Halo + PS2 controller, observations

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2004-12-15 01:14am

My boss owns an Xbox and constantly badgers me to play games with him. I always win (since he's 32 and I'm 24

), but I must have lambasted the Xbox controller once too many, since he bought a converter thingy for it.

So we were playing a bit of Halo coop, and I noticed that I found the game easier to play. Not just in the 'wow four shoulders' way, or the 'OMGZOR xobx contoller suxors lol!!!!11' way, but something to do with the thumbsticks.

I messed about, and I've decided that my new PStwo controller has much more return force on the sticks than both of my bosses' controllers (he's got a oldschool big one and a see-thru green one). In some way I must be used to this, because with the PS2 controller I can make fine adjustments with far less effort/attention than I can with the Xbox ones. I also have a shitty PC gamepad, and its got weak return springs too, and I have the same problem and have to jack down the sensitivity to get any kind of fine control.

So anyway, I was surprised such a small factor can have such a significant effect on play. I don't really like the 'two thumbs' control method, but every 'two thumb' FPS I tried (Perfect Dark, Halo, that awful Xbox Goldeneye) I found that it was easier to make fine movements without overcompensating, thus making me the 1337zor sn1pz0r (in Halo at least). Has anyone else experienced such overspecialisation in controller skills? Maybe 'I'm not used to this joystick' isn't such a lame excuse after all!

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2004-12-15 01:42am

Your boss plays games with you? On job?

Make a bet. "I work double shift this week if I lose, you give me a pay raise if I win..."

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2004-12-15 01:51am

Its better than that - its like 'Hmmm, lets see you heatshot after a six of Becks'

SPOOFE · Post by **SPOOFE** » 2004-12-15 02:24am

It took me forever just to get accustomed to recent console controllers, and then took me another forever to get pretty good with 'em. It's just a matter of practice, really... like the difference between baseball and tennis (yer whacking a ball with a glorified stick, but they're still two very different ways of doin' it).

Hell, I remember how much of a pain it was to get used to mouse 'n keyboard...

It sounds like Sony improved their gamepads for the PStwo? If not, then it's fascinating that you noticed an improvement, because I've always considered the PS2's joysticks to be less responsive, such as in the GTA games (sniping was a lot more inelegant). Maybe it was just the way developers programmed the games, but it seemed pretty universal in my experience.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2004-12-15 12:26pm

Personally, I found the GameCube controller the easiest to get accustomed to (well, it's better than the N64 controller at least

). My biggest complaint is that on the XBox and PS2 controllers...the buttons are the same size! It's especially bad on the XBox controllers because of the funky locations of the start-select buttons, and how they feel strange when you push on them. The GameCube however has different sizes/shapes of buttons, so you can tell with your fingers which one is which. Much easier to get used to.

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2004-12-15 03:56pm

Regardless of these silly next gen game controllers, everyone knows who the king of controllers really is. The N64 can't be beat. Perfect design, in my opinion. The joystick was where it need to be--though I will concur with Destructionator in that it was too flimsy, the all important Z was on the back like a trigger, the A, B and C buttons could all be operated nearly simultaneously with your thumb, the R was in a convenient spot. The only useless button was the L button. It never did anything.

Otherwise... gimme da PS2 controller anyday the week.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2004-12-15 11:47pm

*grin* I think 4 shoulders puts PS2 on top, since you can have four functions usable without leaving the sticks; my first Halo experience was an adventure in Lame, since to thwack you had to move your thumb from the look stick. With PS2 controller I've got shoot, nade type, flash and thwack on my shoulders.

Why the FUCK don't console games let you map controls per function/button? They always force you to choose between a few options, and this is most Lame in that horrible Goldeneye 2, where all the 8+ options do NOTHING but change the stick allocations and what L3 and R3 do. They never thought to just put in three options?

I've got further comments - I play Freespace, and my old Gravis stick doesn't work on my main puter (MB killed the Game Port star), so I tried a PC gamepad; its sucked for fine control. The PS2 controller is fine, and I'm probably going to stick with it. How can all these controllers be so different, particularly in something simple like the thumbsticks?

Oh and do any Xbox games use their shoulders like GC does, with pressing = function1, and clicking all the way = function2?

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2004-12-16 12:23am

The N64 was 'close' to perfect. Having two buttons that your practically don't use was pointless. The GC controller rocks. I love it, but I still feel they could have found a better mix between the N64 and GC, especially with the damn Z button.

I was just complaining about this the other day. It started with Ghost Recon 2. I couldn't find the controller config options to save my life. What pissed me off more was like a week later when I decided to go back and pick it up, when I made a damn profile then it let me. Don't ask. Was severely pissed. That's what I can't figure out now a days. Why the hell can't they make them fully customizable? The biggest kicker was back on the DC when Q3 came out, me and my friends played the hell out of it for the longest. When the PS2 version came out we were going to get it too. The most fucked up thing, on the DC you could put anything anywhere. PS2, pre assigned shit. Crawls all over my ass when you can't change your control settings. Even worse is when you use paripherals, i.e. steering wheels, or the like and can't make it fit the design of the hardware.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2004-12-16 12:26am

The Dreamcast control was damn near perfect. What the X-box controller should have been.

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2004-12-16 12:36am

We all thought the DC pad was perfect. I could have used a slightly larger one. I feel the same way here like I did about the N64/GC, something in between the DC and X controller. I like the ports on top of the controller, but I always hated that damned cord at the bottom.

InnocentBystander · Post by **InnocentBystander** » 2004-12-16 01:19am

Personally, I could never get the hang of console controllers. I opted for a
mouse and keyboard, and it works much better

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2004-12-16 09:46am

One day consoles will have a proper configurable input frontend, allowing you to use whatever for whatever. Then I'll play Perfect Dark and Halo PROPERLY. Watch the L4m0Rs cry 'hax' on all the k/m users

I actually don't like the DC/XB controller because of the 2 shoulder thing and the poor stick positioning. I liked the DC controller more than the original XB controllers tho; those black and white buttons were originally in a retarded place. XB controllers also seem to have the 'arms' bent outward too far, which hurts my hands after a while. The VMS ruled the Kasbah.

The GC controller is good; a little small, the C-stick is WAY too sensitive and has jack travel, and the z-trigger is terrible. Couldn't they just use a sensible 4-shoulder layout instead of hiding their 3rd shoulder in the Uncomfortable Zone?

Played Halo and drank again this afternoon; Halo is SO DAMN REPEDITIVE. I swear in 'control room' you fight through that ring with a room in the middle upwards of twenty times. For fuck.

Losonti Tokash · Post by **Losonti Tokash** » 2004-12-16 09:54am

Stormbringer wrote:The Dreamcast control was damn near perfect. What the X-box controller should have been.

Bah. The Xbox controller was the natural evolution of the DC. It was bigger, the triggers weren't as sharp, your thumbs didn't hurt after a day of Shenmue forcing you to use the D-pad, and the cord pointed toward the system instead of you.

And there is the break-away thing they built in. That's useful as hell.

Specialist · Post by **Specialist** » 2004-12-16 11:57am

I've always hated how viewing and movement is laid out in fps on consoles. I could never find a sweet spot.

Probably a good design is to use two thumb sticks one for movement and the other for viewing. Like the ps2, but put them were the d-pad and the 4 action buttons(square,triangle,?,?) are. Keep the 4 trigger buttons, but put 2 more under the bottom and the side so 4/5 fingers can be put to use while still moving and looking around.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman · Post by **Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman** » 2004-12-16 12:15pm

Praxis wrote:Your boss plays games with you? On job?

Make a bet. "I work double shift this week if I lose, you give me a pay raise if I win..."

Hey, my boss plays game with me too! And no, no such "if you don't let me win then better forget that promotion" threats.