Global Warming

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The Kernel
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Global Warming

Post by The Kernel »

Here's some new information about escalating global temperatures. I must say that seeing as how here in California we have been seeing record temperatures of ~90F for the past few days (in the dead of winter!) I am extremely concerned about these findings.

Yahoo News
Yahoo News wrote: WASHINGTON, D.C., Mar 15 (OneWorld) -- Ten years after the ratification of a United Nations (news - web sites) treaty on climate change, greenhouse gas emissions that lead to global warming are still on the rise, signaling a "collective failure" of the industrialized world, according to the Washington-based World Resources Institute (WRI), a leading environmental think-tank.

"We are quickly moving to the point where the damage will be irreversible," warned Dr. Jonathan Pershing, director of WRI's Climate, Energy and Pollution Program. "In fact, the latest scientific reports indicate that global warming is worsening. Unless we act now, the world will be locked into temperatures that would cause irreversible harm."

WRI researchers estimate that greenhouse gas emissions such as carbon dioxide rose 11 percent over the last decade, and will grow another 50 percent worldwide by 2020. Under the 1997 Kyoto Protocol (news - web sites), the international agreement that sets out specific targets to follow up on the treaty, 38 industrialized countries were supposed to reduce their emissions by an average of seven percent below 1990 levels by 2012.

The administration of former President Bill Clinton (news - web sites) signed the Kyoto Protocol, but President Bush (news - web sites) withdrew the U.S., which currently emits about 25 percent of the world's greenhouse gases, from negotiations over Kyoto's implementation.

Russia, which indicated initially that it intended to ratify the Protocol, remains undecided. As a result the Protocol--which must be ratified by countries whose greenhouse emissions totaled more than 55 percent of global emissions in 1990 in order to take effect--remains in limbo.

WRI decided to make a relatively rare public statement now, both because the tenth anniversary of the UNFCCC's ratification will take place next weekend and because of the growing pessimism surrounding the international community's ability and will to deal with the problem.

The UN Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC), which called for voluntary reductions in greenhouse emissions, was signed by, among others, then-President George H.W. Bush, at the Earth Summit in Rio de Janeiro in 1992 and took formal effect March 21, 1994. Today, 188 countries are signatories.

The Kyoto Protocol grew out of the UNFCCC when it became clear that plans for voluntary reductions would not meet the initial targets, and as climate and atmospheric scientists on the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change have become increasingly convinced that the rise in global temperatures of about one degree Fahrenheit over the last century is due primarily to artificial emissions, notably the combustion of fossil fuels, including coal, oil, and gas.

Studies over the past decade have shown that the warming trend continues. "The five warmest years in recorded weather history have taken place over the last six years," noted WRI's president, Jonathan Lash.

"The ten warmest years in recorded weather history have taken place since 1987. Whether it's the retreat of glaciers, the melting of the permafrost in Alaska, or the increase in severe weather events, the world is experiencing what the global warming models predict," he said.

Europe, the main champion of the Kyoto Protocol, suffered its hottest year on record last year. Some 15,000 people in France alone died due to heat stress in combination with pollution, while European agriculture suffered an estimated $12.5 billion in losses.

Britain's most influential scientist, Sir David King, recently excoriated the Bush administration for withdrawing from the Protocol and ignoring the threat posed by climate change. "In my view, climate change is the most severe problem we are facing today," he wrote in Science magazine, "more serious even than the threat of terrorism."

Even the Pentagon (news - web sites) recently issued a warning that global warming, if it takes place abruptly, could result in a catastrophic breakdown in international security. Based on growing evidence that climate shifts in the past have taken place with breathtaking speed, based on the freshening of sea water due to accelerated melting of glaciers and the polar ice caps.

Given enough freshening, the Gulf Stream that currently warms the North Atlantic would be shut off, triggering an abrupt decline in temperatures that would bring about a new "Ice Age" in Europe, eastern Canada, and the northeastern United States and similar disastrous changes in world weather patterns elsewhere--all in a period as short as two to three years.

Wars over access to food, water, and energy would be likely to break out between states, according to the report. "Disruption and conflict will be endemic features of life," according to the report. "Once again, warfare would define human life."

Even if climate change is more gradual, recent studies have argued that as many as one million plant and animal species could be rendered extinct due to the effects of global warming by 2050. A recent report by the world's largest reinsurance company, Swiss Re, predicted that in 10 years the economic cost of disasters like floods, frosts, and famines caused by global warming could reach $150 billion annually.

"Accelerated development of a portfolio of technologies could stabilize greenhouse gas concentrations, enhance global energy security, and eradicate energy poverty," noted David Jhirad, WRI's vice president for research. "We urgently need the political will and international cooperation to make this happen."
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Post by CaptainChewbacca »

Bearing in mind that I believe in global warming, I want to say 2 things:

1. Mid-march isn't the dead of winter, its spring.

2. The records that are being broken were set 100 years ago, so there may be something more than global warming going on.
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Post by The Kernel »

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Bearing in mind that I believe in global warming, I want to say 2 things:

1. Mid-march isn't the dead of winter, its spring.
Maybe it isn't the dead of winter, but as I recall, Winter lasts until March 23. It's also record temps for us (for like the third year in a row).
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Post by CaptainChewbacca »

The Kernel wrote:
CaptainChewbacca wrote:Bearing in mind that I believe in global warming, I want to say 2 things:

1. Mid-march isn't the dead of winter, its spring.
Maybe it isn't the dead of winter, but as I recall, Winter lasts until March 23. It's also record temps for us (for like the third year in a row).
Here too. It will pass.
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Post by The Kernel »

CaptainChewbacca wrote: Here too. It will pass.
I truly hope that you are right. This kind of shit scares the everliving crap out of me.
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Post by Shiva Archon »

I notice that the article references that bullshit Pentagon secret report about the Ice Age coming to kill us all in two or three years. Regardless of the rest of the article that passage is a credibility assassin.

As for global warming itself, while I believe that human industry probably has an overall effect, I'm curious how it compares to natural climate change. I've heard arguments both ways and at first glance it seems to me that natural processes trump human activity when it comes to global warming.
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Post by CaptainChewbacca »

Human civilization started when the last ice-age ended and a period of warming started. There was a "mini-ice-age" from about 1100-1400 AD, but mostly temps have been increasing for the last 12,000 years. Humans have likely accelerated the rate of increase, but we're due for a rapid cooling sometime in the next 100-200 years.
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Post by Superman »

Who cares about global warming? Jesus is just going to come back anyway.

*I was not being serious...*
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Post by Crown »

Superman wrote:Who cares about global warming? Jesus is just going to come back anyway.

*I was not being serious...*
:lol:

Don't ask me why that struck me as being funny, but it did. Thanks for the laugh man!

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Post by Sharp-kun »

Shiva Archon wrote:I notice that the article references that bullshit Pentagon secret report about the Ice Age coming to kill us all in two or three years. Regardless of the rest of the article that passage is a credibility assassin.
Nitpick, it wasn't the report that was bullshit, it was the Guardian's report on it :wink:
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Post by Chardok »

Really want to be scared? (First decrease your IQ a bit) then read The Coming Global Superstorm. Art Bell and Whitley strieber did some EXHAUSTIVE research on the effects of global warming. :wink:
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Post by Uraniun235 »

Superman wrote:Who cares about global warming? Jesus is just going to come back anyway.

*I was not being serious...*
Ahh, a relic from the Reagan administration, I see. :wink:
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Post by BoredShirtless »

The Kernel wrote:I truly hope that you are right. This kind of shit scares the everliving crap out of me.
You should really think about focusing your fear on real threats like Cancer, getting hit by a cow, etc.
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Post by Alan Bolte »

I just read a big SciAm article on global warming. It said that we should be cooling right now, and the fact that we're still warming is what is principly interesting.
It also spent a lot of space on glacier melt and how we could have the oceans up several meters in the next few centuries if we don't make some changes. Several meters = trillions of dollars worth of coastline infrastructure underwater worldwide.
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Post by Mayabird »

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Human civilization started when the last ice-age ended and a period of warming started. There was a "mini-ice-age" from about 1100-1400 AD, but mostly temps have been increasing for the last 12,000 years. Humans have likely accelerated the rate of increase, but we're due for a rapid cooling sometime in the next 100-200 years.
I thought the Little Ice Age was from the mid 1600's to early 1700's. I was also under the impression that the dates of the settlement of Greenland and Vinland (around 1000-1100 or so) was during a warm period, making Greenland was much more inhabitable than it is now. Do I have my dates wrong?
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Post by CaptainChewbacca »

Mayabird wrote:
CaptainChewbacca wrote:Human civilization started when the last ice-age ended and a period of warming started. There was a "mini-ice-age" from about 1100-1400 AD, but mostly temps have been increasing for the last 12,000 years. Humans have likely accelerated the rate of increase, but we're due for a rapid cooling sometime in the next 100-200 years.
I thought the Little Ice Age was from the mid 1600's to early 1700's. I was also under the impression that the dates of the settlement of Greenland and Vinland (around 1000-1100 or so) was during a warm period, making Greenland was much more inhabitable than it is now. Do I have my dates wrong?
Those settlements died out (at least in Greenland) because of the little ice age in the early middle ages.

There were only eskimos in greenland during 1100. Remember, Norse got to North America before 1000 A.D.
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Post by The Albino Raven »

ICE AGE! GLOBAL WARMING! THE SKY IS FALLING! AMERICA NEEDS TO MAINTAIN CURRENT LEADERHIP TO BETTER DEAL WITH THESE PROBLEMS,

nothing like the fear of oncoming disaster to help supprt continuity in leadership :?
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Post by Crayz9000 »

You want global warming?

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Post by BlkbrryTheGreat »

Tens of millions of years ago the earth had an average temperature above 100 degrees F. The polar icecaps were completely melted; the entire earth was covered in lush vegitation as a result. We're not even close to that happening. If we get close to half way to that point I'll start to worry.
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Post by Dark Hellion »

Note, there is snow on the ground here in Illinois, so stop bitching about 90 degrees. I for one, think it is unseasonably cold around here compared with the past years (don't call me on this, it's opinion, just like the fact that 90 is hot). It's called weather, and a suprising thing is, it changes!
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Post by Alyeska »

Technicaly Earth is still in the middle of a 2 million year Ice Age. This Ice Age will end only once all the ice of the planet has melted completely.

BTW, you should feel lucky. At one point in Earths history the entire planet was convered in ice. Snowball Earth as it was called. It took a random luck to get us out of the ice age. There was a series of massive eruptions that occured in the Siberia area, a very large lava field. This was sufficent to raise the planets temperature by 5 degrees. That was 5 degrees short of the temperature required to get out of the snowball earth. While these eruptions occured a meteror struck Earth and raised the temperature by another 5 degrees or so.
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Post by Edi »

Compared to what the climate of the planet was e.g. in the pleistocene and other eras when we had those high average temperatures and an average sea water temperature of 20 degrees C, we're not going to see such significant, massive changes until the continents realign enough to cause some major shifts in sea currents.

Specifically, for large scale warming that would change the entire planetary climate radically, we would need an Equatorial warm current that circled the globe to counter the effects of the cold Antarctic current that circles Antarctis and acts like a cold pump. Alternatively, if the Antarctic current were to be cut off by e.g. Antarctis and South America drifting together there could be warming effects, but I don't know about that, it's conjecture.

Of course, this doesn't preclude the kinds of changes we're now seeing where temperatures rise by a couple of degrees and cause deserts to expand near the Equator and other climate changes elsewhere. What people should also remember is that despite the average global temperatures rising, local effects may cause some places to become colder, especially seasonally.

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Post by CaptainChewbacca »

BlkbrryTheGreat wrote:Tens of millions of years ago the earth had an average temperature above 100 degrees F. The polar icecaps were completely melted; the entire earth was covered in lush vegitation as a result. We're not even close to that happening. If we get close to half way to that point I'll start to worry.
That was closer to 80 MYA, and the world was very different. The continents were grouped in one equatorial mass, the oceans were pretty poor in terms of organisms, and large stretches of the earth got so hot in the day they were uninhabitable, with temps passing 50 Celsius.
Edi wrote:Compared to what the climate of the planet was e.g. in the pleistocene and other eras when we had those high average temperatures and an average sea water temperature of 20 degrees C, we're not going to see such significant, massive changes until the continents realign enough to cause some major shifts in sea currents.
We could go back to pleistocene or worse without continental changes, but we'd go back after about 15,000 years. Panama acts as a filter which gradualy raises ocean salinity which would restart the ocean conveyor after melting. Currently, ocean bottom water is governed by temperature and salinity, so if you screw with salinity things go to pot.
Specifically, for large scale warming that would change the entire planetary climate radically, we would need an Equatorial warm current that circled the globe to counter the effects of the cold Antarctic current that circles Antarctis and acts like a cold pump. Alternatively, if the Antarctic current were to be cut off by e.g. Antarctis and South America drifting together there could be warming effects, but I don't know about that, it's conjecture.
More than an equatorial warm current, you'd need to get rid of antarctica. When you have polar continents, they serve as a focal point for ice and give you cold bottom water. Without that, you only have salinity to go on, and in a world like that the saltiest water occurs where evaporation is greatest, the equator.
Of course, this doesn't preclude the kinds of changes we're now seeing where temperatures rise by a couple of degrees and cause deserts to expand near the Equator and other climate changes elsewhere. What people should also remember is that despite the average global temperatures rising, local effects may cause some places to become colder, especially seasonally.
Exactly. We know precisely jack about the climate, we just have good guesses.
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Post by Admiral Valdemar »

Then there's the fact that this may not be human created anyway since CO2 levels follow temperature changes, not vice versa. The other greenhouse gases people are unsure of, but there are plenty for and against the idea.

I need more studies to be done to really show how this isn't part of a natural cycle.
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Post by CaptainChewbacca »

Well, if you need more studies...

And CO2 changes lead temperature fluctuations.
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