Valkyria Chronicles

[Gurgeh]

I wonder has anyone here ever played the game before? I only have heard of it through the Youtube LP's and I have been wanting to play it ever since. Is this a good game? What do you think about it is it good or bad?


--Moved and cleaned. Lagmonster.

[Andrew_Fireborn]

I thought is was an interesting take on a strategy game, and an amusing Alternate WWII-ish story... until the Valkyria show up, anyway... Then it takes a turn for the ludicrous.

The sequel on PSP is... better game-wise, but the story is flat out, wall to wall anime cliches.

The third game (also PSP) is supposed to be vastly better, but SEGA doesn't seem willing to translate it.

[JonB]

VC is a good game. Andrew does have some accurate points, and I will elaborate that VC1 was an excellent study in how to do a turn based squad-shooter in the modern era (I'm looking at you, new X-COM). VC2 had deeper combat options, but suffered heavilly from being on the PSP and limiting the scale of combat; it's story leaves a lot to be desired, and takes some of it's background cues from the VC anime. Spoiler

Not to mention the utter waste of Welkin and Alicia *when they take up residence in the damn school* You get *one* half talk between Alicia and Alisse(sp) about what it means to be a Valkyria, and it's stupid. </venom> </sarcasm>

I agree that the story could have used some serious tightening up. As for VC3, I have heard that the import is in the works, but haven't played it myself. I have a friend that's played it in the Japanese, and he told me that it's taken the best lessons from VC1 and VC2 to make itself a good game. I'll pre-order it once it becomes available.

Is VC a good series? Yes. Is it a great game? YMMV, but if you have the option of renting it first, please do so and give it a try.

[Andrew_Fireborn]

Found the old thread.

[Vendetta]

Attention 2K: This is what your new X-Com game should play like.


Except it shouldn't have Avan. God he was a wanker.

[Stark]

I was under the impression the first game was technically unimpressive from a turn-based game perspective?

[Vendetta]

I was under the impression the first game was technically unimpressive from a turn-based game perspective?

It wasn't very well balanced. The guts of a good squad level TBS are there, tabletop wargame Infinity has the same order system, for instance (and has the same problem with it, but even worse), and the blend of turn based and real time does its job well. The specifics (of both games) however essentially push you down certain paths if you want to end up with a good mission rank (which is all based on completion time/turns).

If they tightened up the class and skills balance to the point where there was a valid argument for deploying any given class at any time rather than "but why would you use them instead of a Commando" it would be much improved. (VC3 lets you change any character to any class, sidestepping the issue that a good 75% of the roster is rendered useless by their class/skill combinations)

[Dread Not]

I was under the impression the first game was technically unimpressive from a turn-based game perspective?

It wasn't very well balanced. The guts of a good squad level TBS are there, tabletop wargame Infinity has the same order system, for instance (and has the same problem with it, but even worse), and the blend of turn based and real time does its job well. The specifics (of both games) however essentially push you down certain paths if you want to end up with a good mission rank (which is all based on completion time/turns).

If they tightened up the class and skills balance to the point where there was a valid argument for deploying any given class at any time rather than "but why would you use them instead of a Commando" it would be much improved. (VC3 lets you change any character to any class, sidestepping the issue that a good 75% of the roster is rendered useless by their class/skill combinations)

Have to agree with most of this, though personally I found the sniper class almost totally useless. In almost every circumstance it made more sense to send a scout to shoot the enemy up close and then run away, rather than use a sniper. Snipers have limited mobility, their shots often miss, and they usually won't take down a target in one shot if he is taking cover.

The RPG mechanics were also incredibly shallow. You just choose which of your five classes you want to upgrade, with no deep customization of any kind. There's more depth to picking your squad and equipment, but your squad can be swapped out at any time, and you always have enough money to buy every equipment upgrade. There are really no difficult, interesting choices to be made when it comes to character customization.

The enemy AI also really kept the game from delivering on its potential. Apart from the boss fights, the missions are fairly easy and straightforward, and offer very little in the way of tension (and the higher difficulty is sold as DLC for $5. Kiss my ass SEGA). There were numerous points where the enemy would have easily been able to crush me if they didn't just sit there until I was right in front of them. The game really should have included multiplayer to offer up more challenging scenarios.

Also, if you have ever been annoyed with the corny dialogue and story in a JRPG, Valkyria Chronicles has some of the most nauseating cutscenes to be found in a game. Thankfully they're beautiful to look at. The graphics and art style are probably the best thing about the game.

[Talk738kno]

I disagree about snipers being useless, their were pretty useful that one map you run across the desert, sitting on top of the cliff and picking off dudes reasonably well. I liked the story up to the part where Valkyria start turning for real.

[Dread Not]

I disagree about snipers being useless, their were pretty useful that one map you run across the desert, sitting on top of the cliff and picking off dudes reasonably well. I liked the story up to the part where Valkyria start turning for real.

Like I said before, I found it to be a more effective strategy to use scouts, or even shocktroopers to take enemies out across the map. If I'm thinking of the same map you are, it is no exception. Using scouts and troopers allows you to advance your units, and more reliably take down enemies. A sniper gets one shot, often misses without an order to boost accuracy, and may need multiple shots to kill an enemy if he is taking cover. It's just not an effective use of command points.

What bugged me about the story was just how cliche and predictable it was, especially after hearing how "risky" and "realistic" it was. Evil empire, persevering rebellion, star-crossed lovers blah blah, Spoiler

cue the irrelevant character getting killed off, cue the trusted friend's betrayal, cue the the trusted friend redeeming himself through (in this case totally unnecessary ) self-sacrifice etc.

Then you pile on the silliness of "Let's go to the beach!", the pig mascot... thing, "Here Welkin, have some bread," ugh. There are people who like the cheesy anime JRPG sort of thing, but I figure it doesn't hurt to warn off people who don't. I personally much prefer JRPG's that go a different route.

[Talk738kno]

Like I said before, I found it to be a more effective strategy to use scouts, or even shocktroopers to take enemies out across the map. If I'm thinking of the same map you are, it is no exception. Using scouts and troopers allows you to advance your units, and more reliably take down enemies. A sniper gets one shot, often misses without an order to boost accuracy, and may need multiple shots to kill an enemy if he is taking cover. It's just not an effective use of command points.

I disagree, because I recall in that map it was pretty much impossible to move your scouts to the 2nd base before enemy snipers where picking you off. Thus you need snipers of your own to pick them off to ensure a safe advance.

[JonB]

Or just hide behind the tank. Lancer's can't hit the broadside of the [end-game redacted] at that range, or in that weather.

After leveling up, after clearing out the first base, I would send a single scout out along the far right of the map. Alicia would come around and hit the enemies from the side, possibly taking the far camp all by herself.

IMHO, the most OP class were the Engineers, with Scouts a moderate second.

[Dread Not]

I disagree, because I recall in that map it was pretty much impossible to move your scouts to the 2nd base before enemy snipers where picking you off. Thus you need snipers of your own to pick them off to ensure a safe advance.

The disadvantages of using snipers goes for the enemy as well. Enemy snipers also often miss, and also have a hard time killing a unit taking cover. I haven't played the game in at least a year so it's difficult to recall the particulars of my strategy, but I can guarantee that I NEVER used snipers. There were plenty of places to take cover on that map, or even hide altogether. I'm pretty sure I used a strategy similar to JonB's, and recall being able to wipe out the final enemy outpost with Alicia alone. I was able to make it through the entire game with very little difficulty while never using snipers. And for the few points that I found challenging, like the first encounter with Maximilian and Selvaria, snipers would most likely have been of similarly little use.

Furthermore, I only ever said that the snipers were almost totally useless, leaving room for the tiny instances where they might serve a purpose. Even if using snipers in the mission in question is a more effective strategy, that's one mission out of what, 18-20 missions? Not to mention all of the side-missions.

IMHO, the most OP class were the Engineers, with Scouts a moderate second.

I found that every other class served their purpose fairly well, but I used troopers and scouts 90% of the time. I mostly only used engineers for their designated purposes of repairing and disarming mines, with any other tasks being secondary. I wouldn't really describe them as overpowered.

[CaptHawkeye]

I just couldn't take the game's atmosphere and writing. The game was trying to be absolutely serious about a war in some country while making everything cutesy and bright. I'm not asking for grrrr grimdark, but setting Band of Brothers in an episode of Pokemon just doesn't come out very well.

That, and the RPG mechanics were very linear and not terribly fascinating once you got through the surface.

[Covenant]

Really lousy game.

Played it, blew through 90% of the campaign in basically one sitting. I basically needed nothing except the tank. I called it the Tank RPG and I played it like Tank RPG, because this was the story of the Tank, the greatest piece of warmaking machinery ever, and everyone else was basically just there to make the tank look good.

The cutesy grim war thing didn't grate on me that much--I was able to accept it and move on--but I honestly didn't give a crap for anyone on my team once I realized they were nearly entirely useless. I found some of their little portraits and stuff cute, and I liked what bit of personality they provided, but I really didn't need anything except for engineers and my tank. Like, lots of engineers, and my tank. That's it. There was that one mission where I had to, like, blow up some obstructions or something but it was just a waste of my time because the big threat was totally not a threat. And then later there was like a big "oh no superhuman bad dude!" moment that I think I solved in one turn with the tank who was already sitting right there.

Like, if this game involves prominent uses of heavy armor, do not try to threaten me with small arms. I will simply roll over you.

The polish is good but the game itself is made for 9 year olds and I literally almost never deployed any unit to battle if I could send the tank there. The rare times when the Tank simply was not able to do the job solo I did send people in, and used a mix of soldiers simply because why not, but overall I felt it was an absurdly easy, absurdly short, and absurdly linear little game.

Overall, I vote "skip" on it. If you can buy it for cheap, sure, pick it up for a weekend's diversion and very light difficulty. Overall though... very poor showing. Nice art, but the game had no soul.

[Vendetta]

Really? My problem was quite the opposite, the tank was mostly useless because it took 2CP to do something that could all but invariably be done by something else in 1.

[Andrew_Fireborn]

The second game is actually hilariously broken if you get one of the Ace Turrets for the tank. Combined with the Light Tank B, you've got a super accurate, highly mobile slaughter machine that can kill pretty much everything in one hit and gets to shoot twice fairly often. [The B Chassis only takes 1 CP.]