Starcraft 2 discussion thread

[Hawkwings]

I doubt they would have left a wounded Tychus there to die. Either Raynor killed him, or injured him and they took him along. Or maybe Raynor injured him and Mengsk finished the job. I don't think Tychus is finished with, but I seriously doubt he'd come back as an enemy. Then again, I'm halfway expecting it too, just because of the way they did that cutscene.

[Thanas]

I doubt they would have left a wounded Tychus there to die. Either Raynor killed him, or injured him and they took him along. Or maybe Raynor injured him and Mengsk finished the job. I don't think Tychus is finished with, but I seriously doubt he'd come back as an enemy. Then again, I'm halfway expecting it too, just because of the way they did that cutscene.

Raynor killed him. The official campaign screen notes that he is dead.

[KrauserKrauser]

Having played a bunch of single player skirmishes to get used to the units I was left a tad bit unimpressed.

Having looked into Multiplayer, especially Co Op against the computer, I am enjoying very much now. Pisses me off sometimes when I playing as Protoss start defending the chokepoint while the Terran player just builds bunkers inside his base. Sigh.

[Pelranius]

I doubt they would have left a wounded Tychus there to die. Either Raynor killed him, or injured him and they took him along. Or maybe Raynor injured him and Mengsk finished the job. I don't think Tychus is finished with, but I seriously doubt he'd come back as an enemy. Then again, I'm halfway expecting it too, just because of the way they did that cutscene.

Raynor killed him. The official campaign screen notes that he is dead.

That's didn't stop zombie infested Stukov though.

The first requires a rather obvious manipulation that I am sure Raynor's people would have found out. In which case you already have lost your asset.

The second, Nova DID go along for the ride, however she might not have gotten there in time from the Hyperion, seeing as how Raynor did not set back foot on it after landing on Char. And you really do not want to bring Ghosts on Char if Kerrigan is still there (psionic form and all that), though Nova might have pulled it off (Kerrigan is a class 8 standard ghost and a class 12 after her transformation. Nova is already a class 10 standard ghost, so in raw potential she should be able to beat Kerrigan, though clearly not after her transformation).

Raynor's Raiders already knew that Tychus's suit had a kill switch that would shut off his organs. They would have probably assumed anything else was courtesy of the Moebius Foundation.

As for Nova, I thought she only showed up on the Hyperion if one took her mission (which raises the bloody canon question again)

[Thanas]

That's didn't stop zombie infested Stukov though.

Yeah, but who would want to resurrect him and why would they acquire protoss nanites for him?

As for Nova, I thought she only showed up on the Hyperion if one took her mission (which raises the bloody canon question again)

Yes, she does.

Raynor's Raiders already knew that Tychus's suit had a kill switch that would shut off his organs. They would have probably assumed anything else was courtesy of the Moebius Foundation.

Really? You do not think "Bomb that takes out everything around it including ourselves" would raise a few more hackles than "Moebius got him by the balls"?

[Morilore]

It might be possible that the vast majority of them had already left and all that remained behind was a small outpost, which was then surprised. I mean, I can easily see the Zerg overrunning 2 or three Xel Naga ships.

Clearly the Zerg did not assimilate a lot of Xel Naga stuff anyway (despite what they claim) because if so, I cannot see how the Terrans and Protoss even stand a fighting chance.

Again: I do not see why it is necessary to conclude that the Xel'Naga are as powerful as the ominous portents make them out to be. I mean, we can anticipate that Blizzard probably will go that route, but back when they made the Protoss and Zerg those two races were both relatively primitive, so it's easy to see how they might have seemed god-like then without being able to take out the three races now (unless the XN advanced considerably since that time, which I admit is very plausible).

[Thanas]

It might be possible that the vast majority of them had already left and all that remained behind was a small outpost, which was then surprised. I mean, I can easily see the Zerg overrunning 2 or three Xel Naga ships.

Clearly the Zerg did not assimilate a lot of Xel Naga stuff anyway (despite what they claim) because if so, I cannot see how the Terrans and Protoss even stand a fighting chance.

Again: I do not see why it is necessary to conclude that the Xel'Naga are as powerful as the ominous portents make them out to be.

Why not? We already have enormously powerful artifacts, artifacts that can reverse the most sophisticated zerg mutation and fry a good deal of the Zerg within seconds. And that is just an abandoned relic of the Xel Naga. Everything we have seen of actual Xel Naga tech so far has been insanely powerful - and durable, their structures are still intact for thousands of years and still able to resist a lot of weaponry.

It is now up to you to show why these artifacts do not accurately resemble xel naga power.

I mean, we can anticipate that Blizzard probably will go that route, but back when they made the Protoss and Zerg those two races were both relatively primitive, so it's easy to see how they might have seemed god-like then without being able to take out the three races now (unless the XN advanced considerably since that time, which I admit is very plausible).

Given that the Xel Naga were able to make modifications on a scale none of the other races have ever managed back then I do not see your point.

[Serafina]

You know what would be good, regardless of how powerful the Xel'Naga are:
If they use their ability to create whole races to fight by proxy.

Yes, it's another ripoff from Warhammer 40K (the Old Ones did just that), but it is a good story element and still quite original.

[Pelranius]

That's didn't stop zombie infested Stukov though.

Yeah, but who would want to resurrect him and why would they acquire protoss nanites for him?

Actually, it was the Cerebrate Kaloth who 'resurrected' Stukov, which indicates that at least one Zerg figured out how to infest a human corpse with memories intact. So if Duran decides he needs a subordinate for (insert plot device reason) commanding the Hybrids (Maar seemed to be fine) but Blizzard might think infested Tychus is more marketable (beats me, but I've seen plenty of crap from studios before).

Raynor's Raiders already knew that Tychus's suit had a kill switch that would shut off his organs. They would have probably assumed anything else was courtesy of the Moebius Foundation.

Really? You do not think "Bomb that takes out everything around it including ourselves" would raise a few more hackles than "Moebius got him by the balls"?

Doesn't have to be a bomb, could just be a way to cause Tychus's armor's power cells to overload, which doesn't necessarily have to show up a on scan. Well, I think I'll concede this point mostly because I have no idea how Terran power armor works.

[Thanas]

That's didn't stop zombie infested Stukov though.

Yeah, but who would want to resurrect him and why would they acquire protoss nanites for him?

Actually, it was the Cerebrate Kaloth who 'resurrected' Stukov, which indicates that at least one Zerg figured out how to infest a human corpse with memories intact. So if Duran decides he needs a subordinate for (insert plot device reason) commanding the Hybrids (Maar seemed to be fine) but Blizzard might think infested Tychus is more marketable (beats me, but I've seen plenty of crap from studios before).

Yeah, I know, but infesting Tychus...what's the point? His arc is done and I really do not think he would bring much to the table now, especially considering the mass of secondary characters already. Far better to focus on the principals now.

Doesn't have to be a bomb, could just be a way to cause Tychus's armor's power cells to overload, which doesn't necessarily have to show up a on scan. Well, I think I'll concede this point mostly because I have no idea how Terran power armor works.

Power cells do not really work that way. Even if he had a fusion reactor in there, it probably is so miniscule that there is no guarantee it will take out anybody else.

Besides, the minute he finds out about this you lose your asset, so why take the chance?

[Pelranius]

Yeah, I know, but infesting Tychus...what's the point? His arc is done and I really do not think he would bring much to the table now, especially considering the mass of secondary characters already. Far better to focus on the principals now.

It's just that after Blizzard milked everything alive and dead for World of Warcraft, I'm afraid they'll carry that practice into the Starcraft universe because of "marketing principles" about using recognized characters people feel a 'connection' to. (Certainly Starcraft isn't a MMORPG by any means. But never underestimate the power of the marketing department to FUBAR things. And that stupid Overmind retcon is really getting at me. I can understand the Dark Voice corrupting the Overmind, but the Overmind using Kerrigan as an 'escape' is ridiculous). Hopefully it won't come to pass.

[Thanas]

It's just that after Blizzard milked everything alive and dead for World of Warcraft, I'm afraid they'll carry that practice into the Starcraft universe because of "marketing principles" about using recognized characters people feel a 'connection' to. (Certainly Starcraft isn't a MMORPG by any means. But never underestimate the power of the marketing department to FUBAR things. And that stupid Overmind retcon is really getting at me. I can understand the Dark Voice corrupting the Overmind, but the Overmind using Kerrigan as an 'escape' is ridiculous). Hopefully it won't come to pass.

Not really an escape I think, more of a hail mary pass with a low chance of success.

[Morilore]

Why not? We already have enormously powerful artifacts, artifacts that can reverse the most sophisticated zerg mutation and fry a good deal of the Zerg within seconds. And that is just an abandoned relic of the Xel Naga. Everything we have seen of actual Xel Naga tech so far has been insanely powerful - and durable, their structures are still intact for thousands of years and still able to resist a lot of weaponry.

It is now up to you to show why these artifacts do not accurately resemble xel naga power.

You're right, I wasn't thinking of that. *Sigh* I just wish things were a teensy bit more original.

[Guardsman Bass]

Why not? We already have enormously powerful artifacts, artifacts that can reverse the most sophisticated zerg mutation and fry a good deal of the Zerg within seconds. And that is just an abandoned relic of the Xel Naga. Everything we have seen of actual Xel Naga tech so far has been insanely powerful - and durable, their structures are still intact for thousands of years and still able to resist a lot of weaponry.

It is now up to you to show why these artifacts do not accurately resemble xel naga power.

You're right, I wasn't thinking of that. *Sigh* I just wish things were a teensy bit more original.

To be fair, they never actually seemed to use this power to defend themselves, even when it resulted in their deaths. They left Aiur after the Protoss killed a bunch of them in a surprise attack, and they got eaten by the Zerg after failing to defend against their attacks (this was a Zerg Swarm who had only recently absorbed creatures that were capable of space travel). Overall, they come across as this really pacifistic race (which makes you wonder why the story has them engineering the next group of Xel'Naga out of two very aggressive and violent races).

[Zixinus]

Finished the game.

To me, Raynor's motivations were always a bit stupid when it was mentioned that the artifact could make Kerrigan human again. Did he really think that after abandoning her for dead and then taking away enormous power from her by destroying all the Zerg she had, they she would be thankful and then cuddle up to Jim just like that? What was he thinking? Why didn't Raynor try to get contact with Zeratul or the other Protoss to figure more thing out?

I mean, she should be really fucking pissed when she gets around.

Power cells do not really work that way. Even if he had a fusion reactor in there, it probably is so miniscule that there is no guarantee it will take out anybody else.

It could be simply a dose of poisons that go into his life-support system. Or his life-support system is hooked to his mayor organs or something.

It's just that after Blizzard milked everything alive and dead for World of Warcraft, I'm afraid they'll carry that practice into the Starcraft universe because of "marketing principles" about using recognized characters people feel a 'connection' to. [...] Hopefully it won't come to pass.

What world do you live in to think that they won't? They're gonna milk the shit out of the franchise until everyone is sick of it and nothing less.

[Thanas]

Finished the game.

To me, Raynor's motivations were always a bit stupid when it was mentioned that the artifact could make Kerrigan human again. Did he really think that after abandoning her for dead and then taking away enormous power from her by destroying all the Zerg she had, they she would be thankful and then cuddle up to Jim just like that? What was he thinking? Why didn't Raynor try to get contact with Zeratul or the other Protoss to figure more thing out?

I mean, she should be really fucking pissed when she gets around.

Well, first of all, Raynor did not abandon her. It is canon that he was trying to get to her, but could not get through. Then, finally, Kerrigan the Zerg queen manufactured by the Overmind would be pissed. Kerrigan the human however, by all indications, clearly did not want to become the Queen of Blades.

It could be simply a dose of poisons that go into his life-support system. Or his life-support system is hooked to his mayor organs or something.

Did you miss the cutscene where they say the latter is true?

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

Ok.. I'm a little stuck with the Supernova mission. Does anyone know where all the Protoss artifacts are? I can only find 3 and I can't find the 4th one.

Not least... I still haven't figured how best to crack the main base. Should I grind my way through their defences or?

[White Haven]

Banshees and Vikings, with Science Vessels one step behind if you've got them. Banshees will crater anything on the ground, Vikings will snipe those scouts out of the air in a hurry and can land to finish off buildings once the ground defenders are read. Science vessels to keep everyone alive while doing it. As for the relics, just keep flying air units around through black areas until you find 'em, I don't remember exactly where they are. They're all in those little blue-runed circles, although IIRC there's one circle with no artifact.

[Thanas]

Ok.. I'm a little stuck with the Supernova mission. Does anyone know where all the Protoss artifacts are? I can only find 3 and I can't find the 4th one.

I mastered all the achievements, so if anybody else wants to ask me, just go ahead.

The fourth artifact is in the lower right corner, just below the main base. I am guessing that is the one you have not found. There also is one right in the southern edge of the middle part of the map (almost below the protoss base you take for first relocation).

Not least... I still haven't figured how best to crack the main base. Should I grind my way through their defences or?

Supernova is real easy if you do the following (it works even on Brutal):

a) Forget producing banshees - too expensive.
b) Get a second or third barracks
c) Start pumping out masses of siegetanks, marauders, marines and medics (advanced medics upgrade is a plus, for it allows you to dual produce medics with a reactor).

As soon as you got mass units (120 or so), get rolling.


The way to find the last artifact and destroy the vault is to go through the lower right protoss base. It is lightly defended, allows you easy to the fourth artifact and has a backdoor entrance to the Xel Naga shrine. You will have to deal with a few high templars and psi storms (this is where medics come in for they will allow your forces to survive and just push through these) but you will be just below the vault, which you can easily destroy with your siegetanks.

Do not try to attack the main base with banshees on hard or brutal level - for they will get killed quickly by the Protoss flyers and numerous detectors.

Banshees and Vikings, with Science Vessels one step behind if you've got them. Banshees will crater anything on the ground, Vikings will snipe those scouts out of the air in a hurry and can land to finish off buildings once the ground defenders are read. Science vessels to keep everyone alive while doing it. As for the relics, just keep flying air units around through black areas until you find 'em, I don't remember exactly where they are. They're all in those little blue-runed circles, although IIRC there's one circle with no artifact.

Have you tried this on brutal?

[White Haven]

Nope, not that much of a masochist. Not quite, at any rate. As for Banshees, that's why you use range-boosted Vikings as top cover for them. Protoss fliers try to vector in and just get splashed by extreme-range AAMs.

[Thanas]

Nope, not that much of a masochist. Not quite, at any rate. As for Banshees, that's why you use range-boosted Vikings as top cover for them. Protoss fliers try to vector in and just get splashed by extreme-range AAMs.

The problem is that with all the photon cannons, your banshees are going to get introduced to psi storms, stalkers etc. fairly quickly.

[Hawkwings]

I only played this on normal, but I went with the tried-and-true method of 3 or 4 siege tanks backed up by a mass of marines, marauders, and a couple goliaths. I had two of these groups pushing eastward, one on a northern route and one on a southern one.

Oh, the marauder stun upgrade is bomb. Get it.

[Zinegata]

Ok.. I'm a little stuck with the Supernova mission. Does anyone know where all the Protoss artifacts are? I can only find 3 and I can't find the 4th one.

Not least... I still haven't figured how best to crack the main base. Should I grind my way through their defences or?

This is the one with the wall of fire, yes? If you took the Hercules option (which helps a lot when you're migrating bases), consider a massive drop operation on the main objective.

[Thanas]

Also:

If you play on Brutal or Hard, getting the Psi Disruptor is a must for the final missions.

[houser2112]

What is the DRM situation with this game? The people here are saying that it not only must authenticate on install, but every 30 days thereafter. Can someone clarify?