Europa Universalis II

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-15 11:20am

HemlockGrey wrote:In other news, Navarre bitchslapping Castille, Aragon, and the Aquitane is a supremely amusing sight.

Basques forever!

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2003-06-15 06:51pm

Navarra is an excellent minor power to play because they have both french and iberian cultures (of course basque) and the ability to become France AND keep iberian! Three same-cultured CoTs!

This is what I can remember about minor European countries with multiple cultures:

Savoy has both french and italian.

Strasbourg has french and german.

Burgundy has both dutch and french but they have to deal with the Dutch Revolt events, too, for some reason.

Pommeren has german and polish, but that's pretty worthless.

Byzantium can gain Italian with the Union of the Churches event. This will essentially give them the same culture set as Venice.

The Duchy of Athens has french and greek.

The Knights have french and italian, can gain greek through an event, and lose it if they decide to take Malta (unlikely if they're human-played).

Little hint: England has french at the start and can retain this by preventing the End of the 100 y War event by at least owning their original provinces plus Picardie.

Be warned, if you want to play Gelre or Friesland and unite the dutch provinces you cannot become the Netherlands itself, and if they exist (revolted from Austria, France, or Spain because you didn't get the provinces) then you will be forced to give your country to them, ending the game for you.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-23 11:58pm

Bwahah! It's 1434, and Naples is on the rise.

After I bitchslapped Aragon and took Sicily, I settled down for one or two years of relative peace, bloody revolt supression, and tax-collector-building.

Then the Papal States foolishly declared war on me, bringing Siena, Tuscany, and Bologna into the fight. This was a rather large mistake.

Genoa dishonored my alliance(their day will come), but Savoy and Modena honored it- and actually helped me a bit, by siphoning off Tuscany and Bologna's 15K armies.

Well, I took out a loan, hired up some mercenaries and built some more cavalry. After this, my land tech fortunetly went up(to 2! Halilujuah!), so I embarked on a mission to kick the Pope's holy ass.

It went well. As of now, Marche is now a province of the Kingdom of Naples, and the Papal States(reduced to Rome) is now a Neapolitan vassal.

Now, next move- let my 7 BB points cool off, and once they're down to a more managable level, I'll see who will be the next to die. Aragon still has Malta and Corsica, which both look pretty tempting. Tunisia has Cyprus, which may soon declare independence, and Venice has it's little Mediterranean island empire. Perhaps I should bring the rest of the pennisula under the banner of Naples before expanding into the waters.

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-24 01:28am

HemlockGrey wrote:It went well. As of now, Marche is now a province of the Kingdom of Naples, and the Papal States(reduced to Rome) is now a Neapolitan vassal.

Does that mean he's down to just Roma, or does he still have a strip across the whole peninsula? I would have put off vassalizing him until the next war when I reduced him to a single province (it is NOT worth the hassle of taking and holding Rome... believe me

)

Now, next move- let my 7 BB points cool off, and once they're down to a more managable level, I'll see who will be the next to die. Aragon still has Malta and Corsica, which both look pretty tempting. Tunisia has Cyprus, which may soon declare independence, and Venice has it's little Mediterranean island empire. Perhaps I should bring the rest of the pennisula under the banner of Naples before expanding into the waters.

I'd say you should wait until you've got a land-route to bitch-slap Venice before you start going for the Mediterranean islands. Then again, I was always more familiar with the land combat.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-24 01:44am

Does that mean he's down to just Roma, or does he still have a strip across the whole peninsula? I would have put off vassalizing him until the next war when I reduced him to a single province (it is NOT worth the hassle of taking and holding Rome... believe me )

In the AGC, the Papal States have Roma and Marche(which is the strip). So yeah, he's down to just Roma, and force-vassalized. I might have been able to continue the war and extract concessions from Tuscany, Bologne, and Siena, but decided not too. For one thing, Bologne and Siena are vassals of the Papal States(so no force-vassalizing them), neither has much money, Modena was about to fall to Tuscany, and Tuscany still had 8K troops.

I'm not yet sure how I'll go about getting Siena and Bologne. Hopefully they'll break their vassalizations with the Papacy and let me force-vassalize(and eventually diploannex) them, but I might be forced to do a military annexation at one point(I still have over 380 years to work with, though).

Definate diplovassalization(and eventual diploannexation) for Modena and Savoy down the road. After the Grand Dissolution of the Italian Alliance(every single alliance of every Italian state save Venice expires in 1442) I'll see if I can get Milan and Genoa into the alliance fold. If not, Genoa has Sardinia, which is wide open to attack...

I'd say you should wait until you've got a land-route to bitch-slap Venice before you start going for the Mediterranean islands. Then again, I was always more familiar with the land combat.

Probably a good idea; it'd also cut off their major port and main source of reinforcements. They annexed Mantua early on, so all I have to do deal with Bologne somehow and I can invade by land.

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-24 02:05pm

HemlockGrey wrote:I'm not yet sure how I'll go about getting Siena and Bologne. Hopefully they'll break their vassalizations with the Papacy and let me force-vassalize(and eventually diploannex) them, but I might be forced to do a military annexation at one point(I still have over 380 years to work with, though).

Hmmm... don't the Neapolitan monarchs have poor DP ratings? That could make diploannexation more difficult.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-24 03:24pm

Hmmm... don't the Neapolitan monarchs have poor DP ratings? That could make diploannexation more difficult.

Pretty much, yeah. Giovanna/Joanna II is a sucky-ass monarch all around. Rene de Anjou and Alfonso V are the only decent ones. However, if you chose to remain independent of Aragon(which I certainly will) I'm not sure if you get Alfonso V.

That said, there are other ways of ensuring a successful diploannexation. If I control way more provinces, have a much bigger army, troops stationed in their capital, their monarch has poor DP, etc. etc, shouldn't be *that* hard.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-24 08:52pm

Another weird fluke; Muscovy got smacked down, so northern Russia looks really bizarre. One-prov Muscovy, two-prov Tver(they annexed Pskov), and a monster Suzdal(annexed Ryazan, took Olonents, Archangelsk, and one of Muscovy's provinces).

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-24 09:28pm

HemlockGrey wrote:Another weird fluke; Muscovy got smacked down, so northern Russia looks really bizarre. One-prov Muscovy, two-prov Tver(they annexed Pskov), and a monster Suzdal(annexed Ryazan, took Olonents, Archangelsk, and one of Muscovy's provinces).

Suzdal might have the chance to become Russia.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-24 09:55pm

Well, Muscovy's now out, having been annexed by Tver...

Raptor 597 · Post by **Raptor 597** » 2003-06-24 11:43pm

Think a Prussian campaign of conquest would be nice? I finished my Spain game and what time eras is good for Prussia to begin with?

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-25 01:20am

Captain Lennox wrote:Think a Prussian campaign of conquest would be nice? I finished my Spain game and what time eras is good for Prussia to begin with?

If you want to play as Prussa the great, I'd wait until some time in the 16th century. If you want to play from 1419, be Brandenburg--you eventually get an event to become Prussia.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-25 10:33pm

Geez, Brandenburg just got smacked down in my game by ORLEANS of all people...the world has gone mad...

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2003-06-25 10:36pm

HemlockGrey wrote:Geez, Brandenburg just got smacked down in my game by ORLEANS of all people...the world has gone mad...

I never had any funny stuff in my games.

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-26 11:50am

HemlockGrey wrote:Geez, Brandenburg just got smacked down in my game by ORLEANS of all people...the world has gone mad...

???

HOW? How did Orleans even move it's armies to Brandenburg?

The craziest thing that ever happened in my games was when I was playing a Timurid-to-Moghul game. During the four centuries I was spending in Persia and India, some whacked stuff happened.

Austria was annexed by Bavaria, who incidentally became the largest state in Germany.
Navarre became France.
Denmark had significant North African holdings.
Iberia became a patchwork of small warring states (Aragon, Castile, Catalonia, Granada [!!], Portugal) who were all dominated by Navarre/France. BASQUES FOREVER!
The Ottoman Empire was the beast of Eastern Europe, consuming everything between the Persian border and Bayern (including Italy, much of Poland, etc.) I guess this is what happens when there is no Austria to stop them?

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-26 12:48pm

HOW? How did Orleans even move it's armies to Brandenburg?

It has military access treaties up the wazoo, and it had taken a province or two away from one of the French states. Very, very weird. I'm half-expecting the Dutch to eventually be elected Holy Roman Emperor.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-26 10:18pm

Well, just got out of a long, hard, exhausting war with Austria. Took Istria, so it was fairly rewarding. Savoy did most of the work, defeating half of Austria's armies and conquering Lombardia/Milan, Tirol, and Steiermark. However, they got nothing. Whiners.

I also spent about a half-hour running around smacking down revolts in Sicily and Istria(thank God for military access through Bologne and Venice)

I have a loan to pay off, and then it's time to butter up Modena for diplovassalization. Bologne and Siena are unwilling to break their vassalship with the Pope, so I may have to diploannex the Papal States(wince) and then release them as vassals again in order to achieve the desired effect.

Oh, and I decided to remain independent from Aragon. After all, I beat their asses in a war not thirty years ago, I need all the money I can get, and I have rather malevolent designs on Sardinia.

At some point in the future(possibly after a vassalization or diploannexation of Modena) a war with Austria might be prudent to conquer Milan, assuming they haven't declared independence by then(they're on the verge of doing it). Barring that, it might be a good idea to go to war with Venice and take over Mantua from them, although I think I shall leave the Greek isles alone for now.

In other news, Suzdal is now, bar none, the most powerful state in Russia. All it needs to do is go to war with Tver and take Moscow from them.

Oh, and Wallachia built up a nice little empire, but their government fell and most of their provinces declared independence. And the Roman Empire turned Catholic.

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2003-06-26 10:43pm

The Byzantines almost always turn Catholic, then go back. It's probability, but since Catholic (and then Orthodox) is the first (historical) choice, they choose it more often.

The Ottomans seem to do well when Austria isn't around. I played a "Unite Germany" game as Bavaria so I could destroy Austria quickly before they annexed Burgundy (which grew to their historical boundaries before being shredded by France), Bohemia and especially Hungary. Those two stayed into an alliance and managed to do some serious damage to my war efforts against the German minors and the evil Swiss Empire until Ultrapoland and the Ottomans decided to rip Hungary limb from limb. Before I quit, Hungary was gone to the Ottomans and Bohemia was left with their two Czech provinces (I took German, Poland took the other ones).

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-26 11:16pm

HemlockGrey wrote:It has military access treaties up the wazoo, and it had taken a province or two away from one of the French states. Very, very weird. I'm half-expecting the Dutch to eventually be elected Holy Roman Emperor.

Naples would become HRE before they did

Anyway, it's good to see that you're beating back the Austrian beast before it drips it's slavering maw all over sacred Italy.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-26 11:22pm

Yep; the Germanic barbarians will never overrun our beautiful lands.

BB is at 10. I'm going to let it cool down now for a bit.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-29 09:41pm

I nabbed Sardinia from Aragon, but Bologna refuses to be diploannexated. I'll get them eventually.

Genoa keeps dragging me into these long, worthless wars with the Golden Horde, Suzdal, the Ottos, and Algeria. Algeria is especially annoying since their fleets essentially rule the Mediterrenean.

Pablo Sanchez · Post by **Pablo Sanchez** » 2003-06-29 09:58pm

HemlockGrey wrote:Genoa keeps dragging me into these long, worthless wars with the Golden Horde, Suzdal, the Ottos, and Algeria. Algeria is especially annoying since their fleets essentially rule the Mediterrenean.

Genoa has stupid Kaffa and Kerch dragging them down, and I'd tell you to dishonor the alliance, but you (probably) need their naval assistence too much to do it.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-29 11:17pm

Bwahaha! Hail Naples! Both Bologna and Modena have been diplo-annexed, and Siena has been vanquished by my victorious armies and absorbed into my glorious kingdom!

Only Genoa, Venice, and Austria stand in my way. Hmm.

Genoa controls Kerch(lost Kaffa to the Golden Horde), Liguria, and Corisca, so it's done a so-so job of holding onto it's original territories. It hasn't conquered anything either, but it does have a few trading posts or colonies in Arabia or Africa(or so I infer from the little settler icons sailing down that way). Buuut...they've vassalized Savoy, which has one Italian province, and they've got huge armies, and they're in my alliance. A difficult nut to crack, probably the last one to go.

Venice, evidently, also has some colonial possessions in Arabia or Africa. They hold Mantua and the extremely lucrative Veneto CoT, so they're certainly worth taking. However, Dalmatia and the Greek isles are all wrong-religion, wrong-culture provinces, and I can only release Crete as vassal(I think), and I'd need to take over and pacify all those islands in order to annex Venice proper. Plus, they have an alliance with a bunch of Slavonic states. They'll die second.

Austria has Milan, it must be liberated. They have inherited Hungary or Bohemia yet, but they diploannexed Helvetia. However, I've beaten them in a war before(winning Istria) so I think I can take them on long enough to nab Milan.

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2003-06-29 11:19pm

That's weird, Venice always has the money to convert every the Greek islands to Catholic in my games, but it usually takes them until the late 1500s.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-06-29 11:21pm

Yeah, so far it's only mid-1480's.