I really cannot think of any other professional group that would dare to try to get away with this kind of shit.Associated Press wrote:The Spanish government said late Friday it would allow its military to take over control of airspace if air traffic controllers did not return to work from a massive sickout that left hundreds of thousands of travelers stranded.
The government called on controllers to resume work "immediately" or "defense will assume control of airspace," it said in a statement.
The sickout on Friday, on the eve of a long national holiday weekend, caused travel chaos throughout the nation, forcing Spanish authorities to close eight airports, including the major European hub in Madrid and airspace above it.
The controllers left their posts amid a lengthy dispute over working conditions and just hours after the administration of Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero approved an austerity measure to partially privatize airports, and to hand over management of Madrid and Barcelona airports to the private sector.
Spain's air traffic authority, known as Aena, estimated that 200,000 people were affected by disrupted flights, and angry passengers complained they were left with no information on when they might be able to head to their destinations.
By 9 p.m., five hours after the sickout began, Spanish flagship carrier Iberia said it had canceled all of its flights out of Madrid until 11 a.m. Saturday.
"It's a disgrace, how can a group of people be so selfish as to wreck the plans of so many people?" said dentist Marcela Vega, 35, stuck at Madrid airport unable to travel to Chile with her husband, 5-year-old son and baby boy.
Aena issued an advisory telling all passengers planning to take flights to stay away from airports because "air traffic has been interrupted." There was no immediate word when the sickout might end.
Spanish media reported that a few international flights were landing at the Madrid airport, but that some passengers waited for hours in planes ready for takeoff before the planes returned to gates so the passengers could disembark.
Aena said Spanish government authorities were in contact with Europe's air traffic agency, Eurocontrol and the United State's FAA about how best to deal with international flights arriving from across the Atlantic. The controllers could face disciplinary action or criminal charges, said Aena chief Juan Ignacio Lema, who called the situation "intolerable" and asked controllers to return to work.
"We're asking the controllers to stop blackmailing the Spanish people," Lema said.
Thousands were camped out in Madrid's airport Friday night, not knowing whether their flights would leave or not.
"It's unbelievable, total chaos, nobody knows what to do," said computer technician Roberto Sanchez, 28, planning on spending the long weekend in Italy.
Spain's air traffic controllers have been involved for over a year in bitter negotiations with state-owned Aena over wages, working conditions and privileges.
The dispute intensified in February when the government restricted overtime and thus cut average pay of controllers from €350,000 ($463,610) a year to around €200,000 ($264,920).
The sickout also closed four airports in the Canary islands, a favorite winter destination in Europe, and airports in prime tourism locations of Ibiza, Palma de Mallorca and Menorca.
Spanish Development Minister Jose Blanco convened an emergency meeting and his ministry issued a terse statement, saying "controllers have begun to communicate their incapacity to continue offering their services, abandoning their places of work."
Blanco later told reporters that authorities were forced to close airspace around Madrid for safety reasons, and that the government was putting into place an emergency action plan. But he gave no details on when airports would reopen and flights might resume.
"We won't permit this blackmail that they are using to turn citizens into hostages," Blanco said
The controllers' union has been complaining for weeks that members have already worked their maximum hours for all of 2010, and that the country's 2,000 controllers are overworked and understaffed. Friday's sickout was not expected, but the union has warned it could mount a sickout over the Christmas holiday. They are prohibited by law from going on strike.
Aena said 90 percent of its controllers had left their workstations and that only 10 controllers remained on duty at Madrid's Barajas to handle emergencies.
Madrid's Barajas airport had 1,300 flights scheduled for Friday, but it wasn't clear how many had taken off and landed before the sickout.
For all of Spain, more than 5,000 flights were scheduled for the nation and about 3,000 had taken off or landed before the sickout began in the late afternoon.
Monday and Wednesday are national holidays in Spain, and many Spaniards use the period to take a five-day weekend.
Aena calculated that around 4 million people had booked flights for this period.
Many weekend sporting events were likely to be affected by air travel problems, with football league leader Barcelona set to travel by road and rail to Osasuna, the club said, while Valencia was to take the train to play against Real Madrid.
———
Alan Clendenning and Jorge Sainz contributed from Madrid.
Copyright 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
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Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Railway employees would dare (and succeed).
Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
See, this is a problematic case. How are traffic controllers to exercise collective bargaining if they have no ability to go on strike? On the other hand, how can society function if public services can be shut down? I don't think that this is so clear-cut as evil, greedy unions vs. a saintly employers. After all, if they have no ability to bargain, then they can be exploited easily and are completely dependent on the goodwill of their employer (and without strikes or walkouts, unions have very little with which to bargain). While this is bad for people trying to leave or enter Spain by air, and would be similarly bad for police, transit employees, et al, how exactly should this be resolved, in general?
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Well, the thing is, they can't reasonably punish a significant number of them, since they're so vital. Moreover, its a pretty fair argument that they're already being exploited by their employer if they're being required to work more than the maximum amount of allowed overtime, as the article suggests. Sure, they're getting payed hundreds of thousands of Euros on average, apparently, but earning lots of money is pretty pointless if you're at work all the time. Honestly, I think they would have had more success just refusing to work any longer than their contracted hours; they'd lose out on the overtime, but they wouldn't be breaking the law, and if they're as understaffed and overworked as they say, that would still cause complete chaos.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
If they worked the maximum hours they were suppose to have, is it even legal in Spain to make them continue working? They are essentially telling them to work for free.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Depends how they're employed. If their job is recognized as an "essential service" by the government, they could be ordered to do overtime with less limits than your average job and have less options to protest. Especially if the government declares state of alert or state of emergency, when essential services' personnel can be ordered to do their duty 7/24 if needed(depends on the exact laws and regulations, but then you'd better have some ironclad excuse if you don't get to work). Probably this is why they went on strike by calling in sick, rather than going on strike. Depending on the local strike law, your union have to announce the strike days/weeks ahead to be it legal, essential services, armed services and other special sectors(ex. law enforcement) has further limits on their ability to go on strike.Soontir C'boath wrote:If they worked the maximum hours they were suppose to have, is it even legal in Spain to make them continue working? They are essentially telling them to work for free.
The Spanish government tries to use state of alert to break the strike:
BBC wrote: 4 December 2010 Last updated at 15:06 GMT
Spain in state of alert over air strike chaos
The Spanish government has declared a state of alert after a strike by air traffic controllers grounded flights, stranding thousands of travellers.
The measures allow wildcat strikers to be charged with an offence of disobedience, and controllers began returning to work in the afternoon.
Works minister Jose Blanco warned that disruption could last up to 48 hours.
Officials said 250,000 people had been affected by the walkout, amid a long-running dispute about working hours.
Mr Blanco said all Spanish airspace had now reopened, but "normality will take some time, between 24 and 48 hours, if the controllers return to work as they must".
Almost all flights in and out of the country have been cancelled until Sunday morning.
The BBC's Sarah Rainsford in Madrid says there are huge crowds of passengers at Spain's airports, many hoping to get away at the start of a national holiday, many of them frustrated and angry.
The army was called in to take charge of the country's airspace on Friday, but they do not have the training to direct air traffic.
Austerity drive
Announcing the first state of alert since the end of military rule in 1975, Deputy Prime Minister Alfredo Perez Rubalcaba said the air traffic controllers were trying to protect "unacceptable privileges".
The government has stepped in with the firmest possible measures. For the first time ever, the government has declared a state of alert in Spain, with immediate effect.
This means air traffic controllers are officially mobilised. If they refuse to work they will be committing the crime of disobedience according to Spain's military penal code.
These are extremely tough measures being taken by the government, which says the controllers are holding the country hostage and that is unacceptable.
The controllers can earn 350,000 euros ($470,000; £297,000). There is not a lot of sympathy for them in a country with 20% unemployment.
"Our airports are still at a standstill, and according to the Spanish constitution, the government is imposing a state of alert," Mr Rubalcaba said.
"The immediate effect is that the controllers are are now under orders to go back to work and can be charged with a crime under the military penal code if they refuse. The state of alert will initially last for 15 days."
Our correspondent says the controllers could be charged with disobedience, but it is not clear what sentence any conviction would carry.
Some flights were operating to parts of Spain, including the Canary Islands and Majorca, but flagship carrier Iberia and budget airline Ryanair said they were cancelling all their flights until Sunday morning.
Iberia warned people not to travel to airports and said travellers at airports should leave if they could.
The controllers' unsanctioned action began Friday afternoon in Madrid, with staff calling in sick.
It spread across the nation, forcing travellers to find last-minute hotel rooms or sleep on airport floors. Some passengers were taken by coach to their destinations.
The controllers were already involved in a dispute about their working hours, but were further angered by austerity measures passed by the government on Friday as Spain tries to cut its budget deficit.
"We have reached our limit mentally with the new decree approved this morning obliging us to work more hours," said Jorge Ontiveros, a spokesman for the Syndicate Union of Air Controllers.
"We took the decision individually, which then spread to other colleagues who stopped work because they cannot carry on like this. In this situation we cannot control planes."
'Hostages'
The head of airport authority AENA, Juan Ignacio Lema, said the strike was "intolerable", and told the controllers to "stop blackmailing the Spanish people".
Stranded Briton Keith Beevor: "Everyone's just putting up with it"
Some were left stranded on runways as their planes had to turn back.
One woman at Barajas airport said it was "a disgrace". "How can a group of people be so selfish as to wreck the plans of so many people?"
Another traveller at Barajas airport said: "All flights are blocked, there's a huge lot of people here, sitting around everywhere. Right now everyone is calm, but we don't know what's happening."
A passenger stuck in a plane at Palma told Spanish radio: "The captain came out to say Spanish airspace had suddenly shut, with no prior warning."
Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Unless the air traffic controllers are being worked ridiculously long hours, I don't have or foresee much sympathy for them. Six-figure salaries would be more than sufficient compensation for most jobs that require long hours and/or sufficient risk to the person or people they are directing. Is it really something as simple as long work hours, or is there something else contributing to their refusal to work?
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
The breaking point seems to be that they were ordered to work even more unpaid overtime. I mean, is a six-figure salary really worth it if you a) work (assuming an eight-hour workday) fourteen hours, and are only paid for those eight? That's what the earlier cuts in overtime meant. Now imagine that you go to sixteen hours, while still only getting paid for eight. Is that still mitigated completely by six figures? This is going from the 43% drop in income from reducing overtime pay, which indicates that overtime was about equal to 75% of normal working hours, before the increase in unpaid overtime which prompted this.Balrog wrote:Unless the air traffic controllers are being worked ridiculously long hours, I don't have or foresee much sympathy for them. Six-figure salaries would be more than sufficient compensation for most jobs that require long hours and/or sufficient risk to the person or people they are directing. Is it really something as simple as long work hours, or is there something else contributing to their refusal to work?
Frankly, the government should ideally negotiate- if they want austerity, probably trading pay cuts for shorter hours and more controllers would be better than forcing the controllers back to work and precipitating further battles.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Republicans?Murazor wrote:
I really cannot think of any other professional group that would dare to try to get away with this kind of shit.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Am I the only one that really doesn't like the idea of massive amounts of overtime for air traffic controllers?
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
If they are facing a steep pay cut on top of more hours, and are as understaffed as they say they are, I can understand why they did this. If you make it illegal to strike and then cut pay and increase hours while not addressing their staffing issue you shouldn't be surprised if you get a strike, however they go about it.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
No.Keevan_Colton wrote:Am I the only one that really doesn't like the idea of massive amounts of overtime for air traffic controllers?
Also the government plans to privatize airports, which (depending the legalities) can prevent them to sue the new management for their currently unpaid overtime and the new owners' reorganizations could result in worse working conditions than now. Like your usual cost cutting measures, which resulted in the Überlingen disaster for example.Bakustra wrote:The breaking point seems to be that they were ordered to work even more unpaid overtime. I mean, is a six-figure salary really worth it if you a) work (assuming an eight-hour workday) fourteen hours, and are only paid for those eight? That's what the earlier cuts in overtime meant. Now imagine that you go to sixteen hours, while still only getting paid for eight. Is that still mitigated completely by six figures? This is going from the 43% drop in income from reducing overtime pay, which indicates that overtime was about equal to 75% of normal working hours, before the increase in unpaid overtime which prompted this.Balrog wrote:Unless the air traffic controllers are being worked ridiculously long hours, I don't have or foresee much sympathy for them. Six-figure salaries would be more than sufficient compensation for most jobs that require long hours and/or sufficient risk to the person or people they are directing. Is it really something as simple as long work hours, or is there something else contributing to their refusal to work?
Frankly, the government should ideally negotiate- if they want austerity, probably trading pay cuts for shorter hours and more controllers would be better than forcing the controllers back to work and precipitating further battles.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Bakustra wrote:The breaking point seems to be that they were ordered to work even more unpaid overtime. I mean, is a six-figure salary really worth it if you a) work (assuming an eight-hour workday) fourteen hours, and are only paid for those eight? That's what the earlier cuts in overtime meant. Now imagine that you go to sixteen hours, while still only getting paid for eight. Is that still mitigated completely by six figures? This is going from the 43% drop in income from reducing overtime pay, which indicates that overtime was about equal to 75% of normal working hours, before the increase in unpaid overtime which prompted this.Balrog wrote:Unless the air traffic controllers are being worked ridiculously long hours, I don't have or foresee much sympathy for them. Six-figure salaries would be more than sufficient compensation for most jobs that require long hours and/or sufficient risk to the person or people they are directing. Is it really something as simple as long work hours, or is there something else contributing to their refusal to work?
Frankly, the government should ideally negotiate- if they want austerity, probably trading pay cuts for shorter hours and more controllers would be better than forcing the controllers back to work and precipitating further battles.
I dunno, there are always tradeoffs when it comes to salary-from the perspective of someone struggling to just get by, I don't think people who make six figures should complain *at all* (class resentment works all ways).
I do agree with this.See, this is a problematic case. How are traffic controllers to exercise collective bargaining if they have no ability to go on strike?
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
I work in the government railways (Australia). Pay is shittier than private industry (which is why our best and brightest get continually pouched) but you make it up in overtime.Cecelia5578 wrote:Bakustra wrote:The breaking point seems to be that they were ordered to work even more unpaid overtime. I mean, is a six-figure salary really worth it if you a) work (assuming an eight-hour workday) fourteen hours, and are only paid for those eight? That's what the earlier cuts in overtime meant. Now imagine that you go to sixteen hours, while still only getting paid for eight. Is that still mitigated completely by six figures? This is going from the 43% drop in income from reducing overtime pay, which indicates that overtime was about equal to 75% of normal working hours, before the increase in unpaid overtime which prompted this.Balrog wrote:Unless the air traffic controllers are being worked ridiculously long hours, I don't have or foresee much sympathy for them. Six-figure salaries would be more than sufficient compensation for most jobs that require long hours and/or sufficient risk to the person or people they are directing. Is it really something as simple as long work hours, or is there something else contributing to their refusal to work?
Frankly, the government should ideally negotiate- if they want austerity, probably trading pay cuts for shorter hours and more controllers would be better than forcing the controllers back to work and precipitating further battles.
I dunno, there are always tradeoffs when it comes to salary-from the perspective of someone struggling to just get by, I don't think people who make six figures should complain *at all* (class resentment works all ways).
The problem is when you work shitloads of overtime, you basically have no life. You eat shittier because you are too tired to make lunches in advance, you barely get to see friends and family, you feel fucking tired all the time and more prone to make mistakes (always a bad thing near 200 tonne vehicles), it's hard to get shit done around the house, etc.
Normally, I would have said these guys are self entitled douchebags. However, I do sympathise with the fact that they are being to forced to unpaid overtime.
And quite frankly, what the government is doing appears to be dangerous. In recent times (except in emergencies) in the rail industry in my state, overtime limited because of fatigue management. People realised that having tired people work on the railways is dangerous.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
I have essentially zero sympathy for either the government (whose erratic economic policies deserve a gigantic rant) or the controllers, since the guys have quite a few additional demands besides the economic and they haven't budged after a year of negotiations:Balrog wrote:Unless the air traffic controllers are being worked ridiculously long hours, I don't have or foresee much sympathy for them. Six-figure salaries would be more than sufficient compensation for most jobs that require long hours and/or sufficient risk to the person or people they are directing. Is it really something as simple as long work hours, or is there something else contributing to their refusal to work?
-They want to retire with their full salaries at the ripe old age of 52 and get paid at overtime rates, if they have to call them back because of sudden personnel shortages.
-They want to have absolute freedom to decide their work hours, regardless of the needs of the service.
-They want their syndicate to have the final say in hiring standards, training methods and firing procedures.
Considering this and even if we ignore their extremely generous salaries, the guys are behaving like money grubbing blackmailers. If somebody deserves sympathy here, it would be the people who have had their travels disrupted with this strike.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Final salary pension might be going out of style, but it's not unreasonable. Also, 52 would only be a couple of years lower than the required retirement age (56) for ATC in the USA. There's a case to be made for earlier retirement for ATC since a small fuck up will kill people...frankly overworked and/or infirm ATC staff would be a bigger threat than any terrorist attack in real terms.Murazor wrote:-They want to retire with their full salaries at the ripe old age of 52 and get paid at overtime rates, if they have to call them back because of sudden personnel shortages.
I'd have to see the exact terms they're talking about to comment on that. However, the ability to refuse a shift ought to be there since subpar performance can potentially be lethal...there should be sufficient redundancy in the system to allow for this.-They want to have absolute freedom to decide their work hours, regardless of the needs of the service.
Who currently sets the standards, training requirements and firing procedures?-They want their syndicate to have the final say in hiring standards, training methods and firing procedures.
What controls are there in place for them and are there plans to hand them over to private enterprise? I recall writing a piece a few years back about how terrifying the "just in time" business model would be applied to ATC.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Not true. Ronald Reagan fired 11,000 out of roughly 13,000 FAA air traffic controllers in 1981 after they went on a strike which was explicitly illegal. The system was reestablished very quickly using the non strikers, new hires and military controllers. Since basically all air traffic control in the world is done in English the Spanish would be able to hire people from anywhere in the EU very easily as replacements.Psychic_Sandwich wrote:Well, the thing is, they can't reasonably punish a significant number of them, since they're so vital.
It’s thus no surprise that the Spanish controllers are refusing to actually risk calling a formal strike in favor of bullshitting call in sick tactics. If they called a real strike the Spanish would just replace them as they are threatening.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
*insert part of gigantic rant here*Keevan_Colton wrote:Who currently sets the standards, training requirements and firing procedures?
The legal framework was provided by a 1998 decree that got modified last year, in part because of the controllers refusing to change their positions in the negotiation. The old entry requirements included a college degree of some kind and perfect pronuntiation of English. Now they are accepting applicants with just high school diplomas and good but not perfect (accented) English, since the reformed law contemplates language training after getting started with the job.
Essentially, the Spanish government is heavily indebted and in dire need of some cash to keep the debtor wolves away some more months. Since the public companies got largely dismantled to get the budget surplus that allowed Spain to enter the Euro, the gov is going to sell out the lotto and the airports. Not sure if air control is included in the transference or whether it is a mere lease of the airport facilities that actually yield benefits.What controls are there in place for them and are there plans to hand them over to private enterprise? I recall writing a piece a few years back about how terrifying the "just in time" business model would be applied to ATC.
Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
If they can replace their entire ATC staff that easily, why not hire more so no one needs to work overtime?
Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
The whole thing essentially comes back to the Spanish government being essentially strapped for cash. Also, since they are sitting upon a powder keg of 20% unemployment, a massive layoff of public sector workers would make them no friends. Even if it is air controllers getting the boot.Darmalus wrote:If they can replace their entire ATC staff that easily, why not hire more so no one needs to work overtime?
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
That was, what, thirty years ago? I presume that there are more people using commercial aeroplanes now, probably a lot more. Wikipedia says that growth has been an average of 5 to 6 percent since 1980, but, being Wikipedia, I don't know how accurate that is. If it even remotely reflects reality, then there's considerably more than twice as many people flying, and thus a lot more planes, now than there was then. It is conceivable that it might not be possible now even if it was in 1981, especially given that they were commenting on the news earlier today that this is screwing over airports all over Western Europe.Not true. Ronald Reagan fired 11,000 out of roughly 13,000 FAA air traffic controllers in 1981 after they went on a strike which was explicitly illegal. The system was reestablished very quickly using the non strikers, new hires and military controllers. Since basically all air traffic control in the world is done in English the Spanish would be able to hire people from anywhere in the EU very easily as replacements.
It’s thus no surprise that the Spanish controllers are refusing to actually risk calling a formal strike in favor of bullshitting call in sick tactics. If they called a real strike the Spanish would just replace them as they are threatening.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Spain cannot have more then a small fraction of the air traffic controllers the US does because it’s absurdly smaller, and meanwhile the EU has a far larger population base to hire people from then 1981 US. If the US could find 10,000 replacements back then growth in air traffic should mean it’s even easier to find replacements now in this situation because the total pool should be larger. Planes BTW have grown considerably in average size since 1981 with the phase out of most of the worlds 707 swarms and similar early generation jetliners. Replace a 707 with a 747 and you can haul twice as many people with the exact same air traffic control requirement. Air traffic has certainly grown a lot, but I’m not seeing any logical reason why firing should be impossible. After all if job loss wasn’t a threat, then why wouldn’t these guys have just gone on a formal strike in the first place? Wildcat strikes usually mean the strikers are very uncertain of the position they hold. All the more so in a nation with an economy heavily based on tourists and thus air travel when any protracted disruption would be totally unacceptable.Psychic_Sandwich wrote:
That was, what, thirty years ago? I presume that there are more people using commercial aeroplanes now, probably a lot more. Wikipedia says that growth has been an average of 5 to 6 percent since 1980, but, being Wikipedia, I don't know how accurate that is. If it even remotely reflects reality, then there's considerably more than twice as many people flying, and thus a lot more planes, now than there was then. It is conceivable that it might not be possible now even if it was in 1981, especially given that they were commenting on the news earlier today that this is screwing over airports all over Western Europe.
The reason all of Western Europe gets screwed up is because physically, they had to fly around Spanish air space, and many planes became trapped on Spanish airfields, but in general aircraft making long distance flights in fixed corridors are much less demanding for controllers then aircraft engaged in take off and landing cycles around airport airspace. So a lot of that traffic isn't going to be super demanding to controllers.
Last edited by Sea Skimmer on 2010-12-04 05:51pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
The Spanish government is strapped for cash. Okay. So why is it more economical to pay overtime wages for overworked employees than it is to hire someone else and pay them for the extra hours at standard wages? Overtime only makes sense if A) you only need a few more hours from your employees, which doesn't appear to be the case here, or B) you can't find any additional workers to pick up the slack and thus need to overwork the ones you do have, which also doesn't appear to be the case here.
Also, fuck the entire idea of mandatory unpaid overtime in the ear. Seriously.
Also, fuck the entire idea of mandatory unpaid overtime in the ear. Seriously.
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Out of Context Theatre, this week starring Darth Nostril.
-'If you really want to fuck with these idiots tell them that there is a vaccine for chemtrails.'
Fiction!: The Final War (Bolo/Lovecraft) (Ch 7 9/15/11), Living (D&D, Complete)
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Ever heard of job benefits? Overtime means more pay per hour, but benefits and pension costs stay the same because it’s still only one employee. Government worker benefits in Western Europe are very generous. This is nothing new or really even European specific, the Philadelphia Police department does the exact same thing, working the cops harder rather then hiring more of them.White Haven wrote:The Spanish government is strapped for cash. Okay. So why is it more economical to pay overtime wages for overworked employees than it is to hire someone else and pay them for the extra hours at standard wages?
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
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Re: Air controllers allegedly sick, Spanish airspace closed
Well, I bet most of the internal communications are still in Spanish, so hiring non-Spanish speakers would be very suboptimal and potentially dangerous. Furthermore, I doubt the government could fire the controllers legally if they called a formal legal strike. That's the whole point of legal strikes: they are not grounds for termination. Or at least that's how it works in countries with actual worker rightsSea Skimmer wrote:Not true. Ronald Reagan fired 11,000 out of roughly 13,000 FAA air traffic controllers in 1981 after they went on a strike which was explicitly illegal. The system was reestablished very quickly using the non strikers, new hires and military controllers. Since basically all air traffic control in the world is done in English the Spanish would be able to hire people from anywhere in the EU very easily as replacements.Psychic_Sandwich wrote:Well, the thing is, they can't reasonably punish a significant number of them, since they're so vital.
It’s thus no surprise that the Spanish controllers are refusing to actually risk calling a formal strike in favor of bullshitting call in sick tactics. If they called a real strike the Spanish would just replace them as they are threatening.
However, illegal strikes could be a legal reason for termination, but probably only if they last very long or are repeated. Anyways, that was the case even in the case of the US FAA strike in 1981. I don't really know but I doubt Ronnie could have fired them if they had gone on a legal strike instead, but not knowing their terms I don't know if they even had that option.