The fate of the downed Apache

[Vympel]

The Coalition claimed it was destroyed by an airstrike where it lay. Iraqwar.ru said they destroyed a mock-up. And they're proven correct:







I wonder if it's being taken to Syria- and from there .... ?

[The Duchess of Zeon]

That's just an Apache being driven through the streets of Kuwait City from where it was unloaded off a ship to one of our bases in the Emirate. You sure are gullible.

[Vympel]

That's just an Apache being driven through the streets of Kuwait City from where it was unloaded off a ship to one of our bases in the Emirate. You sure are gullible.

And that sure explains why the unit patch is exactly the same as the one shot down, and it isn't under any military escort, and isn't on a US standard truck. You sure are dumb.

[MKSheppard]

That's just an Apache being driven through the streets of Kuwait City from where it was unloaded off a ship to one of our bases in the Emirate. You sure are gullible.

Uhm wouldn't they be unloaded onto the docks and then flown from there?

[Vympel]

Uhm wouldn't they be unloaded onto the docks and then flown from there?

Not to mention it's not a HEMMT, and half the apache's ass is hanging onto the road. Brilliant call, Duchess

[Chris OFarrell]

The Coalition claimed it was destroyed by an airstrike where it lay. Iraqwar.ru said they destroyed a mock-up. And they're proven correct:
I wonder if it's being taken to Syria- and from there .... ?

Wouldn't it be more likely to be the OTHER way around. Rather then destroying a mockup the Iraqi's just HAPPENED to get out there in an hour or two and set up, that they destroyed the real deal and NOW they are parading a mock up around town for the media?

I'd sure not drive such a prize so bloody carelessly through the streets with almost no escort. Your just asking for either some pilot in the air to spot it and take it out or it to be further damaged or such in such a crude transit attempt.

Not to mention now the US will have to start looking and tracking it leading them to kill something that should and would have been better left 'dead' from the IRaqi point of view.

And I have a rather gross distrust of iraqiwar.ru. They appear to have a chip the size of Mt Everst on their shoulder towards the US and trying to scream about how pathetic their forces are or some such.

[Cpt_Frank]

The Coalition claimed it was destroyed by an airstrike where it lay. Iraqwar.ru said they destroyed a mock-up. And they're proven correct:
I wonder if it's being taken to Syria- and from there .... ?

Wouldn't it be more likely to be the OTHER way around. Rather then destroying a mockup the Iraqi's just HAPPENED to get out there in an hour or two and set up, that they destroyed the real deal and NOW they are parading a mock up around town for the media.

It's easier to build a mock-up that looks like an apache from a plane than it is when you're 10 or so meters away as in these photos. If it's a mock-up then it's a damn good one.

[Vympel]

Wouldn't it be more likely to be the OTHER way around. Rather then destroying a mockup the Iraqi's just HAPPENED to get out there in an hour or two and set up, that they destroyed the real deal and NOW they are parading a mock up around town for the media?

I'd sure not drive such a prize so bloody carelessly through the streets with almost no escort. Your just asking for either some pilot in the air to spot it and take it out or it to be further damaged or such in such a crude transit attempt.

Not to mention now the US will have to start looking and tracking it leading them to kill something that should and would have been better left 'dead' from the IRaqi point of view.

And I have a rather gross distrust of iraqiwar.ru. They appear to have a chip the size of Mt Everst on their shoulder towards the US and trying to scream about how pathetic their forces are or some such.

Oh come *on*- is Tamiya building 1:1 AH-64D scale models now? Because mock-ups are crude replicas that only decieve from the air, not the ground- this Apache is 100% the real deal. You simply cannot build a mockup that looks like that.

I distrust iraqwar.ru as well. Their claims are quite frankly outrageous at times, but hey, in this case, they were right.

[RadiO]

Is it me, or is the stabiliser in the bottom photo damaged on the port side?

[Vympel]

Is it me, or is the stabiliser in the bottom photo damaged on the port side?

Good eyes- I didn't notice that. Looks like it got sheared off- perhaps by ZSU-23-4 Shilka fire?

[The Duchess of Zeon]

And that sure explains why the unit patch is exactly the same as the one shot down, and it isn't under any military escort, and isn't on a US standard truck. You sure are dumb.

I'm just really getting quite annoyed with your mindless acceptance of everything that comes from those Russian joke sites - They're really nothing more and you know it. A few people, perhaps they're even ex-military, or perhaps not, are staging a drama to lure in people and you're falling for it.

You didn't even consider such an explanation for the picture as I had suggested - which might be now adequetly dismissed one grants - until I brought it up in a confrontational manner. You're just taking whatever they feed you as the gospel while pretending you don't take them seriously.

There are still several other explanations for that Apache, a few of which have already been brought up. Another might be that it was a new one recently downed in Baghdad itself, or any other city, and the announcement of its loss has not been made yet. You do have a brain - and you know I have one for that matter - but bloody well start using it.

[MKSheppard]

I'm just really getting quite annoyed with your mindless acceptance of everything that comes from those Russian joke sites - They're really nothing more and you know it.

Like Vympel said, why is it being transported on a flatbed with ARABIC
writing, rather than a US HEMMT?

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Like Vympel said, why is it being transported on a flatbed with ARABIC
writing, rather than a US HEMMT?

Kuwaiti contractor? Or it didn't have to be my own explanation at all; I'm just getting tired of Vympel making these threads while ignoring alternative opinions or explanations. He should at least have enough facts on hand to summarily dismiss such explanations if he's so sure of himself.

[Vympel]

Kuwaiti contractor? Or it didn't have to be my own explanation at all; I'm just getting tired of Vympel making these threads while ignoring alternative opinions or explanations. He should at least have enough facts on hand to summarily dismiss such explanations if he's so sure of himself.

Let's add up the evidence shall we?

- It's from the same unit.
- It's damaged
- It's not on a US standard truck
- It's not even stowed properly
- If it was a different aircraft, the Iraqis would've shot pics of that aircraft and claimed a farmer shot *that* down, before moving it

Any idiot would know it's the same damn aircraft, your desperation (kuwaiti contractor) to save your pride after making such a ridiculous claim as 'it's in kuwait city' nonwithstanding.

I'm just really getting quite annoyed with your mindless acceptance of everything that comes from those Russian joke sites

Demonstrate your accusation of 'mindless acceptance' please. You won't find jack shit, because I have never demonstrated any such belief.

There are still several other explanations for that Apache, a few of which have already been brought up

What, like that it's a mockup? I wonder if that ultra-rare 1:1 scale Tamiya model came with 55 gallon drums of superglue to put it together

[Warspite]

Duchess, the footage has already been shown on European news. It's the Apache downed the other week by that extremely lucky farmer ( ), also it was confirmed by military analysts.

[Nathan F]

Duchess, the footage has already been shown on European news. It's the Apache downed the other week by that extremely lucky farmer ( ), also it was confirmed by military analysts.

While that is the downed Apache, I still do not believe that it was taken down by a farmer with a bolt action rifle.

AA fire, possibly, engine trouble, likely, farmer with a Mauser, impossible.

[Vympel]

While that is the downed Apache, I still do not believe that it was taken down by a farmer with a bolt action rifle.

Who does?

AA fire, possibly, engine trouble, likely, farmer with a Mauser, impossible.

Well, Apache doesn't have the best reliability record ever (been grounded a few times), and CENTCOM says it was heavy AA fire- the broken stabilizer seems to support this, as it'd be pretty hard to break that off in a hard landing (the angle would be such that the helo would be tipped on its side). So I reckon it took some 23mm hits.

[Montcalm]

While that is the downed Apache, I still do not believe that it was taken down by a farmer with a bolt action rifle.

Who does?

AA fire, possibly, engine trouble, likely, farmer with a Mauser, impossible.

Well, Apache doesn't have the best reliability record ever (been grounded a few times), and CENTCOM says it was heavy AA fire- the broken stabilizer seems to support this, as it'd be pretty hard to break that off in a hard landing (the angle would be such that the helo would be tipped on its side). So I reckon it took some 23mm hits.

I,ve read it was made for combat in nordic territories like Russia or northen Canada,not in desert.

[fgalkin]

And that sure explains why the unit patch is exactly the same as the one shot down, and it isn't under any military escort, and isn't on a US standard truck. You sure are dumb.

I'm just really getting quite annoyed with your mindless acceptance of everything that comes from those Russian joke sites - They're really nothing more and you know it. A few people, perhaps they're even ex-military, or perhaps not, are staging a drama to lure in people and you're falling for it.

You didn't even consider such an explanation for the picture as I had suggested - which might be now adequetly dismissed one grants - until I brought it up in a confrontational manner. You're just taking whatever they feed you as the gospel while pretending you don't take them seriously.

There are still several other explanations for that Apache, a few of which have already been brought up. Another might be that it was a new one recently downed in Baghdad itself, or any other city, and the announcement of its loss has not been made yet. You do have a brain - and you know I have one for that matter - but bloody well start using it.

Marina, the info might have been reported on iraqwar.ru, but the video belongs to RTVi. It's an American Russian-language channel. It has very little ties to Russian news sources, since it's owned by Vladimir Gusinskiy. And, since most of its audience are Russian-speaking Jews, it tends to be very pro-war.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Stormbringer]

If they're dumb enough to parade it around like that I'm sure the Air Force will be fixing the mistake shortly.

And Duchess, that's the lamest argument I've ever heard. So they got an Apache, it's not a big deal over all.

[Sea Skimmer]

Uhm wouldn't they be unloaded onto the docks and then flown from there?

Not to mention it's not a HEMMT, and half the apache's ass is hanging onto the road. Brilliant call, Duchess

Apache's dont fit on HEMMT's. There moved around on tank transporters.

[Vympel]

Apache's dont fit on HEMMT's. There moved around on tank transporters.

Ah k, my bad.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

And Duchess, that's the lamest argument I've ever heard. So they got an Apache, it's not a big deal over all.

It was reported destroyed, and that report ought be reconciled against the questionable photographic evidence. I wouldn't put it past Iraqwar.ru to doctor pictures and add that tag from RTVi to make them appear more reputable.

[fgalkin]

And Duchess, that's the lamest argument I've ever heard. So they got an Apache, it's not a big deal over all.

It was reported destroyed, and that report ought be reconciled against the questionable photographic evidence. I wouldn't put it past Iraqwar.ru to doctor pictures and add that tag from RTVi to make them appear more reputable.

Except that these pics were taken form RTVi's website.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Stormbringer]

And Duchess, that's the lamest argument I've ever heard. So they got an Apache, it's not a big deal over all.

It was reported destroyed, and that report ought be reconciled against the questionable photographic evidence. I wouldn't put it past Iraqwar.ru to doctor pictures and add that tag from RTVi to make them appear more reputable.

Now you're just reaching. I've got a lot of respect for you in most cases but come off it. That's ridiculous. The pictures are right there and I'm sure if they were doctored some one would have noticed by now. Face it, the Iraqis got a helicopter and suckered us. Not a big deal.