In the second friendly-fire incident of its kind so far, US military sources say one of their F-16 warplanes fired on a battery of Patriot missiles in Iraq after the battery's radar locked on to the plane. No one was injured.
Now that's how to deal with trigger-happy friendly-fire units. If that doesn't encorage the Patriot crews to be more careful about what they shoot at, nothing will.
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Montcalm wrote:Advertisment for patriot missile(When you`re not sure shoot it anyway)
That's how air defenses work when on high alert. The batteries have maybe two minutes to deal with incoming targets. They haven't said what caused the Tornado shoot down. But I'd bet a failed IFF or a plane outside its assigned corridor before I'd go with an error on the ground.
That sort of thing happens all the times in exercises, course no one generally dies. Even with the system working correctly 99.95% of the time, when you figure that several thousand sorties have been flown one aircraft down isn't that bad.
This incident was probably an equipment or pilot error; ESM should have told him it was friendly if he went to launch a HARM.
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
Sea Skimmer wrote:...before I'd go with an error on the ground.
Well, one time in the previous Gulf War, a Patriot launched itself and self-destructed itself after a few seconds flight time.
Stuff like that happens. Naval SAM's generally have pressurized water system that blast the rocket motor apart if it ignites accidentally. But that's not practical with towed launchers. I'm wondering if the launch and explode clear thing is actually a safety system to avoid the whole multi round launcher exploding and taking out part of the battery if a rocket motor ignites
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
Sea Skimmer wrote:...before I'd go with an error on the ground.
Well, one time in the previous Gulf War, a Patriot launched itself and self-destructed itself after a few seconds flight time.
Stuff like that happens. Naval SAM's generally have pressurized water system that blast the rocket motor apart if it ignites accidentally. But that's not practical with towed launchers. I'm wondering if the launch and explode clear thing is actually a safety system to avoid the whole multi round launcher exploding and taking out part of the battery if a rocket motor ignites
It was a computer glitch that launched it, as far as the reports go. I dont think it was the motor lighting off.
Sea Skimmer wrote:That's how air defenses work when on high alert. The batteries have maybe two minutes to deal with incoming targets. They haven't said what caused the Tornado shoot down. But I'd bet a failed IFF or a plane outside its assigned corridor before I'd go with an error on the ground.
The US ADA people have more-or-less admitted fault and were ordered to give assurances to the Tornado detachment that this kind of thing wouldn't happen again.
There was nothing wrong with the Tornado or its flight path.
This incident was probably an equipment or pilot error; ESM should have told him it was friendly if he went to launch a HARM.
You don't seem to have the right end of the stick here. The Patriot battery locked its fire control radar onto the F-16 and the F-16 pilot deliberately HARMed the Patriot radar to protect himself. The F-16 pilot knew what he was shooting at just as much as he knew he didn't want to get killed.
It's not my place in life to make people happy. Don't talk to me unless you're prepared to watch me slaughter cows you hold sacred. Don't talk to me unless you're prepared to have your basic assumptions challenged. If you want bunnies in light, talk to someone else.
Enlightenment wrote:
The US ADA people have more-or-less admitted fault and were ordered to give assurances to the Tornado detachment that this kind of thing wouldn't happen again.
There was nothing wrong with the Tornado or its flight path.
Source?
You don't seem to have the right end of the stick here. The Patriot battery locked its fire control radar onto the F-16 and the F-16 pilot deliberately HARMed the Patriot radar to protect himself. The F-16 pilot knew what he was shooting at just as much as he knew he didn't want to get killed.
Generally the lest valuable asset is sacrificed in such situations. PAC-2/3 is over a billion dollars per battery, and HARM has a wide damage path. And a pilot can eject faster then he can lock on and fire a missile.
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
The Patriot Battery crews are in need of some training. While I've not seen the RECCE portion of a Patriot Battery, it shouldn't be too awfully hard to discern between friendly and enemy aircraft.
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jegs2 wrote:The Patriot Battery crews are in need of some training. While I've not seen the RECCE portion of a Patriot Battery, it shouldn't be too awfully hard to discern between friendly and enemy aircraft.
Both are squares with track numbers on the radar screen
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
Enlightenment wrote:
The US ADA people have more-or-less admitted fault and were ordered to give assurances to the Tornado detachment that this kind of thing wouldn't happen again.
There was nothing wrong with the Tornado or its flight path.
jegs2 wrote:The Patriot Battery crews are in need of some training. While I've not seen the RECCE portion of a Patriot Battery, it shouldn't be too awfully hard to discern between friendly and enemy aircraft.
Both are squares with track numbers on the radar screen
which suggests that a software problem was at the root of Sunday's incident.
Now i understand its Bill Gates and Microcraps fault
Seriously, I doubt they use Windows for the Patriot batteries.
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Now that's how to deal with trigger-happy friendly-fire units. If that doesn't encorage the Patriot crews to be more careful about what they shoot at, nothing will.
