Canadians thwart train terror threat

[TimothyC]

Alleged terror plot targeting Via train thwarted
RCMP outline joint operation involving CSIS, U.S. authorities and local police
By Greg Weston, National Affairs Specialist, CBC News
Posted: Apr 22, 2013 1:44 PM ET
Last Updated: Apr 22, 2013 4:00 PM ET

Canadian police say they have arrested two men and thwarted a plot to carry out a major terrorist attack on a Via passenger train in the Greater Toronto Area.

The two accused are Chiheb Esseghaier, 30, of Montreal and Raed Jaser, 35, from Toronto. They have been charged with conspiracy to carry out a terrorist attack and "conspiring to murder persons unknownn for the benefit of, at the direction of, or in association with a terrorist group."

The two men arrested are not Canadian citizens, police said.

The RCMP accuses the two men of conspiring to commit "al-Qaeda-supported" attack. Chief Supt. Jennifer Strachan said the two suspects watched trains and railways in the Greater Toronto Area.

"We are alleging that these two individuals took steps and conducted activities to initiate a terrorist attack," she told reporters.

Strachan said the attack was in the planning state but "not imminent."

In a statement, RCMP said while they believe the individuals accused had the "capacity and intent" to carry out an attack, they believed there was "no imminent threat" to the public, rail employees, train passengers or infrastructure.

The two men are expected to appear at Old City Hall courthouse in Toronto tomorrow.

Had this plot been carried out, it would have resulted in innocent people being killed or seriously injured, RCMP assistant Commissioner Jammies Malizia told reporters on Monday.

Police said the investigation was ongoing, but declined to provide details.

Highly placed sources tell CBC News the alleged plotters have been under surveillance for more than a year in Quebec and southern Ontario.

The investigation was part of a cross-border operation involving Canadian law enforcement agencies, the FBI and the U.S. Department of Homeland Security.

According to a Reuters report, U.S. law enforcement and national security sources said the alleged plot targeted a railroad between Toronto and New York City.

The arrests Monday morning were co-ordinated and executed by a special joint task force of RCMP and CSIS anti-terrorism units, combined with provincial and municipal police forces in Ontario and Quebec.

The RCMP are expected to hold a press conference Monday afternoon to announce the arrests and provide details of the alleged plot, and give an overview of the extensive police and intelligence operation.

Law enforcement officials say the terror suspects arrested today have no connection to the two brothers accused of last week's Boston Marathon bombings.

They also say there is no tie to the former London, Ont., high school friends who joined al-Qaeda and died earlier this year while helping to stage a bloody attack on an Algerian gas refinery.

Alleged plot recalls Toronto 18 case

Sources say the alleged plot disrupted by Monday's arrests was potentially more dangerous than the bombings and hostage-takings planned by the so-called Toronto 18.

That plot was broken up in the summer of 2006, when police arrested 18 people in a massive anti-terrorism sweep in southern Ontario.

Eleven of the 18 were subsequently convicted of aiding the group in various plots, ranging from blowing up the Peace Tower on Parliament Hill and the Toronto Stock Exchange with trucks laden with explosives to beheading the prime minister and other politicians.

The group never got a chance to execute any of its plans before being arrested when one of its members took delivery of what they thought were three tonnes of explosive fertilizer to be used in truck bombs. Undercover agents had replaced the shipment with harmless chemicals.

Four are serving sentences of 18 years to life in prison, while the other seven received terms ranging from 30 months to just over seven years.

More recently, three Canadian citizens were arrested in August, 2010 — two Ottawa men and a London, Ont. doctor — and charged with knowingly facilitating a terrorist activity.

One of them, Hiva Alizadeh, was also charged with possession of more than 50 circuit boards allegedly to be used as remote detonators for bombs.

The cases involving those three have yet to go to court.

Thanks Canada!

[Sea Skimmer]

I've been wondering when someone would try to clone the Sunset Limited attack; thank god like most terrorists these clears were completely fucking retarded.

[Phantasee]

Conveniently revealed right as the Feds suspend private member business (as Mondays have traditionally been reserved) to lock up its counter terrorism bill without discussion.

[Phantasee]

OTTAWA – On the day the Conservatives brought back a stringent anti-terrorism bill for debate in Parliament, the RCMP arrested two men and charged them with allegedly conspiring to carry out a terrorist attack against a VIA rail train.

MPs spent Monday morning debating Bill S-7, first introduced in the Senate last February, which increases powers for investigating terrorism.

The Conservative bill brings back two provisions first introduced by Jean Chretien’s Liberal government after 9-11 and then “sunsetted” or expired five years ago.

Bill S-7 would allow for preventative detention of a suspect for three days without charge. It would also bring back investigative hearings, meaning someone who is suspected of having knowledge about terrorism must answer questions with the risk of going to jail for up to 12 months if they refuse. And it would make it illegal to leave the country with the intent of plotting or committing an act of terrorism – such as going to an al-Qaida training camp.

Monday afternoon, RCMP announced they had arrested two men who allegedly plotted to derail a VIA passenger train, claiming the men received “direction and guidance” from al-Qaida elements in Iran.

http://globalnews.ca/news/502383/mps-de ... st-attack/

[Phantasee]

PS lol at al-Qaeda in Iran… because Wahabbist Sunnis are totally operating out of KSA's regional rival Iran, *I'm a smarmy asshole*

[Aaron MkII]

So...they bust two guys using our existing laws but we need to reintroduce shit that was allowed to expire while the Cons were in office? For what?

The "answer or off to the pokey" thing reeks as well. Do I get legal representation? What exactly would your rights be in that situation.

Bonus points for the creepy ass picture of Vic Toews in the article.

[Thanas]

Well, we had some attempted train bombings in Germany a while back. Link.

[loomer]

So...they bust two guys using our existing laws but we need to reintroduce shit that was allowed to expire while the Cons were in office? For what?

The "answer or off to the pokey" thing reeks as well. Do I get legal representation? What exactly would your rights be in that situation.

Bonus points for the creepy ass picture of Vic Toews in the article.

Assuming the law doesn't touch that right, yes, you'd be able to get legal representation. The problem is that if counsel is present and you ask them if you can not answer something, not only will they say 'no' but that will be considered incriminating in and of itself since this law would strip away the right to silence and to not have refusal to answer be construed as evidence of guilt.

[Aaron MkII]

Interesting. I wonder if it will survive the inevitable supreme court challenge once someone gets charged under it.

[Fiji_Fury]

What's detestable about this bill is that the RCMP and CSIS have, over the past many years, uncovered and arrested a small number of terror plots, thus preventing terror attacks in Canada, and all without the "benefit" of these additional legal powers. Had the security, investigation and legal system failed up to now the Government of Canada might have a point about introducing new legislation and powers for police/investigators. But it hasn't. These powers do impact civil rights. Trust the Conservatives to create something that could negatively impact Canadians and cost future heaps of money to debate in court without a real need.

This is all part of their "tough on crime, tough leadership" bullshit. The powers are unecessary and the Conservative majority in government won't want to actually debate the meaningful consequences of just such a law. Hell, the last time these powers were in effect the RCMP had the integrity NOT TO USE THEM. What's the Conservative excuse? More ideologically driven rhetoric coming up in 3... 2... 1...

[Aaron MkII]

Look, the Harper government (remember when everyone just called our government "the government" or "the canadian government"?) knows whats best for you, citizen.

[Coop D'etat]

So...they bust two guys using our existing laws but we need to reintroduce shit that was allowed to expire while the Cons were in office? For what?

The "answer or off to the pokey" thing reeks as well. Do I get legal representation? What exactly would your rights be in that situation.

Bonus points for the creepy ass picture of Vic Toews in the article.

Assuming the law doesn't touch that right, yes, you'd be able to get legal representation. The problem is that if counsel is present and you ask them if you can not answer something, not only will they say 'no' but that will be considered incriminating in and of itself since this law would strip away the right to silence and to not have refusal to answer be construed as evidence of guilt.

How would asking counsel that be considered evidence of guilt? The bill doesn't strip any rights to counsel, and the right for silence not be interpreted as guilt is compelled by Charter section 7. They also can't force self incriminating testimony, that's a right guaranteed by Charter section 13. Which means if your testimony in another person's trial is compelled it cannot be used against you in you own trial, not the right to refuse to answer the question. You don't have a general right to silence under Canadian law though. Canadian rights in this area being weaker than, their American equivalents, you also don't have the right to refuse questioning by the police without an attorney for example.

What this bill does is do is force you to testify against somebody else at one of those hearings.

[Aaron MkII]

We don't? I realize military law is somewhat different then the Criminal Code but I have twice refused to say anything to the Military Police on the advice of the duty JAG who was not present. And usually the QR&O's are harsher the CC.

[Aaron MkII]

Ahh, I see now. Disregard.

[Coop D'etat]

We don't? I realize military law is somewhat different then the Criminal Code but I have twice refused to say anything to the Military Police on the advice of the duty JAG who was not present. And usually the QR&O's are harsher the CC.

Its exactly that, under American law the would not have been allowed to continue questioning until your lawyer was present. Under Canadian law they can keep on going. Which is why the one and only thing a good Canadian lawyer says to their new client is "shut up until I get there."

Basically, you have the right not to talk, but the police have the right to continually badger you. And you don't have a right to your attorney's presence in future interviews either, or to reconsult counsel during the interview.

[Aaron MkII]

Thank you, I appreciate the clarification.