Deadly shooting at German school

[Tiriol]

BBC News report.

Deadly shooting at German school


At least 11 people have been killed in a shooting at a school in south-west Germany, officials say.

Most of the dead are thought to have been pupils at the Albertville secondary school in Winnenden, north of Stuttgart.

The gunman, who was said to be wearing black combat gear, is thought to be a 17-year-old former pupil.

There are conflicting reports as to fate of the gunman, who fled the school into the centre of town.

There are unconfirmed reports that he has been shot and wounded, either by police or by himself. An earlier report said he had been arrested.

State police chief Konrad Jelden in Stuttgart said the dead included 10 students and one adult, the Associated Press news agency reported.

The chief reporter of the Stuttgart Journal newspaper, Kevin Latzel, told the BBC that there was a lot of confusion at the scene of the shooting.

"It's very horrible... the parents are crying, the pupils are crying and a lot of police is there and nobody knows really what happened," he said.

"They are very afraid, the pupils are calling their parents and the parents they want to pick [them] up but they can't do this, the parents they are not allowed to get into the classrooms," he added.

The attack is reported to have begun at about 0945 (0845 GMT).

The gunman "went into the school with a weapon and carried out a bloodbath", regional police chief Erwin Hetger said, the Associated Press news agency reported.
"I've never seen anything like this in my life," he said.

Witnesses said students jumped from the windows of the school after the gunman opened fire.

About 1,000 children are thought to attend the school, in the town some 20km (12 miles) north-east of Stuttgart.

GERMAN SCHOOL ATTACKS
2006: A former pupil injures 11 students at a school in western town of Emsdetten before turning the gun on himself.
2002: A former pupil kills 17 people in his school in the eastern city of Erfurt, then kills himself.

Helsingin Sanomat reported on its website that the German police has shot the shooter while he was trying to escape near shopping center of Wendlingen; Helsingin Sanomat learned of this from n-tv news channel.

[Thunderfire]

Spiegel now das an update on the situation.
German Teenager Shot Dead by Police After Killing 15 People

A 17-year-old youth in Germany killed 15 people on Wednesday in a shooting rampage that began at his school, where he shot dead nine pupils and three teachers. He was shot dead by police outside a supermarket after killing two passers by.

A 17-year-old youth killed 15 people in a shooting rampage that began at his former school on Wednesday and ended in a supermarket forecourt where he was shot dead by police after killing two passers by, police said.

The teenager walked into the Albertville secondary school in the southwestern town of Winnenden at 9.30 a.m and opened fire indiscriminately in two classrooms, killing nine pupils and three teachers as well as wounding several others.

PHOTO GALLERY: BLOODBATH IN WINNENDEN
Click on a picture to launch the image gallery (13 Photos)
He then fled, shooting dead a further person on his way, as police mounted a massive manhunt with helicopters and sniffer dogs.
Police located him in the town of Wendlingen 40 kilometers away. Two police officers were seriously wounded in that final shootout, police said.




"The attacker just opened fire indiscriminately," a police spokesman told SPIEGEL ONLINE. The youth has not yet been named.
Media reports said his parents had 18 licensed firearms in their home in a neighboring town. His father is reported to be a well-off businessman. Special units of the police stormed the house and are questioning his mother, reports said.

Winnenden, has around 27,600 inhabitants and is located 20 kilometers northeast of Stuttgart. Schools of its type teach pupils between the ages of 10 and 16.

More than 1,000 pupils were led to safety. German news channel N-TV reported that there was chaos around the school complex as parents were gathering there. "You can see the shock and horror in people's eyes," one eyewitness said.

It is the worst school shooting in Germany since the massacre of Erfurt in April 2002 when former pupil Robert Steinhäuser shot dead 13 teachers, two pupils, a police officer and himself. More than a dozen ambulances are at the school.

In 2006, an 18-year-old former pupil wounded 37 people in Emsdetten in northwestern Germany before killing himself.

[salm]

Yeah, it´s all over the news. Winnenden is not far from here.
Interestingly, so far no body has mentioned video games or paintball yet.

[Serafina]

Its notable that the shooter did NOT kill himself - which is not typical for amok shooters, which is often comparable to suicide - just with a "greater bang".

[Dahak]

Incidentally, the school is just around 1.5 km away from my flat. Luckily, I was at work when it happened, still it is a somewhat chilling thought.

About the death of the shooter, it doesn't seem to be clear so far if he shot himself or was shot. A lot of information around this incident is still somewhat fluid...

[That NOS Guy]

Maybe the shooter was trying for a suicide by cop?

[Kamakazie Sith]

Its notable that the shooter did NOT kill himself - which is not typical for amok shooters, which is often comparable to suicide - just with a "greater bang".

Most of them only kill themselves because there's a significant risk of being captured. I don't know of a single mass shooter that wouldn't have continue their shooting spree if the opportunity and means were available.

[Kamakazie Sith]

Maybe the shooter was trying for a suicide by cop?

Maybe, but typically those who go for suicide by cop don't try and murder as many people as possible.

[Dahak]

The current information is that he, indeed, shot himself after he was wounded by a police officer.

[Tiriol]

BBC has provided an update.

Germany stunned by shooting spree

Germany is in shock after a heavily armed 17-year-old opened fire on pupils and teachers at his former school in a killing spree in which 15 people died.

The youth fled the school in Winnenden, south-west Germany, but shot himself dead after being cornered by police.

Chancellor Angela Merkel called the incident "unimaginable" and said it was a day of mourning for the whole nation.

German schools have suffered several attacks in recent years, but none has seen so many fatalities since 2002.

TIM KRETSCHMER

Left Albertville school last year after passing exams
Officials said he was an ordinary pupil who had received good reports from school
German media reported he had begun an apprenticeship
Lived in the village of Leutenbach
A keen table-tennis player, who aspired to become professional

The teenager, named as Tim Kretschmer, entered the Albertville secondary school, north of Stuttgart, at about 0930 (0830 GMT) dressed in black combat gear.

Baden-Wuerttemberg Interior Minister Heribert Rech said he then opened fire on a class of 14- and 15-year-olds, aiming at their heads.

Eight girls and one boy were killed, along with three teachers. Seven other children suffered minor injuries.

Terrified pupils leapt from the school windows to escape.

A child at the school called the emergency services from a mobile phone, which police said helped them respond quickly and prevent the incident from getting any worse.

Eileen Toraman, a pupil at the school, said she had lost a friend in the tragedy.

"I think his leg was broken and he was unable to run away," she said.

"Another friend of mine broke her leg because she jumped from the third floor.

"I don't understand why this happened. I have no idea what is supposed to happen now."

Despite the presence of dozens of police officers, the gunman escaped from the school, killing a passer-by as he fled.


'Appalling crime'

He then hijacked a car, taking its driver hostage, and reached the town of Wendlingen, about 40km (25 miles) away from the school.

The police believe he arrived in Wendlingen by chance, after the car's driver lost control on a sharp bend and came to a standstill.

The teenager fled into an industrial estate, where he shot and killed two men at a car showroom.

In a press briefing, Mr Rech said officers arrived at the showroom and traded gunfire with the teenager, hitting him in the leg.

"He fell down, but he got up and managed to load his gun. A little later he was found dead," said Mr Rech.

A police spokesman said all their investigations "hint at him having killed himself".

In a brief statement, Mrs Merkel described it as an "appalling crime".

"It is unimaginable that in just seconds, pupils and teachers were killed. This is a day of mourning for the whole of Germany," she said.

Local media reported that police had raided the suspect's house and recovered 16 weapons.

The teenager's father, thought to be a prominent businessman in the area, was reported to be a member of a local shooting club.

Eckehard Weiss, who coached Tim Kretschmer at table-tennis, told the BBC that he had been a relatively normal boy.

Mr Weiss said he had wanted to be a professional table-tennis player and had even played a match last weekend.

[Zixinus]

17.

Shit. The guy's barely a year older than me.

Media reports said his parents had 18 licensed firearms in their home in a neighboring town. His father is reported to be a well-off businessman.

Why did I had the feeling this would be the case? Why?

[Broomstick]

He had to get the guns from somewhere.

My understanding of German gun laws is largely non-existent. I assume they are not as easy to acquire as in the US, but if guns are in the family then they're not so difficult to get access to.

[Dahak]

The legal requirements are quite strict. The father was a sport shooter, so was able to get a licence to have weapons at home. The law requires a safe for the weapons to be stored (if Spiegel.de is to be trusted, a safe that weighs at least 200kg and/or is screwed to the floor). But in this case, it seems that the father was careless with at least one weapon, so the son could access it.

[Broomstick]

This sort of thing is, of course, why gun owners need to be very careful to secure their own weapons and make sure they do not fall into the wrong hands - including the hands of unstable family members.

There DO seem to be an inordinate number of mass shootings this month. Not that even one is OK, but there have been multiple cases in recent weeks, in more than one country.

[Zixinus]

The father was a sport shooter, so was able to get a licence to have weapons at home.

A sports shooter needed eighteen guns? Also, shouldn't the ammunition be stored in a separate safe?

[Kamakazie Sith]

The father was a sport shooter, so was able to get a licence to have weapons at home.

A sports shooter needed eighteen guns? Also, shouldn't the ammunition be stored in a separate safe?

If you take a look at other people who have serious hobbies you'll probably note that they have a lot of whatever that hobbie is. How many basketballs do you think Michael Jordan has? Probably a few...

Also, yes the ammunition should be seperate from the weapon. However, this person was either careless with his weapons or trusted the wrong person.

[salm]

The father was a sport shooter, so was able to get a licence to have weapons at home.

A sports shooter needed eighteen guns? Also, shouldn't the ammunition be stored in a separate safe?

Don´t know about the legal requirements but the ammo wasn´t stored in any safe at all. The gun wasn´t either.
And of course a sports shooter needs 18 guns. After all he needs something to pose in front of his tough guy shooting buddies.

[Kamakazie Sith]

Don´t know about the legal requirements but the ammo wasn´t stored in any safe at all. The gun wasn´t either.
And of course a sports shooter needs 18 guns. After all he needs something to pose in front of his tough guy shooting buddies.

Sure, some people who own guns are "tough guys", however, when you make comments like this it just shows you don't really understand them and have made very little effort to do so. I don't understand people who collect sports statistics, or memorbilia, but I don't make assumptions about their personal character either.

[salm]

Well, maybe he´s not a tough guy. Maybe he´s just a fucking moron who left one of his guns and a hundred rounds of ammo in a place accessible to his lunatic offspring.

[Broomstick]

Now that ^ is probably the case. It doesn't matter if it was 1 or 18 guns, he was responsible for keeping them out of the wrong hands and failed.

[Kamakazie Sith]

Well, maybe he´s not a tough guy. Maybe he´s just a fucking moron who left one of his guns and a hundred rounds of ammo in a place accessible to his lunatic offspring.

I have to agree. Chances are he knew that this boy was having issues, and leaving firearms and the ammunition unlocked is simply stupid.

[Alyeska]

This is certainly tragic news. I hope the families can recover from this. You always wonder what is going through the mind of someone who does something senseless like that. Just like the V-Tech shooting. Angry at the word. Except these wackos end up killing people they claim to respect in the process. I have a hard time comprehending what their problem is to cause them to do such violence.

[Alyeska]

The father was a sport shooter, so was able to get a licence to have weapons at home.

A sports shooter needed eighteen guns? Also, shouldn't the ammunition be stored in a separate safe?

You would be surprised. Like most hobbies out there, there is a great deal of variety that the owner might have been involved with. They might want a collection in a series, or they might want a variety.

Revolver
Semi automatic pistol
muzzle loading pistol
select fire pistol

muzzle loading smooth barrel musket
muzzle loading rifled musket
muzzle loading miniball musket
breach loading single shot rifle
revolver rifle
lever action revolver rifle
lever action repeating rifle
bolt action rifle
pump action rifle
semi automatic rifle top feeding internal magazine
semi automatic rifle external box magazine
semi automatic rifle tube magazine
select fire rifle

breach loading shotgun
pump action shotgun
semi automatic shotgun
select fire shotgun

Thats not even a comprehensive list of the variety of weapons one might get. Lets say he just wanted one of each. 18 sounds large, but its not absurdist.

[[R_H]]

Yeah, it´s all over the news. Winnenden is not far from here.
Interestingly, so far no body has mentioned video games or paintball yet.

Just heard on SWR3 that he played video games (including Counter Strike), and had Softair weapons in his room.

[Zixinus]

Of course, its not necessarily the gun at fault here.

Also notice the victims: girls and teachers. People the guy likely to had frustrations with.

Thats not even a comprehensive list of the variety of weapons one might get. Lets say he just wanted one of each. 18 sounds large, but its not absurdist.

If you need one of all of those that you listed, then he's a fucking collector, not a sports shooter.

Call me silly, but wouldn't about 3-5 guns satisfy most hobby and sport shooting needs?