AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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WASHINGTON — Despite being bailed out with more than $170 billion from the Treasury and Federal Reserve, the American International Group is preparing to pay about $100 million in bonuses to executives in the same business unit that brought the company to the brink of collapse last year.
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An official in the Obama administration said Saturday that Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner had called A.I.G.’s government-appointed chairman, Edward M. Liddy, on Wednesday and asked that the company renegotiate the bonuses.

Administration officials said they had managed to reduce some of the bonuses but had allowed most of them to go forward after the company’s chief executive said A.I.G. was contractually obligated to pay them.

In a letter to Mr. Geithner, Mr. Liddy wrote: “Needless to say, in the current circumstances, I do not like these arrangements and find it distasteful and difficult to recommend to you that we must proceed with them.”

The bonuses will be paid to executives at American International Group’s Financial Products division, the unit that wrote trillions of dollars’ worth of credit-default swaps that protected investors from defaults on bond backed by subprime mortgages.

An A.I.G. spokeswoman said the company had no comment beyond the text of the letter.

In his letter to the Treasury, Mr. Liddy said A.I.G. hoped to reduce its retention bonuses for 2009 by 30 percent. He said the top 25 executives at the Financial Products division had also agreed to reduce their salary for the rest of 2009 to $1.

But Mr. Liddy defended the need to continue paying bonuses if A.I.G. was going to unwind the rest of its disastrous mortgage-related business at the lowest possible cost to taxpayers.

“We cannot attract and retain the best and the brightest talent to lead and staff the A.I.G. businesses — which are now being operated principally on behalf of American taxpayers — if employees believe their compensation is subject to continued arbitrary adjustment by the U.S. Treasury,” he wrote Mr. Geithner. The government owns nearly 80 percent of the company.

The bonuses were first reported by The Washington Post.

Of all the financial institutions that have been propped up by taxpayer dollars, none has received more money than A.I.G. and none has infuriated lawmakers more with practices that policy makers have called reckless.

Mr. Liddy, whom Federal Reserve and Treasury officials recruited after A.I.G. faltered last September and received its first round of bailout money, said the bonuses and “retention pay” had been agreed to in early 2008 and were for the most part legally required.

The company told the Treasury that there were two categories of bonus payments, with the first to be given to senior executives. The administration official said Mr. Geithner had told A.I.G. to revise them to protect taxpayer dollars and tie future payments to performance.

The second group of bonuses cover some 2008 retention payments from contracts entered into before government involvement in A.I.G. that the company says it is legally obligated to fulfill. The official said Treasury concluded that those contracts could not be broken.

Indeed, in his letter to Mr. Geithner, Mr. Liddy wrote that he had shown the details of the $450 million bonus pool to outside lawyers and been told that A.I.G. had no choice but to follow through with the payment schedule.

A.I.G. did cut other bonuses, he explained in the letter, but those were part of the compensation for people who dealt in other parts of the company and had no direct involvement with the derivatives.

Ever since it was to be bailed out by the government last fall, A.I.G. has been defending itself against accusations that it was richly compensating people who caused what might be the biggest financial crisis in American history.

A.I.G.’s main business is insurance, but it had a unit called A.I.G. Financial Products that sold hundreds of billions of dollars’ worth of derivatives — the notorious credit-default swaps that nearly toppled the entire company last fall.

In his letter to the Treasury, Mr. Liddy said that A.I.G. was required to pay about $165 million in bonuses on or before March 15. The company had already paid $55 million in December, but the rest was about to come due.

The bonus plan covers 400 employees, and the bonuses range from as little as $1,000 to as much as $6.5 million. About seven executives at the financial products unit were entitled to receive more than $3 million in bonuses.

Under a deal reached this week, A.I.G. agreed that the top 50 executives in the financial products division would get half of the $9.6 million they were supposed to get by March 15. The second of their bonuses would be paid out in two installments in July in September. To get those payments, Treasury officials said, A.I.G. would have to show that it had made progress toward its goal of selling off business units and repaying the government.

A.I.G. had set up a special bonus pool for the financial products unit early in 2008, before the company’s near collapse, when problems stemming from the mortgage crisis were becoming clear and there were concerns that some of the best-informed derivatives specialists might leave. It locked in a total amount, $450 million, for the financial products unit and prepared to pay it in a series of installments, to encourage people to stay.

Only part of the payments had been made by last fall, when A.I.G. nearly collapsed. Another installment is due this month — to people who, it is now clear, were at the very heart of A.I.G.’s worldwide conflagration. The financial products unit is now being painstakingly wound down.
But remember, the free market determines executive pay! To cap it would cause a crippling shortage of business executives! (Principal agent problem? What principal agent problem? ... oh, heh, that principal agent problem. Jeeves, I thought I told you to put it in the closet before the guests arrived!)

Edit: I wrote a little fast. Apparently, it's contractually obligated. I think the present circumstances warrant voiding the contracts; these are the people whose irresponsibility caused the company to collapse, for christ's sake.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Keep in mind AIG signed these contracts when they were on the brink, when they had know they had fucked up and bad and were depseratly looking for ways to get rid of their bad assets before the market woke up to the fact that a good third of the money they were leveraged off of was based off worthless paper... Never mind the 30+ to 1 leveraging.

While they were on this "One wrong move and we are !@##$@$ screwed and they kindly sign bonus agreements for all the top employee's who fucked this up so bad to get them in the position to begin with.

Imagine a scenario where in someone is getting lets say a safety award when they've just hopped into the tub, toaster in one hand, power cord in the other. Poor planning has lead them to this point, they decided they wanted bathtub toast, now they've not plugged in that toaster yet but when you seem them about to, you might want to hold off on congratulating them on their brilliant safety record.

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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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If they think they can score sympathy points by reducing the rest of their salary for 2009 to $1 AFTER receiving several million dollars, then they are sorely mistaken.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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These people should be in jail. They must be completely divorced from reality to think they deserve these bonuses.

I can't imagine any other profession where you would get a bonus for a doing a shit job.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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bobalot wrote: I can't imagine any other profession where you would get a bonus for a doing a shit job.
You mean outside of the government?
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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DPDarkPrimus wrote:
bobalot wrote: I can't imagine any other profession where you would get a bonus for a doing a shit job.
You mean outside of the government?
:wtf:
DDDarkPrimus are you confusing government contractors with government workers? Because American Goverment workers sure as hell don't get bonuses for doing their job. There are retention awards for example if you re-sign up for the Marines you can get a nice chunk of change. But the head of the FBI does not get a bonus if his department catches lots of criminals. If your a DEA agent who finds two tons of cocaine in your off time, your going to get a shiny plaque of some kind but your not going to get a bonus.

When exactly do government workers get bonuses for fucking up? Hell when do they get bonuses for succeeding?


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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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I work for government. I sure as hell don't get bonuses.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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“We cannot attract and retain the best and the brightest talent to lead and staff the A.I.G. businesses — which are now being operated principally on behalf of American taxpayers — if employees believe their compensation is subject to continued arbitrary adjustment by the U.S. Treasury,” he wrote Mr. Geithner. The government owns nearly 80 percent of the company.
Did he say this with a straight face? If these are the "best and brightest" then we're better off disbanding the company. These are the guys responsible for putting AIG in the shitter! The company should fire them for incompetence, if not outright fraud followed by hauling them into court.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Contracts are subordinate to law. The government could simply pass a law voiding those contracts, if they were willing to do so.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Aren't bonuses generally tied to performance? You'd think any contract drawn up by someone with an ounce of common sense would void any bonus payment unless some sort of objective is reached, and "losing trillions" doesn't sound like the sort of objective a company would want to reach.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Bounty wrote:Aren't bonuses generally tied to performance? You'd think any contract drawn up by someone with an ounce of common sense would void any bonus payment unless some sort of objective is reached, and "losing trillions" doesn't sound like the sort of objective a company would want to reach.
Some professional athletes have salary incentives for simply playing a certain number of games, or achieving certain personal milestones, regardless of whether the team ends up winning or losing. A player can sometimes pick up huge bonuses even if his team finishes dead last.

The sad thing is that professional athlete contracts are usually far more logical than executive contracts, which even hand out huge payments for being so incompetent that they fire you.

PS. Some of these bonuses may have been tied to the company's balance sheets, which were greatly improved by the government bailout money. In other words, it's entirely possible that these executives actually got a taxpayer-funded bonus for taking taxpayer money.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Darth Wong wrote:Contracts are subordinate to law. The government could simply pass a law voiding those contracts, if they were willing to do so.
The Canadian government does that at will with its contracts with unions. Thats why no federal government union job is safe.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Ekiqa wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:Contracts are subordinate to law. The government could simply pass a law voiding those contracts, if they were willing to do so.
The Canadian government does that at will with its contracts with unions. Thats why no federal government union job is safe.
They don't do it enough. Maybe if federal government unionized employees actually feared for their jobs, they might get off their asses and work for a living.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Broomstick wrote:
“We cannot attract and retain the best and the brightest talent to lead and staff the A.I.G. businesses — which are now being operated principally on behalf of American taxpayers — if employees believe their compensation is subject to continued arbitrary adjustment by the U.S. Treasury,” he wrote Mr. Geithner. The government owns nearly 80 percent of the company.
Did he say this with a straight face? If these are the "best and brightest" then we're better off disbanding the company. These are the guys responsible for putting AIG in the shitter! The company should fire them for incompetence, if not outright fraud followed by hauling them into court.
More to the point though, where does the chairman get off telling the majority stakeholder that they don't have the right to adjust bonuses? The Treasury department owns 80% of AIG now--if the chairman isn't concerned about shareholder wishes then they need to swiftly kick his ass out of there.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

Post by Edi »

That's a clear case of where the Treasury should just tell them to shut the fuck up and adjust the bonuses unless they want to have legislation specifically crafted to make sure they do not make any bonuses for the next ten years.

The ownership structure of the company has changed as well, with the new owner providing the funds to actually enable the business to continue, so in that situation readjusting contractual bonuses by fiat is very well within the scope of changes the new owner may demand.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Mr Bean wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:
bobalot wrote: I can't imagine any other profession where you would get a bonus for a doing a shit job.
You mean outside of the government?
:wtf:
DDDarkPrimus are you confusing government contractors with government workers? Because American Goverment workers sure as hell don't get bonuses for doing their job. There are retention awards for example if you re-sign up for the Marines you can get a nice chunk of change. But the head of the FBI does not get a bonus if his department catches lots of criminals. If your a DEA agent who finds two tons of cocaine in your off time, your going to get a shiny plaque of some kind but your not going to get a bonus.

When exactly do government workers get bonuses for fucking up? Hell when do they get bonuses for succeeding?


I await your reply
I'm referring specifically to elected officials, from your local mayor's office and related departments all the way up to Congress. Up until just recently, they were able to pass bills to give themselves pay raises.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Congress hasn't been able to immediately raise their salaries for the current term since the last amendment (23rd?) to the Constitution. The pay raise happens only after the next election, so the voters can kick them out if they pull an AIG or Merrill Lynch.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Darth Wong wrote:Contracts are subordinate to law. The government could simply pass a law voiding those contracts, if they were willing to do so.
I find it quite amazing that this has not been done from the very beginning. Any bank, or whatever, that have to come begging for cash from the taxpayer is very clearly not run by people deserving any bonuses.

This is hardly a unique situation. We had a set of morons on the SE Bank over here that granted themselves payraises in the millions range to replace the crashed bonus system.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Darth Wong wrote:Contracts are subordinate to law. The government could simply pass a law voiding those contracts, if they were willing to do so.
Don't even bother with that. Don't pay them. They can sue for breech of contract. I'd love to put 12 people in a box and have these guys explain this. Fuck it, if they can convince the jury, give the lawyer double the contract owed. He deserves it.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Ender wrote:Don't even bother with that. Don't pay them. They can sue for breech of contract. I'd love to put 12 people in a box and have these guys explain this. Fuck it, if they can convince the jury, give the lawyer double the contract owed. He deserves it.
LOL! Tempting, but it is probably better to change the law than letting a jury ignore the law just because they don't like it.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Treas. Dept. told to block bonuses
WASHINGTON — President Obama vowed to try to stop the faltering insurance giant American International Group from paying out hundreds of millions of dollars in bonuses to executives, as the administration scrambled to avert a populist backlash against banks and Wall Street that could complicate Mr. Obama’s economic recovery agenda.

“In the last six months, A.I.G. has received substantial sums from the U.S. Treasury,” Mr. Obama said. He added that he had asked Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner “to use that leverage and pursue every single legal avenue to block these bonuses and make the American taxpayers whole.”

In strongly-worded remarks delivered in the White House East Room before small business owners, Mr. Obama called A.I.G. “a corporation that finds itself in financial distress due to recklessness and greed.”

“Under these circumstances, it’s hard to understand how derivative traders at A.I.G. warranted any bonuses at all, much less $165 million in extra pay,” Mr. Obama said. “How do they justify this outrage to the taxpayers who are keeping the company afloat?”

White House officials said that the administration is not looking to take A.I.G. to court to stop the company from paying out the bonuses. But they said the Treasury Department would be trying to figure out what it can do to block A.I.G. from making the payments within the legal confines of A.I.G.’s contractual obligations to the executives.

“All across the country, there are people who work hard and meet their responsibilities every day, without the benefit of government bailouts or multimillion-dollar bonuses,” said Mr. Obama, who called the issue one of “fundamental values.”

“All they ask is that everyone, from Main Street to Wall Street to Washington, play by the same rules,” he said, adding that the troubles with A.I.G. underscored the need for broad regulatory reform “so we don’t find ourselves in this position again.” His remarks were interrupted several times by applause from the audience of small-business owners.

The sharp presidential rebuke of A.I.G. is part of the White House effort to distance itself from abuses that could feed potentially disruptive public anger. Mr. Obama’s aides are worried that such anger could make it more difficult to win Congressional approval for the additional bailout packages that Mr. Obama has signaled may be necessary to stabilize the banking system. Already there have been moves in Congress to limit compensation for executives at banks and Wall Street firms that are receiving government help to survive.

Increasing the pressure on A.I.G., New York State Attorney General Andrew M. Cuomo demanded on Monday that the insurer release the names of the executives in A.I.G.’s Financial Products subsidiary who are to receive the bonuses, their job descriptions and details about their performance. In a letter to Edward M. Liddy, the company’s current chief executive, Mr. Cuomo said that if he did not receive the information by 4 p.m. he would issue subpoenas demanding compliance.

“We have requested the list of individuals who are to receive payments under this retention plan, as well as their positions at the firm, and it is surprising that you have yet to provide this information,” Mr. Cuomo said in the letter. “Covering up the details of these payments breeds further cynicism and distrust in our already shaken financial system.”

A.I.G. executives say that they are contractually obligated to pay the bonuses to their executives, including those who are part of the A.I.G. division where the company’s crisis originated.

The government’s rescue of the insurer began last fall with the Federal Reserve’s $85 billion emergency loan. The taxpayer assistance has now grown to $170 billion, and the government owns nearly 80 percent of the company. On Sunday, the company disclosed the names of dozens of financial institutions that benefited from the bailout money injected into A.I.G. that the insurer then paid out to satisfy financial contracts.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

Post by SirNitram »

IF the white-paper that was circuited was indeed from AIG and their negotiations with the Treasury, this is a serious problem: Withholding bonuses, or the departure by someone in a whiny, childish huff over it, constitutes a cross-default in those daft contracts AIGFP drew up for their derivatives.

Yes, they are subordinate to law. AIGFP deals in multiple countries, which would require international cooperation on this. Otherwise, the assholes are still holding the Sword Of Damocles.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

Post by Setzer »

I have this one question that won't go away. If Obama somehow managed to get an execution order passed for everyone who would receive these benefits, would his approval rating go up or down? And if so, by how much?
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

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Although people talk about stringing up the assholes, I don't think most folks would approve of actual execution for this.

Personally, I think being forced to perform hard labor in winter in New York City wearing no more than a loincloth and a "Former Executive of AIG" sign would be more appropriate, with barrels of rotten fruit at convenient locations for the populace to lob at them while verbally lashing them would give me some satisfaction but, alas, that would be unconstitutional and thus I can not officially approve of such a punishment.
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Re: AIG gives $100,000,000 in bonuses

Post by Surlethe »

Quick note: I read in the WSJ this evening that apparently, they're sending off a full $450m to execs in the financial products dept., not a mere $100m.
A Government founded upon justice, and recognizing the equal rights of all men; claiming higher authority for existence, or sanction for its laws, that nature, reason, and the regularly ascertained will of the people; steadily refusing to put its sword and purse in the service of any religious creed or family is a standing offense to most of the Governments of the world, and to some narrow and bigoted people among ourselves.
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