House fights back against the Patriot Act - BIPARTISAN

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2003-07-24 07:24am

WASHINGTON (July 24) - The Justice Department raised strong objections Wednesday to a surprising House vote against covert ``sneak and peek'' searches in criminal investigations, a move that sponsors said reflected civil liberties concerns raised by the anti-terrorism USA Patriot Act.

By a solidly bipartisan 309-118 vote, the House struck the first serious blow against the law, passed shortly after the Sept. 11 attacks.

``I think the message that 309 votes tells me is that people have the opportunity to look back and say, 'What have we really done?'' said Rep. C.L. ``Butch'' Otter, R-Idaho. ``I think it's given unbridled authority to the federal law enforcement agencies.''

The Patriot Act strengthened government surveillance and law enforcement powers, removed a barrier to the CIA and other intelligence agencies sharing information with law enforcement officials and added a number of provisions aimed at disrupting terrorism financing.

``Our success in preventing another catastrophic attack on the U.S. homeland would have been much more difficult, if not impossible, without several of the provisions of that act,'' FBI Director Robert Mueller told the Senate Judiciary Committee on Wednesday.

Civil liberties advocates say there is a greater chance that government can snoop on innocent people.

The measure sponsored by Otter would prevent federal dollars from being spent to implement warrants that delay notification that a covert search is being conducted. The USA Patriot Act established uniform national standards for what are sometimes known as ``black bag'' or ``sneak and peek'' searches.

The law permits agents to search the home of a suspected drug dealer, or plant a listening device in the car of a reputed mobster, or copy a computer hard drive of a terror suspect, without notifying the suspect until a later date. That keeps suspects from escaping, destroying evidence or tampering with witnesses, for example.

The warrants must be approved by a judge and are permitted in limited circumstances. The Supreme Court in 1979 ruled that ``it is well established that law officers constitutionally may break and enter'' when such action is the only way to execute a search warrant.

As of April 1, the Justice Department had obtained such warrants under the USA Patriot Act 47 times for searches and 14 times for property seizures. Extensions ranging from one day to 90 days have been obtained 248 times.

Justice Department spokesman Mark Corallo said the Otter amendment ``would have a devastating effect on the United States' ongoing efforts to detect and prevent terrorism, as well as to combat other serious crimes.''

The amendment, approved Tuesday night, was attached to the annual spending bill for the Justice Department and other agencies, which passed the House on Wednesday. The bill moves on to the Senate, giving the Bush administration time to get it removed later this year.

Still, civil liberties groups said that the vote underscored growing concern about the Patriot Act. They noted that three states - Alaska, Vermont and Hawaii - and 142 local governments have passed measures opposing the act, with some taking steps to prevent local officials from complying.

``Hopefully, this is the first trickle in a flood of Patriot fixes,'' said Laura Murphy, director of the American Civil Liberties Union's legislative office in Washington.

The Otter amendment would have no effect on secret search warrants obtained under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, which is aimed at agents of foreign powers such as spies and terrorists. The FISA law was also expanded and updated by the USA Patriot Act.

07/23/03 23:24 EDT

And sponsored by a Republican, at that. We'll see it all killed yet.

Post by **Edi** » 2003-07-24 07:49am

This is good news!

Edi

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-07-24 07:54am

Coolness

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2003-07-24 07:54am

And sponsored by a Republican, at that. We'll see it all killed yet.

Nothing new. Bob Barr was one of the strongest opponents of the Patriot act until he got voted out of office (thanks in no small part to the stupid Libertarian party).

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2003-07-24 08:32am

Durran Korr wrote:
Nothing new. Bob Barr was one of the strongest opponents of the Patriot act until he got voted out of office (thanks in no small part to the stupid Libertarian party).

I wasn't expressing surprise--The record of House Republicans on civil rights is well-established, but everyone overlooks it. Actually, it's really the Senate--both parties--which is responsible for so much of this...

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-07-24 09:14am

While I'm pleased by this, I doubt where actually going to see much more repealed before parts start expiring.

Iceberg · Post by **Iceberg** » 2003-07-24 10:07am

At least, some sense restored to the Capitol.

Anybody got a link so I can see how the vote broke down?

I'm especially interested in seeing how my congressman (Gil Gutknecht (R-MN-District 1)) voted.

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-07-24 01:12pm

This bodes very poorly for Patriot II's chances.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2003-07-24 02:37pm

Excellent, we don't need crap like the USA PATRIOT act. A bill that the best thing about it is that it's title is a clever acronym shouldn't exist.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-07-24 02:52pm

Here's the problem with the USA PATRIOT Act. It targets American citizens. The people who are terrorizing the United States ... aren't American citizens.

Cosmic Average · Post by **Cosmic Average** » 2003-07-24 03:01pm

Durandal wrote:Here's the problem with the USA PATRIOT Act. It targets American citizens. The people who are terrorizing the United States ... aren't American citizens.

Yeah, exactly! Except for Timothy McVeigh... And the Unabomber.. And the Olympic park bomber..

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-07-24 03:04pm

Cosmic Average wrote:
Durandal wrote:Here's the problem with the USA PATRIOT Act. It targets American citizens. The people who are terrorizing the United States ... aren't American citizens.
Yeah, exactly! Except for Timothy McVeigh... And the Unabomber.. And the Olympic park bomber..

If memory serves, there was no anti-terrorism legislation like the USA PATRIOT Act enacted after those guys did their things.

Cosmic Average · Post by **Cosmic Average** » 2003-07-24 03:14pm

Durandal wrote:If memory serves, there was no anti-terrorism legislation like the USA PATRIOT Act enacted after those guys did their things.

And if memory serves me, you stated:

"The people who are terrorizing the United States ... aren't American citizens."

Which is patently untrue.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-07-24 04:48pm

Fine, the people that we're most worried about terrorizing America aren't US citizens. Happy? Jesus Christ.

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2003-07-25 02:37am

That's good news. Hopefully, it will get even more unpopular with Congress as time goes by. And I'm really wouldn't be suprised if Patriot Act II never gets passed by Congress. Ashcroft can't point to a national tragedy and say we need something to prevent it from happening again like he did with the first one.

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2003-07-25 02:40am

Good.

Bob McDob · Post by **Bob McDob** » 2003-07-25 02:51am

Neat. I don't suppose Ashcroft put his foot into his mouth or anything recently?

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2003-07-25 03:15am

Bob McDob wrote:Neat. I don't suppose Ashcroft put his foot into his mouth or anything recently?

He infuriated Congress by insisting there was no Patriot II draft, a few days before a complete Patriot II draft showed up. More to the point, the members of Congress are reading the same laws we are, and most of them evidentily think they're just as shitty as everyone else does. They passed PATRIOT in a panic, and now they're starting to undo it.

Einhander Sn0m4n · Post by **Einhander Sn0m4n** » 2003-07-25 03:20am

EXCELLENT NEWS!!!

Now if they would just undo the DMCA...

Totally OT, but Bob McDob, your sig is hilarious!

Enforcer Talen · Post by **Enforcer Talen** » 2003-07-25 08:37am

hopefully it will take ashcroft with it.