Malaysian Federal Minister brings embarrassment to (some) Malaysians once again

[AniThyng]

http://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2 ... -minister/

KUALA LUMPUR: Non-believers in Malaysia should be “hunted down” as Malaysia has no place for atheism, says Datuk Seri Dr Shahidan Kassim (pic).

The Minister in the Prime Minister’s Department said such groups go against the Federal Constitution, which states Islam is the official religion while others are free to practise their own faith.

“Not once does it (the Constitution) mention atheism. This clearly shows that the group goes against the Constitution and basic rights,” he told the press in Parliament here on Tuesday.

A group called Atheist Republic had a gathering of its Kuala Lumpur chapter recently, and a photo of the gathering has triggered outrage from some in the Muslim community after it was highlighted on social media.

Shahidan said he would suggest to religious departments and muftis to intervene in the matter by identifying members of the group.

“I suggest we track them down and identify each of them. After that, we have to bring them back to the right path,” he said.

He said these people became atheists because they lacked religious understanding and knowledge.

“That is why they are easily swayed by new age teachings,” he said.

However, Shahidan said the group needs to be dealt with in a proper manner.

“We can’t act in such a way where they could gain sympathy from other people. This would just make them more popular,” he said.

It was reported that the Federal Government would investigate the local group, with the help of the Malaysian Communications and Multimedia Commission as it involved the faith of Muslims.

Atheist Republic has close to two million followers and supporters on Facebook, with hundreds of chapters worldwide including in Indonesia and the Philippines.


Read more at http://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2 ... HHRykUL.99

“We can’t act in such a way where they could gain sympathy from other people. This would just make them more popular,” he said.

I should be so grateful that the learned minister had the self awareness to even say that.

But hey, 50 years ago you could have your life ruined for being a "communist" in the USA so I suppose it's just same old same old. I actually saw this as an argument on facebook - countries can punish treason with death, so why can't a religion punish apostasy with death? (or very aggressive counselling!)

My sides.

[wautd]

I actually saw this as an argument on facebook - countries can punish treason with death, so why can't a religion punish apostasy with death? (or very aggressive counselling!)

I saw this argument popping up several times in discussions. As if these things would be remotely similar. I guess it's a typical thing when a religion also becomes a political ideology

I always found it a hypocritical stance. Preaching "there's no compusion in religion" while the death penalty is justified for people who leave or loosing their faith. Fucking fascists.

[Lord Revan]

I actually saw this as an argument on facebook - countries can punish treason with death, so why can't a religion punish apostasy with death? (or very aggressive counselling!)

I saw this argument popping up several times in discussions. As if these things would be remotely similar. I guess it's a typical thing when a religion also becomes a political ideology

I always found it a hypocritical stance. Preaching "there's no compusion in religion" while the death penalty is justified for people who leave or loosing their faith. Fucking fascists.

even ignoring the very important social stability issues that deny any religion from having the ability to pass capital punishments. Isn't apostasy closer to denouncing one's citizenship as protest then high treason, I would say some more extreme forms of heresy or alternatively pretending to be part of one religion while converting other "faithful to another religion would closer to what high treason is.

Thing is that high treason (only form of treason a person in western countries can be convicted of) is very specifically definied for the exact purpose that it can't be used all that often, for example a assasination of major political figure would probably be murder not high treason (also I'm pretty sure that punishment for high treason is prison sentence not the capital punishment), while terms like apostasy or heresy are so broad that they could be used for practically anything, for example lets say a person leaves the chruch in protest due corruption of the clerical officials but still self-indentifies as a christian, so would he or she be a faithful, an apostate or a heretic, an argument could be made for any of three definations here.

I'd suspect that these people are the worst kind of hypocrites though, ones that belive their own lies.

[AniThyng]

The fact that Islam is the State Religion is the icing on the cake. It would be even worse if some people get their way politically and push Sharia law even further than it already is. But as stated, when religion is integral to the state, even people leaving and possibly encouraging others can be said to be treason - it's not merely giving up your citizenship, it's actively working to sabotage the state...

I hear the no compulsion bit a lot. It's awful.

[The Romulan Republic]

But hey, 50 years ago you could have your life ruined for being a "communist" in the USA so I suppose it's just same old same old. I actually saw this as an argument on facebook - countries can punish treason with death, so why can't a religion punish apostasy with death? (or very aggressive counselling!)

My sides.

Hell, twenty years ago, their were still places where you could be arrested for "sodomy" in the US.

And based on some recent events, it wouldn't take all that much more for us to backslide to that, or further.

Edit: That's not to say that the situation in Malaysia isn't awful. Of course it is. But probably every nation on Earth, even the most peaceful, and prosperous, and just, stands only a couple disasters and a charismatic demagogue away from something just as bad or worse.

[AniThyng]

But hey, 50 years ago you could have your life ruined for being a "communist" in the USA so I suppose it's just same old same old. I actually saw this as an argument on facebook - countries can punish treason with death, so why can't a religion punish apostasy with death? (or very aggressive counselling!)

My sides.

Hell, twenty years ago, their were still places where you could be arrested for "sodomy" in the US.

And based on some recent events, it wouldn't take all that much more for us to backslide to that, or further.

Edit: That's not to say that the situation in Malaysia isn't awful. Of course it is. But probably every nation on Earth, even the most peaceful, and prosperous, and just, stands only a couple disasters and a charismatic demagogue away from something just as bad or worse.

Yes, regretfully it does not need to be religion powering it, secular ideology is often twisted and used to justify punitive retaliation as well.