John McCain says that one of his "life's ambitions is to meet Herman Wouk." Which doesn't sound all that challenging, as goals go. The author of The Winds of War is 93. McCain could probably catch him. But does Herman Wouk want to meet John McCain?
Herman Wouk wrote The Caine Mutiny and created Captain Queeg. So John McCain might get a big kick out of a meeting with Herman Wouk, but the only thing Wouk could get is déjà vu.
Although he was invented more than fifty years ago, Lt. Com. Philip Francis Queeg is a naval officer with a raft of emotional disadvantages that would not be entirely unfamiliar to the men of the Straight Talk Express.
Here, and I haven't changed a word, is a scene from The Caine Mutiny Court-Martial. Defense counsel Barney Greenwald is asking Dr. Lundeen, a psychiatrist, a few questions about Queeg's issues.
See if it sounds like any candidate you know.
GREENWALD: Describe Commander Queeg's problems.
LUNDEEN, hesitant: In general, the commander is rather troubled by his short stature, his low standing in his class, and such factors. But the commander is well adjusted to all these things.
"In all candor, as an adult I've been known to forget occasionally the discretion expected of a person of my many years and station when I believe I've been accorded a lack of respect I did not deserve." - John McCain, 5'6".
"Resisting, being uncooperative and a general pain in the ass, proved, as it had in the past, to be a morale booster for me." - John McCain
GREENWALD: Can you describe the nature of the adjustment?
LUNDEEN: Yes, I can. His identity as a naval officer is the essential balancing factor. It's the key to his personal security. Therefore he has a fixed anxiety about protecting his standing. That would account for the harshness and ill temper.
"For much of my life the Navy was the only world I knew. It is still the world I know best and love most." -- John McCain
"As a young man, I would respond aggressively and sometimes irresponsibly to anyone who I perceived to have questioned my sense of honor and self-respect. Those responses often got me in a fair amount of trouble earlier in life." -- John McCain
"I acted like a jerk." - John McCain
GREENWALD: Would he be disinclined to admit to mistakes?
LUNDEEN: Yes. Of course there's nothing unbalanced in that.
"I think if you look at the overall record and millions of jobs have been created, et cetera, et cetera, you could make an argument that there's been great progress economically over (the last eight years)." - John McCain 4/17/08
"I think Americans are hurting, and hurting badly. In fact, I think Americans are not better off than they were eight years ago, when you look at what's happened to middle-income Americans." - John McCain 4/18/08
"The issue of economics is not something I've understood as well as I should." - John McCain
"I have far more experience on the economy than Senator Obama. I'm very strong on the economy." - John McCain
GREENWALD: Would he be a perfectionist?
LUNDEEN: Such a personality would be.
"I have regretted losing my temper on many occasions. But there are things worth getting angry about in politics." - John McCain
"At the smallest provocation I would go off into a mad frenzy, and then suddenly crash to the floor unconscious. When I got angry I held my breath until I blacked out." - John McCain
GREENWALD: Suspicious of his subordinates? Inclined to hound them about small details?
LUNDEEN: Any mistake of a subordinate is intolerable because it might endanger him.
"I told you we needed a stage. You incompetent little shit. When I tell you to do something, you do it." -- John McCain, to Young Republican campaign volunteer Robert Wexler re: election night dais that made him look short
"I'm so glad you're out of a job, and I'll see to it that you never work again." -- John McCain to senate staffer Judy Leiby
"If you don't cooperate on this project you'll be the shortest tenured supervisor in the history of the Forest Service." John McCain to Jim Abbot, park ranger
"I'll destroy you." - John McCain to Sandra Dowling, Maricopa County school superintendent
GREENWALD: Yet he will not admit mistakes when he makes them himself?
LUNDEEN: You might say he revises reality in his own mind so he comes out blameless.
"There's no doubt in my mind that we will prevail and there's no doubt in my mind, once these people are gone, that we will be welcomed as liberators." - John McCain
"We're going to prevail and we will win and it'll be one of the best things that's happened to America and the world in a long time 'cause it'll reverberate throughout the Middle East." - John McCain
"We're succeeding. I don't care what anybody says. I've seen the facts on the ground." -- John McCain
GREENWALD: If criticized from above, would he be inclined to think he was being unjustly persecuted?
LUNDEEN: It's all one pattern, all stemming from one basic premise, that he must try to be perfect.
"We are extremely disappointed to see that the level of objectivity at NBC News has fallen so low that reporters are now giving voice to unsubstantiated, partisan claims in order to undercut John McCain." - John McCain campaign press release
"It is a shame that the New York Times has lowered its standards to engage in a hit and run smear campaign." - John McCain campaign press release
"The media is in love with Barack Obama." - John McCain campaign e-mail
"You should be ashamed . . . . You should be ashamed." "I don't know if you can understand this, George, but that really hurt. That really hurt." - John McCain to then-Governor George W. Bush
GREENWALD: Would he be inclined to stubbornness?
LUNDEEN: Well, you'll have a certain rigidity of personality in such an individual. The inner insecurity checks him from admitting that those who differ with him may be right.
"Fuck You!" - John McCain to Senator John Cornyn (R-TX) re: illegal immigration
"Asshole!" - John McCain to Senator Pete Domenici (R-NM) re: federal budget
"Fucking Jerk!" - John McCain to Senator Charles Grassley (R-IA) re: veterans affairs
"Liar!" - John McCain to Phoenix Mayor Paul Johnson re: land management
"Fuck you!" - John McCain to cameraman (N. Vietnam) re: request for silence
"You cunt!" - John McCain to Cindy McCain (R-Rx) re: make-up/hair
GREENWALD: suddenly switching from the fumbling manner to clicking preciseness: Doctor, you've testified that the following symptoms exist in the commander's behavior: rigidity of personality, feelings of persecution, unreasonable suspicion, withdrawal from reality, perfectionist anxiety, an unreal basic premise, and an obsessive sense of self-righteousness... Is there an inclusive psychiatric term - one label - for this syndrome?
I have a theory, and that is that at some point during a debate or something --perhaps Biden will do it-- but they're going to find a way to needle McCain until he has an explosive meltdown on TV.
I think that'll be awesome.
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."
In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around! If all you want to do is have some harmless, mindless fun, go H3RE INST3ADZ0RZ!! Grrr! Fight my Brute, you pansy!
Coyote wrote:I have a theory, and that is that at some point during a debate or something --perhaps Biden will do it-- but they're going to find a way to needle McCain until he has an explosive meltdown on TV.
I think that'll be awesome.
Don't you dare toy with my emotions like that.
I'm not being facetious even, I think you're right. Though I'm not giving better than 50/50 odds of it happening.
The Gentleman from Texas abstains. Discourteously.
PRFYNAFBTFC-Vice Admiral: MFS Masturbating Walrus :: Omine subtilite Odobenus rosmarus masturbari Soy un perdedor.
"WHO POOPED IN A NORMAL ROOM?!"-Commander William T. Riker
Quick edit: 50/50 odds of it happening publicly that is.
The Gentleman from Texas abstains. Discourteously.
PRFYNAFBTFC-Vice Admiral: MFS Masturbating Walrus :: Omine subtilite Odobenus rosmarus masturbari Soy un perdedor.
"WHO POOPED IN A NORMAL ROOM?!"-Commander William T. Riker
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln
People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House
Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
Yeah, except the book makes the point that it's easy to knock Queeg when you were never in his shows, as the lawyer defending the XO points out(I might add the lawyer says the COMMO reminds him of a "Berkeley type" he knows…I'll get the chapter and verse when I get home).
So, basically assholes who have only seen the movie and not read the book are taking this course of attack.
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
Besides, I'm not seeing where telling Bush to be ashamed over his campaign's treatment of McCain during the 2000 primary is something that should be held against him; by all accounts the hatchet job against McCain in 2000 on the part of Karl Rove was absolutely shameful.
Wikipedia provides a reasonable synopsis of the ending of the book.
Wiki wrote:
At a party celebrating both the acquittal and Keefer's success at selling his novel to a publisher, Greenwald shows up intoxicated, and accuses Keefer of being a coward. He tells the gathering that he feels ashamed of having destroyed Queeg on the stand, because Queeg did the necessary duty of guarding America in the peacetime Navy, which people like Keefer (and by implication, Willie), saw as beneath them. Greenwald further points out that without the protection of people like Queeg, Greenwald's mother could have been "melted down into a bar of soap", which is what he says is happening to the Jews under Hitler's reign in Europe. Greenwald tells the gathering that he had to "torpedo Queeg" because "the wrong man was on trial" -- that it was Keefer, not Maryk, who was "the true author of the Caine Mutiny". Greenwald throws a glass of champagne on Keefer's face, bringing the term "Old Yellowstain" full circle back to the novelist.
So, only assholes who probably failed to read the book, or only watched a watered down movie version, would really screw up Herman Wouk's intent of the story.
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
Lonestar wrote:Wikipedia provides a reasonable synopsis of the ending of the book.
Wiki wrote:
At a party celebrating both the acquittal and Keefer's success at selling his novel to a publisher, Greenwald shows up intoxicated, and accuses Keefer of being a coward. He tells the gathering that he feels ashamed of having destroyed Queeg on the stand, because Queeg did the necessary duty of guarding America in the peacetime Navy, which people like Keefer (and by implication, Willie), saw as beneath them. Greenwald further points out that without the protection of people like Queeg, Greenwald's mother could have been "melted down into a bar of soap", which is what he says is happening to the Jews under Hitler's reign in Europe. Greenwald tells the gathering that he had to "torpedo Queeg" because "the wrong man was on trial" -- that it was Keefer, not Maryk, who was "the true author of the Caine Mutiny". Greenwald throws a glass of champagne on Keefer's face, bringing the term "Old Yellowstain" full circle back to the novelist.
So, only assholes who probably failed to read the book, or only watched a watered down movie version, would really screw up Herman Wouk's intent of the story.
I've only seen the movie, but that point was made pretty clearly to me.
In Brazil they say that Pele was the best, but Garrincha was better
SancheztheWhaler wrote:
I've only seen the movie, but that point was made pretty clearly to me.
Honestly, I haven't seen the movie in years and years, but I've probably read the book 4 or 5 times(once in college, then a bunch of times on deployment). If the point was "clear in the movie" as well, then it means that in addition to not reading the book they probably didn't watch the movie.
"The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles."
SancheztheWhaler wrote:
I've only seen the movie, but that point was made pretty clearly to me.
Honestly, I haven't seen the movie in years and years, but I've probably read the book 4 or 5 times(once in college, then a bunch of times on deployment). If the point was "clear in the movie" as well, then it means that in addition to not reading the book they probably didn't watch the movie.
The scene at the end with Greenwald calling out Keefer might be the best part of the movie; of course, since the next scene is the young officer shipping out on his next deployment and happy, cheery music, it's easy to understand why people might assume the movie was all about Queeg being a jackass and not about anyone else's fuckups.
In Brazil they say that Pele was the best, but Garrincha was better
