Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Coronavirus-related, but big enough I felt it warranted its own thread:

https://globalnews.ca/news/6946516/chin ... ationship/
U.S. President Donald Trump signalled a further deterioration of his relationship with China over the novel coronavirus, saying he has no interest in speaking to President Xi Jinping right now and going so far as to suggest he could even cut ties with the world’s second largest economy.

In an interview with Fox Business Network broadcast on Thursday, Trump said he was very disappointed with China’s failure to contain the disease and that the pandemic had cast a pall over his January trade deal with Beijing, which he has previously hailed as a major achievement.

“They should have never let this happen,” Trump said. “So I make a great trade deal and now I say this doesn’t feel the same to me. The ink was barely dry and the plague came over. And it doesn’t feel the same to me.”

READ MORE: U.S. faces ‘darkest winter’ if coronavirus rebounds, government whistleblower warns

Trump’s pique extended to Xi, with whom the U.S. president has said repeatedly he has a good relationship.

“But I just — right now I don’t want to speak to him,” Trump said in the interview, which was taped on Wednesday.

Trump was asked about a Republican senator’s suggestion that U.S. visas be denied to Chinese students applying to study in fields related to national security, such as quantum computing and artificial intelligence.

“There are many things we could do. We could do things. We could cut off the whole relationship,” he replied.

“Now, if you did, what would happen? You’d save $500 billion,” Trump said, referring to estimated U.S. annual imports from China, which he often refers to as lost money.

The remark drew ridicule from Hu Xijin, editor in chief of China’s influential Global Times tabloid, who referred to Trump’s much-criticized comments last month about how COVID-19, the disease caused by the coronavirus, might be treated.

“This president once suggested COVID-19 patients inject disinfectants,” Hu said on Twitter. “Remember this and you won’t be surprised when he said he could cut off the whole relationship with China.”

U.S. Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin told Fox Business Network China needed to provide a lot more information about the coronavirus and Trump was reviewing his options.

“The president is concerned. He’s reviewing all his options. Obviously, we’re very concerned about the impact of this virus on the economy, on American jobs, the health of the American public and the president is going to do everything to protect the economy and protect American workers,” Mnuchin said.

COVID-19 wage subsidy program extended through August, Trudeau says

“It’s a difficult and complex matter and the president has made very clear, he wants more information. They didn’t let us in, they didn’t let us understand what was going on and the American public have right to understand all the facts.”

Trump and his Republican backers have accused Beijing of failing to alert the world to the severity and scope of the coronavirus outbreak and of withholding data about the earliest cases. The pandemic has sparked a sharp global recession and threatened Trump’s November re-election chances.

The United States has been hardest hit by the pandemic, according to official data.

China insists it has been transparent, and amid increasingly bitter exchanges both sides have questioned the future of the trade deal.

Opponents of Trump have said that while China has much to answer for over the outbreak, he appears to be seeking to deflect attention from criticism over his response to the crisis.

Scott Kennedy of Washington’s Center for Strategic and International Studies think tank called Trump’s remarks “dangerous bravado.”

“Avoiding communication is not an effective strategy for solving a crisis that requires global cooperation. And cutting off the economic relationship would badly damage the American economy,” he said.

Michael Pillsbury, a China analyst who has worked as an outside adviser to Trump, told Reuters he believed the president was concerned that China not only wanted to renegotiate the Phase 1 deal, but also had not been meeting goals in purchasing from United States.

He said that according to figures cited by the China Daily, China’s purchases of U.S. products in the first four months of this year were 3% less than during the same period last year. “It’s not good news for reducing the trade deficit or helping our economy recover from the coronavirus crisis,” he said.

Under Phase 1 of the trade agreement, Beijing pledged to buy at least $200 billion in additional U.S. goods and services over two years while Washington agreed to roll back tariffs on Chinese goods in stages.

China took some additional steps towards those goals on Thursday, buying U.S. soybean oil for the first time in nearly two years and issued customs notices allowing imports of U.S. barley and blueberries.

An executive from Chinese state agriculture trading house COFCO said China was set to speed up purchases of U.S. farm goods to implement the Phase 1 deal.

The Global Times on Thursday said Beijing was seeking to compartmentalize rising tensions with Washington.

“(China) still hopes that economic and trade issues will not be politicized because that is not good for either side,” it quoted Li Yong, deputy chairman of the Expert Committee of the China Association of International Trade, as saying.

While U.S. intelligence agencies have said the coronavirus does not appear manmade or genetically modified, rejecting a theory promoted by some Trump supporters, Trump said in his interview that China should have stopped it at its source.

“Whether it came from the lab or came from the bats, it all came from China, and they should have stopped it,” he said.

“It got out of control.”
Fuck. You think the economy's bad now, wait until Trump cuts ties with China. I honestly wonder if that's the point where his rich Wall Street backers would finally decide he's crossed the line from useful idiot to liability/loose end to tie up.

Even if he's just "joking" this isn't shit you joke about. This is the kind of comment that tanks stock markets all by itself. Its like the PotUS casually "joking" about defaulting on the debt or launching the nukes.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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“His rich backers” are not your allies. They don’t care if millions go jobless or die.

Wake up. How old are you?
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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K. A. Pital wrote: 2020-05-15 04:45pm “His rich backers” are not your allies.
I never said they were.
They don’t care if millions go jobless or die.
No, but they care about whether the entire global economy tanks over Trump's latest tantrum. At least in theory.

Or maybe they, like the Republicans in the Senate, have been thoroughly broken and will follow Dear Leader to their own destruction.
Wake up. How old are you?
How about you get off your high horse? Or at least come up with a marginally less cliche way of condescending to me over things I never said?
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"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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The Romulan Republic wrote: 2020-05-15 05:03pmNo, but they care about whether the entire global economy tanks over Trump's latest tantrum. At least in theory.
You do realize that in the chaos of 2008 the rich got richer, right? A recession just allows larger firms to use their cash reserves to consolidate things and buy out their smaller competition, and if a few of the other large firms fall in the process so much the better.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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While Bezos is on the way to being trillionaire here we are still wishing for miracles. :P
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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K. A. Pital wrote: 2020-05-15 05:08pmWhile Bezos is on the way to being trillionaire here we are still wishing for miracles. :P
It's almost like those with the most ride out recessions in comfort while the rest of us thrash to keep our heads above water and it's no stretch to say that the powers that be want it this way for as long as possible.

-----

EDIT: Here's a challenge for TRR. Show us exactly how the current pandemic and the previous trade war with China have hurt the megarich. Then show us how 'cutting ties' with China will be any worse for them. I want details, not vague ramblings and your evidence needs to show that it's widespread and not confined to a few industries/firms.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Good. Sometimes the right things are done for the wrong reasons.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Sounds like another extreme move he'll walk back on later on after getting the attention and headlines he really wants.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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K. A. Pital wrote: 2020-05-15 04:45pm“His rich backers” are not your allies. They don’t care if millions go jobless or die.
They care about their own hides. That's exploitable.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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J wrote: 2020-05-15 06:55pm Good. Sometimes the right things are done for the wrong reasons.
Changes to the trade relationship with China are badly needed, although I expect the reforms you would want and the ones I would want are rather different.

A complete, spur of the moment severing of all ties would be an unmitigated catastrophe, in the unlikely event that it actually happened.
Majin Gojira wrote: 2020-05-15 07:13pm Sounds like another extreme move he'll walk back on later on after getting the attention and headlines he really wants.
Probably, yes. I sometimes think he does this shit partly so that when he dials it back to something only moderately insane, everyone will think its reasonable in comparison... and so that when he circles back around to the really insane/sociopathic stuff, people will have become numb to it and just handwave it as "Trump being Trump", or dismiss any outrage over it as hysteria or "Trump Derangement Syndrome". Like how he just called for the arrest of his predecessor and his main electoral opponent for no identifiable crime and on no valid evidence, and its barely even a blip in the news cycle.

He's getting us acclimated to fascism.

It may also be because he's an idiot with poor impulse control, but I wonder if to some extent he does this shit as a tactic.
Zaune wrote: 2020-05-15 07:26pm
K. A. Pital wrote: 2020-05-15 04:45pm“His rich backers” are not your allies. They don’t care if millions go jobless or die.
They care about their own hides. That's exploitable.
Indeed.

I don't think its an outlandish thing to suggest that Wall Street by and large does not want a complete halt to all trade with China. That doesn't make them good people, or bad people for that matter (though a great many of them very clearly are bad people). It just means they are self-interested, and a sudden halt to trade with China is not in their self-interest.

Its also pretty funny that this sort of dependence on international trade is the very "globalization" people like K. A. Pital constantly rail against- but when I mention it, suddenly he's outraged at the suggestion that the capitalists are pro-free trade. :lol:
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Zaune wrote: 2020-05-15 07:26pm
K. A. Pital wrote: 2020-05-15 04:45pm“His rich backers” are not your allies. They don’t care if millions go jobless or die.
They care about their own hides. That's exploitable.
It will never be exploited. The american people are too cowed and pathetic to even consider it, since it would interrupt their kitten videos and celebrity "news."
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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He also off the cuff mentioned he could cut ties with anyone. Lets try with Canada or Europe first. :lol: Then he can move onto China since they are at least a bigger partner than Europe, so start off with the small fries first.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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mr friendly guy wrote: 2020-05-15 11:06pm He also off the cuff mentioned he could cut ties with anyone. Lets try with Canada or Europe first. :lol: Then he can move onto China since they are at least a bigger partner than Europe, so start off with the small fries first.
Cutting ties with Canada would be even more politically unpopular, and fuck the US about as hard. It would fuck Canada too, but the American and Canadian economies are incredibly intertwined. There are literally millions of Americans living in Canada, or with family in Canada, or vice-versa. US military hardware is manufactured in Canada, the US gets a not inconsiderable amount of power from Canada, the US is getting a lot of COVID aid from Canada I believe as well. Canada-US is only a little behind the China-US as the second largest trading relationship in the world.
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"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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The Romulan Republic wrote: 2020-05-15 11:22pm
mr friendly guy wrote: 2020-05-15 11:06pm He also off the cuff mentioned he could cut ties with anyone. Lets try with Canada or Europe first. :lol: Then he can move onto China since they are at least a bigger partner than Europe, so start off with the small fries first.
Cutting ties with Canada would be even more politically unpopular, and fuck the US about as hard. It would fuck Canada too, but the American and Canadian economies are incredibly intertwined. There are literally millions of Americans living in Canada, or with family in Canada, or vice-versa. US military hardware is manufactured in Canada, the US gets a not inconsiderable amount of power from Canada, the US is getting a lot of COVID aid from Canada I believe as well. Canada-US is only a little behind the China-US as the second largest trading relationship in the world.
I know. That's the point of my post. Individually cutting off trade with these regions will fuck the US up quite bad. And since Trump didn't just mention China... I think I will take a leaf from you book and tell Trump, go ahead, do it dickless.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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K. A. Pital wrote: 2020-05-15 04:45pm “His rich backers” are not your allies. They don’t care if millions go jobless or die.
The problem is that our economy is so tied to China right now due to relying on it for imports that cutting off all ties could impact "his rich backers" economically. It's not about jobs or death, it's about making money from people buying stuff the production of which was shipped to China because of cheaper labor and not giving a fuck about the environmental fallout.

The question is whether that impact from that would actually affect the billionaires - it all depends on where they get their money (and other stuff) from.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Well, so much for mutual tolerance and mutually-beneficial trade.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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The only one (kind of) impacted by this would be Bezos, since Amazon is pretty much a retailer of chinese goods these days. And hurting Bezos would be a plus in Trumps book.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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LaCroix wrote: 2020-05-16 06:05pm The only one (kind of) impacted by this would be Bezos, since Amazon is pretty much a retailer of chinese goods these days. And hurting Bezos would be a plus in Trumps book.
Hurting Bezos is also thought to be one of the reasons he's persecuting the Postal Service (that and voter suppression during COVID).

Which, don't get me wrong, I'm all for sticking it to Jeff Bezos. But other people kind of need the Post Office too.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Since when does Amazon subcontract to the postal service anyway? Everything I've bought off them has been delivered by their own drivers, and I thought that was standard worldwide.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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From a quick google yes, amazon DOES use the USP and heavily though they're moving away from that and while that's irrelevant to the US a lot of my amazon packages arrive by regular mail
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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They're 'building up' their own delivery infrastructure but so far it seems they're still heavily tied into using the USPS, FedEx, UPS and the like.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Zaune wrote: 2020-05-16 07:37pm Since when does Amazon subcontract to the postal service anyway? Everything I've bought off them has been delivered by their own drivers, and I thought that was standard worldwide.
Are you in a major city? Running their own private courier service just isn't viable below a certain population density.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Zaune wrote: 2020-05-16 07:37pm Since when does Amazon subcontract to the postal service anyway? Everything I've bought off them has been delivered by their own drivers, and I thought that was standard worldwide.
Every physical item I've ever bought from Amazon was transported to me by the post office. Now, that could be due to what I buy, where I live, or maybe other factors I'm not aware of. Every time I go to the post office to pick up a large box from them I can look through to the back where they keep the packages and there's always a stack of Amazon boxes. So they very much do use the Post Office, even if not exclusively.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Rogue 9 wrote: 2020-05-17 12:50amAre you in a major city? Running their own private courier service just isn't viable below a certain population density.
Not as such, but I live in what would be considered a pretty high-density area by US standards. I also don't use Amazon very often, and most of my recent purchases have been stuff the Royal Mail doesn't usually deal with... And yet now I come to mention it I do vaguely remember having to pick something I think I bought off them from the sorting office a few months back, so maybe my memory's at fault. Either way, every recent Amazon delivery where I've actually interacted with the courier (ie when it won't fit through the letterbox) has been by one of their own personnel.
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Re: Trump threatens to cut ties with China.

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Broomstick wrote: 2020-05-17 05:43am
Zaune wrote: 2020-05-16 07:37pm Since when does Amazon subcontract to the postal service anyway? Everything I've bought off them has been delivered by their own drivers, and I thought that was standard worldwide.
Every physical item I've ever bought from Amazon was transported to me by the post office. Now, that could be due to what I buy, where I live, or maybe other factors I'm not aware of. Every time I go to the post office to pick up a large box from them I can look through to the back where they keep the packages and there's always a stack of Amazon boxes. So they very much do use the Post Office, even if not exclusively.
For me it seems random. So far this year, I've had packages delivered to me through Amazon's own delivery service, UPS, FEDEX and USPS.
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