't end up placing rediculous demands on the employees because I have no damn idea what their jobs are like.
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Post by aerius »

Cecelia5578 wrote:And, plenty of engineers work for industries that very few people like on this board-the oil and defense industries come to mind.
Like it or not, the oil industry is absolutely essential for the function of our modern society. Beancounters, no. You can go to damn near any company and fire 80% of their beancounters & managers and everything will still be just fine, in fact some companies will end up ahead without their useless middle-management leeches. Other than a bunch of former beancounters being unemployed, the economy is mostly unaffected.

If even 15-20% of the engineers in the oil industry were let go, modern society would be totally fucked. There won't be enough people to keep the rigs drilling & the oil flowing, and without enough oil, our modern society is finished. It's no joke when they say oil is the lifeblood of our modern world.

Speaking of which, the oil industry engineers have known for a long time that we're going to hit Peak Oil right about now, and some have been trying to get the word out for years. But all the management & PR types continue to insist to everyone that there's oil aplenty for the world, if only the greenies would let them drill more holes in the ground. Gotta love the PR & management assholes, and all the politicians & lobby groups they've bought off.
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Post by brianeyci »

I didn't live through the 80's, but honestly the problem could be unintentional. There doesn't have to be any malice involved. Parents, thinking the world to be fair and based on merit, concluded that this was why the elite 1% were successful, had liberal arts degrees and business degrees and geared their children emulate it as the easiest way to climb the corporate ladder.

But they failed to take into account that the rich and wealthy are rich not because they went to liberal arts, which was a correlation and not causation. They were rich and are rich because of family wealth, and only sent their kids to dick around in college and inherit the family business.
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Post by Dillon »

This is exactly why I'm in Construction Electricity school. I'd love nothing more than to go to university and study something I love, like history, but what would that do for me, career-wise? It'd be four years of my life wasted, and put me in lots of debt.

There's real money in skilled trades is these days. It's too bad there's so many soft-handed, limp wristed pussies that panic at the idea of actually working with their hands.

That's not to say that all college degrees are useless. If I didn't find law so fucking boring, or if I thought I was capable of obtaining a science or engineering degree, I'd go for it. But these arts and business degrees? I might as well flush my money down the toilet. At least I won't have wasted my precious time that way.
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Post by Glocksman »

brianeyci wrote:I didn't live through the 80's, but honestly the problem could be unintentional. There doesn't have to be any malice involved. Parents, thinking the world to be fair and based on merit, concluded that this was why the elite 1% were successful, had liberal arts degrees and business degrees and geared their children emulate it as the easiest way to climb the corporate ladder.

But they failed to take into account that the rich and wealthy are rich not because they went to liberal arts, which was a correlation and not causation. They were rich and are rich because of family wealth, and only sent their kids to dick around in college and inherit the family business.
Interesting.

While I don't make a whole lot of money (only $12.30/hr, but a decent apartment is less than $500 a month locally), I *do* have health insurance that many others who are more educated (I only completed one year of college before dropping out) would envy.

That's thanks to my union though*, and not to any innate intelligence or skillset I have though, so I'm not under any illusion about my 'worth' in the local labor market.

What might be more relevant is that one of the people I went to high school with decided to pursue the vocational tech path (which was heavily discouraged by the counselors at the time) instead of the college prep path.

While I wound up driving PIT's for the local TJX warehouse at fairly low pay, he wound up working at the local German import (Audi, BMW, Porsche, and Mercedes) dealership as a mechanic and showed enough initiative to wind up heading their service department and makes over four times my salary doing so.

In other words, oftentimes, vocational training has been given the short shrift and we're now paying the price for it in more ways than one.





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Post by Glocksman »

Addendum: what's really ironic for me is that I originally considered going into the 'vocational tech' path, but was talked out of it by the counselor due to my high (1280 total-720 verbal, 590 math) SAT score and entered the local college, only to drop out after my first year due to financial and personal (frankly, lack of maturity) reasons.

To be honest, I *enjoy* working on things with my hands and do most of my non-specialist car repairs myself, and I thing I would have been better served if I'd told the counselor to fuck off and entered the auto mechanics or machinists courses available when I was in high school.

Of course, hindsight's 20/20 and in the end it's my responsibility alone, but I wish I'd told the counselor to fuck off back in 1984 and entered shop classes.
"You say that it is your custom to burn widows. Very well. We also have a custom: when men burn a woman alive, we tie a rope around their necks and we hang them. Build your funeral pyre; beside it, my carpenters will build a gallows. You may follow your custom. And then we will follow ours."- General Sir Charles Napier

Oderint dum metuant
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