Nintendo fanboys get served a healthy meal of cock.

[Resinence]

I thought that was more or less the whole point of the Wii from the very beginning - rather than chase after Microsoft and Sony in their never-ending race to see who can build the most powerful graphics and gaming engines, they'd try to hit a different market. It's no real surprise if most of the games they put out as a result of this are not exactly exciting to the 18-25 year old gamer demographic.

Your right, but what we are saying is that nintendo skimped way too much on hardware, yeah, they didn't need to compete. But they DID need CAPABLE HARDWARE, and what they gave the developers to work with is just so amazingly pathetic. Simply installing 40mb more graphics ram and 64mb more system ram would have given developers a capable platform that they can write modern software on, without resorting to archaic programing tricks the likes of which are rarely seen outside embedded systems. But yeah, you CAN write good games for the wii, if your nintendo and know it's internals like the back of your hand. The best anyone can expect to see is maybe just above ps2 graphics, which is fine really. It's not about the games not appealing to the 18-25 demographic, everyone knows that's not their target. It's about no one making games for the wii except nintendo, for all of the console sales success, everyone pretty much already owns all of the worthwhile games and there aren't any real new good ones planned.

[Stark]

Yeah, another 80ish graphics memory, architecture that didn't limit tex size, and actual GPU effects (like AA, post, etc) would have kept the Wii being cheap as shit but made it look less like a PS1. If it was an 'experiment' it kinda makes sense, to limit their potential loss, but as a flagship console it just isn't enough and they cut too many corners.

[bilateralrope]

This link (from the post on vgcats.com) says that Nintendo is "not using E3 to speak to the core gamer anymore". So how do you get anything more from that than them saying that they won't use E3 to advertise to one segment of their market ?

So unless there is some more information I'm not aware of, it just looks like people are complaining because Nintendo is trying to get new people with their advertising, instead of advertising to people who probably will buy the games anyway. Though people jumping to the wrong conclusion, then having their conclusion taken as fact won't be helping.

[Vendetta]

They've also said that their E3 showing this year was the entirety of their lineup for this winter.

Really, the only thing that's happening here is that Nintendo found a new market, and all the people who liked them for what they did in the old market are all butthurt about it, despite being thrown a bone every now and again like Mario Galaxy and Smash Bros.

Your right, but what we are saying is that nintendo skimped way too much on hardware, yeah, they didn't need to compete. But they DID need CAPABLE HARDWARE, and what they gave the developers to work with is just so amazingly pathetic.

The Wii hardware is quite capable of doing what Nintendo want it to. Turns out what they want it to do is graphically simple games with unique control schemes, rather than play the kind of games everyone else is playing. And they've managed to convince a significant number of people that that's what they want as well.

[Shroom Man 777]

Goddamn it, those whores! Goddamn I wish I bought a 360 instead

[MKSheppard]

If it was an 'experiment' it kinda makes sense, to limit their potential loss, but as a flagship console it just isn't enough and they cut too many corners.

Yeah. I mean, the present price of it -- $319 from Amazon.com; and I get a game system that's got crap graphics? Fuck that. For $299 from Amazon, I can get the ZOMG XBOX 360 with a lot more third party titles and actual graphics -- now if Microsoft would only produce a third generation 360 Mark III that fixes the fucking burnup problems then I might look into getting one...

[Schuyler Colfax]

I could wait a year, there are enough good games out already to hold me over until them.

[Vendetta]

now if Microsoft would only produce a third generation 360 Mark III that fixes the fucking burnup problems then I might look into getting one...

The latest ones have pretty much got that sorted out. (It was the VGA chip that used to burn out, and they've now got a heatpipe going from that to the main fan airflow on the latest models, as well as a 90nm lower power consumption chipset)

[Shrykull]

So just to recap, Nintendo are a bunch of greedy profiteers who've stopped caring about their customers, Microsoft make crappy, unreliable consoles and only started caring about their customers when the shit hit the fan, and Sony are just plain crap. Clearly we need Sega to return and show everyone else how it's done!

Sega's said they won't make a new console, they will now only make games for other systems. It's too bad. Anyone ever play sewer shark? That game had really bad video quality but was fun. I had a boss who used to look like Commisioner Stenchler and say things he did "Like a a clean something, is a happy something"

[weemadando]

This link (from the post on vgcats.com) says that Nintendo is "not using E3 to speak to the core gamer anymore". So how do you get anything more from that than them saying that they won't use E3 to advertise to one segment of their market ?

So unless there is some more information I'm not aware of, it just looks like people are complaining because Nintendo is trying to get new people with their advertising, instead of advertising to people who probably will buy the games anyway. Though people jumping to the wrong conclusion, then having their conclusion taken as fact won't be helping.

OK, lets address this logically.

You are at a goddamn video gaming trade show. This is the show that is slavishly followed by the hardcore, which is covered by the specialist press and, in the case of this year, was NOT attended by many mainstream/non-specialist press. It was also NOT attended by retailers and general public who may have also provided some backing for this.

The issue is that they did a pitch that would have been perfect if Miyamoto had a spot on Oprah or Saturday Morning Disney or something like that, but was certainly not right for a show that is not attended by people who give two shits about Wii Music or another goddamn Animal Crossing.

[SAMAS]

now if Microsoft would only produce a third generation 360 Mark III that fixes the fucking burnup problems then I might look into getting one...

The latest ones have pretty much got that sorted out. (It was the VGA chip that used to burn out, and they've now got a heatpipe going from that to the main fan airflow on the latest models, as well as a 90nm lower power consumption chipset)

Oh they did?

Good. I've been holding off on getting one for that.

[Andrew J.]

You are at a goddamn video gaming trade show. This is the show that is slavishly followed by the hardcore

All video game news is slavishly followed by the hardcore; that's part of the definition of the term. It doesn't really matter when or where a game is announced, if it has "hardcore" appeal the Internet will get the word out to most of the people who care within a day or two. Do you really think any of the game announcements at Nintendo's 10/10 conference last year, for example, would have reached their target audiences any faster if they had been at E3 instead?

This whole issue has more to do with the suckiness of the new E3 than Nintendo itself. There just isn't much incentive anymore to make announcements at a time and place set by the ESA instead of one of your own choosing.

[Anguirus]

Oh, that is about Nintendo? I thought it was from him to his readers.

Quoted for win.

I don't have the money or the energy to buy the latest crap and marvel at the graphics. I have three kickass games for the Wii and I haven't even had time to finish those. I'm not a hardcore gamer, and if I was then yeah, I'd probably want a different system. I'm just a guy who likes his Smash Bros and hates reading unfunny bitchy comics.

[Bounty]

Iwata has come forward and said that Nintendo isn't trying to piss off the ZOMG 1337 hArDc0r3 crowd, they just didn't think the biggest titles were demo-worthy yet.

It also speaks volumes about the whiny kiddies that they don't consider Wii Music a "big title". Yeah, who wants a completely new take on a fresh genre when you can be fawning over Generic Space Marine Shooter XXVII: Now With More Cleavage?

[Losonti Tokash]

Because no one gives a shit about waving the remote around like an asshole while the game plays a midi of some game's theme song regardless of your movements.

[weemadando]

Iwata has come forward and said that Nintendo isn't trying to piss off the ZOMG 1337 hArDc0r3 crowd, they just didn't think the biggest titles were demo-worthy yet.

It also speaks volumes about the whiny kiddies that they don't consider Wii Music a "big title". Yeah, who wants a completely new take on a fresh genre when you can be fawning over Generic Space Marine Shooter XXVII: Now With More Cleavage?

I don't give a shit about a lot of Nintendo titles, but a lot of the complaints that have been levelled at them are legitimate.

- Animal Crossing looks the same as it did on the N64, Gamecube and DS.
- Wii Music showed like shit. Painful, a-tonal, pantomime shit. Maybe it's fun, but after that - I'm not sure if I want to see it again.
- Wii Motion Plus is the typical Nintendo "split the market" bullshit (read: memory packs in the previous generations).
- Leaking Pikmin news in a later interview, rather than even mentioning it in the main conference.

I am well and truly aware that Nintendo doesn't give a shit about my money, because they're more than happy taking money from my wife. My point, is that my wife and her friends, and her mother and her friends don't even know what E3 is, let alone follow it. So Nintendo missed their audience by doing the show that they did. And they don't care a bit because they still can't keep the Wii on shelves apparently.

[Vendetta]

- Leaking Pikmin news in a later interview, rather than even mentioning it in the main conference.

Even being able to say "Pikmin with the Wii remote" on stage at E3 would have been one shiny diamond in the dungheap of their E3 conference, rather than keeping it later and on it's own.

I suspect they kept it low key because it's early and not ready to show, but even saying the words would have helped.

[Straha]

It's worth noting that the winner of each console generation has been the one that has been able to appeal to the casual gamer. The 2600 and NES managed to do that by being new and rad, the PS1 opened up the market for more mature games, the PS2 got a lot of purchases purely for its DVD playing features, and the Wii's control scheme has been key to its success so far.

True. At a console level, the winner is always going to be the one with the wide sales base. Until now, that has always dragged the rest of the market with it.

At a publisher level, it's not as clear cut in this generation. The Wii, for example, has an attach rate of about 5, but only 27 games have sold over a million units, whereas the Xbox 360, with two thirds of the sales base, has 42 individual million selling titles and an attach rate of 7. (the total numbers for all games that have sold over a million on both platforms are within shouting distance of each other, but that does include the sales of Wii Sports, which is a pack in in two regions for the Wii, boosting it's numbers considerably, since in Japan, where it's not packed in, only about 50% of Wii owners buy it).

A publisher might look at those figures (and the other one, which is that of the top 15 selling Wii titles only three are not published by Nintendo, and one of those still has Mario in) and consider very hard whether they want a small slice of a big pie or a big slice of a small pie.

I've got to agree here. My girlfriend owns both an XBox 360 and a Wii. She turns on the Wii almost every day, but mostly to do stuff like "Everybody votes" or browse the Mii channel. She'll spend hours on it, especially since she bought the internet channel, but aside from ten bucks she spent downloading the internet channel and Super Mario Bros 3 I don't think she's spent any money on it since the purchase (she got a couple games for it from friends. But she never plays them.) By contrast she plays the XBox 360 maybe for an hour or two a week (except for when she has her Fable marathons,) but she has more than half a dozen games and is fanatical about quite a few of them, like Fable and Bioshock. If I were a developer given those odds I'd take the 360 (or even the PS3) over the Wii any day.

[Sephirius]

It also speaks volumes about the whiny kiddies that they don't consider Wii Music a "big title". Yeah, who wants a completely new take on a fresh genre when you can be fawning over Generic Space Marine Shooter XXVII: Now With More Cleavage?

Apologist bullshit; clearly you seem to have forgotten Rock Band or Guitar Hero, both of which make you look like far less of a tool when you play them.

But hey, if you want to look like you're having a seizure while something does the work for you, enjoy your RAVI DRUMMMMMMMMMMSSSS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lYgPDWFAQM


EDIT

- Leaking Pikmin news in a later interview, rather than even mentioning it in the main conference.

Even being able to say "Pikmin with the Wii remote" on stage at E3 would have been one shiny diamond in the dungheap of their E3 conference, rather than keeping it later and on it's own.

I suspect they kept it low key because it's early and not ready to show, but even saying the words would have helped.

Accurate Representation of the Above in Comic Form:
http://fanboys-online.com/index.php?comic=290

[Bounty]

Apologist bullshit; clearly you seem to have forgotten Rock Band or Guitar Hero, both of which make you look like far less of a tool when you play them.

Are you seriosuly arguing that a plastic guitar is worse than an imaginary saxophone?

[Sephirius]

Apologist bullshit; clearly you seem to have forgotten Rock Band or Guitar Hero, both of which make you look like far less of a tool when you play them.

Are you seriosuly arguing that a plastic guitar is worse than an imaginary saxophone?

At worst, a plastic guitar makes me look like a cock, a wiimote saxophone makes me look like I'm sucking one.

[Uraniun235]

but but but but casual gaming!!! wave of the future! fuck all those fucking lifeless fucking loser fucker "hardcore" gamers!!!


right? RIGHT???!!?

[Uraniun235]

also jesus christ VGcats keeps getting worse

[CaptainZoidberg]

What Nintendo does that other companies consistently fail to do is make games that appeal to both novice gamers and experts. Case in point: Super Smash Brothers Melee. There's an extremely sophisticated array of advanced tactics and techniques, yet the game still appeals to simple button mashers.

I can't say that much about Bioshock...

Also, for those critisizing the Wii on technical merits: what would be the advantage for games like Smash Brothers or Wind Waker. How much better does Mario really look on more advanced hardware? What's the advantage to giving him a few million more polygons?

[Losonti Tokash]

I can't say that much about Bioshock...

And? Did you forget that Bioshock was awful? Maybe you can tell us how great Nintendo is by comparing Zelda to Daikatana.

Also, for those critisizing the Wii on technical merits: what would be the advantage for games like Smash Brothers or Wind Waker. How much better does Mario really look on more advanced hardware? What's the advantage to giving him a few million more polygons?

You're right, for those games there is no need for improved graphics. Of course then you look at all the third party games on the Wii which look like total ass. Or the games that just plain don't make it there because it simply can't run even scaled down versions.

There's a damn good reason that the Wii version of Rock Band is a port of the gimped PS2 version, and it has everything to do with the Wii's hardware.